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administrator Site Admin Joined: 15 Nov 2003 Posts: 48 |
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2004 12:24 pm Post subject: |
ifegenia has been invited to contribute to this exclusive forum. By way of an introduction, I have copied below a post made by ifegenia in the general forum. A warm welcome to ifegenia. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ifegenia's post: Hi Paul, thanks for appreciating logic! I was a BK for a few years. Went to murli every morning, meditated at 4:00 am, went to India a few times, did a lot of service at the center and stayed long enough to see and experience much hypocritical and cruel behavior especially amongst so called senior sisters. I gradually weaned myself away from the BKs because of that cruelty. Over and over again I saw them ostracize and shun different members for one reason or another. Perhaps they thought it kept everyone else in line. Nothing is better than this type of experience to teach one about the dangers of authoritarian cults. The focus in the group was always on one's "status" or "number." After visiting India, and discovering how deeply ingrained the concept of one's status or caste is in the culture, I began to see why they attracted so many followers there. Perhaps many lower caste Indians felt they could escape their low status in society by joining the BKs and finally be considered a Brahmin. Of course in their minds, because of the indoctrination---as the "true" Brahmnins. I still meditate every morning. I did not throw out the baby with the bath water. I had some profound experiences in Madhuban and don't regret the experience, although the constant focus on "destruction" and all the gloom and doom ---- well, really started to become very depressing.
Atma Joined: 26 Feb 2004 Posts: 98 |
Posted: Wed May 12, 2004 6:22 pm Post subject: |
ifegenia wrote:
Quote:
The focus in the group was always on one's "status" or "number." After visiting India, and discovering how deeply ingrained the concept of one's status or caste is in the culture, I began to see why they attracted so many followers there. Perhaps many lower caste Indians felt they could escape their low status in society by joining the BKs and finally be considered a Brahmin. Of course in their minds, because of the indoctrination---as the "true" Brahmins.
Having spent some time in India myself, I agree with that, except: have the BKs really attracted a substantial following in India? From what I have seen, read and heard, they have not - especially when one considers the length of time they have been making "effort" to wake up the Indians. I think that the overwhelming majority of Indians see them (BKs) as an oddball movement. The insistence on celibacy for everyone, whether married or not, is seen as unnatural. Also, the fact that they have western followers makes Indians think of them as another "milk the west" movement. I have heard Indians refer derisively to the western followers as "pseudo vaishnav". In other words, "fake Hindus". Most Indians are silent about them but I suspect that, deep down, they regard the BK "knowledge" as false. The fact that the "True Gita" which the BKs published years ago had to be withdrawn under protest means that orthodox Hindus don't want upstart new fangled movements messing with their faith and misrepresenting the content and context of their scriptures. ifegenia wrote:
Quote:
I had some profound experiences in Madhuban....
This interests me ifegenia. I am wondering if you would be comfortable sharing a bit of these experiences - in a general way that would not disclose who you are, of course. Were the experiences internal (in meditation, dreams, visions) or external (incidents with people, places etc)? Speaking for myself, I found that the most powerful place in Abu is (Brahma) Baba's hut. I had good meditation experiences there. Nothing spectacular....but good vibes. The many imposing buildings that they have built lack that power.
ifegenia Joined: 12 Apr 2004 Posts: 17 |
Posted: Thu May 13, 2004 5:59 am Post subject: |
Quote:
This interests me ifegenia. I am wondering if you would be comfortable sharing a bit of these experiences - in a general way that would not disclose who you are, of course. Were the experiences internal (in meditation, dreams, visions) or external (incidents with people, places etc)?
I really think that it is better to keep "experiences" to ones self. I think no matter when or where someone has an "experience" that is beyond "normal" consciousness --- it is really only relevant to the person having that "experience." I have only had a couple of these experiences in my life and they seem to be markers on the journey to realizing who we really are. Unfortunately, even though I had this experience on Mt. Abu -- I still witnessed much insensitivity and cruel attitudes and behavior from certain BK seniors -- mostly in a major center --- outside of India in a western country.
Atma Joined: 26 Feb 2004 Posts: 98 |
Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 12:53 pm Post subject: |
ifegenia wrote:
Quote:
I really think that it is better to keep "experiences" to ones self. I think no matter when or where someone has an "experience" that is beyond "normal" consciousness --- it is really only relevant to the person having that "experience."
ifegenia, thats fine. I understand. I think though that your statement is too broad. In his "Autobiography of a Yoga", which is a worldwide classic, Paramahansa Yogananda (someone I respect) revealed several wonderful internal and external experiences he had in his spiritual path. Many readers have been inspired and edified by reading those accounts. Anyway, from what you wrote I can glean that the experiences were "internal" (relating to consciousness). Too bad about the negative "external" experiences" that you also had. Peace
ifegenia Joined: 12 Apr 2004 Posts: 17 |
Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 3:26 pm Post subject: |
Atma wrote:
Quote:
ifegenia, thats fine. I understand. I think though that your statement is too broad. In his "Autobiography of a Yoga", which is a worldwide classic, Paramahansa Yogananda (someone I respect) revealed several wonderful internal and external experiences he had in his spiritual path. Many readers have been inspired and edified by reading those accounts.
Yes, I read "Autobiography of a Yogi" -- many times. I think one of the reasons that I don't like to "share" my experiences is because the BK teachers used to want everyone to share their experiences in front of the group after visiting Madhuban. Also after retreats etc. It seemed like BKs were earning brownie points the more their "experiences" gave proof of the elevated spirituality of the organization. It got to the point where it felt like many were embellishing their stories. It is not that I did not believe the experiences --- it is just that there definitely was an aspect of "pleasing" the seniors by telling these stories. BK senior sisters would then give preferential treatment to those that were really good apple polishers -- you know the ones that told the best stories --- and of course, recruited the most new BKs.
Atma Joined: 26 Feb 2004 Posts: 98 |
Posted: Sun May 16, 2004 10:10 am Post subject: |
Yes. I have witnessed this kind of charade many times. I like the term 'apple polishers'....LOL
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