Black people are the most impure - Dadi Janki

for ex-BKs to discuss matters related to experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
  • Message
  • Author
Offline
User avatar

primal.logic

ex-BK

  • Posts: 95
  • Joined: 15 May 2006

Black people are the most impure - Dadi Janki

Post06 Jan 2008

I heard Dadi Janki say this in morning class in London in the early '80's. This discussion was about the Law of Karma. Dadi put it succinctly - because black people seem to be suffering the most, they must have committed the most sins in past lives, therefore they must be the most impure.

It gives racism and predudice a whole new look! Black people are, by default, and all inclusively, the lowest of all - this according to Dadi Janki, the Head of the BKWSU!

But then we are talking about someone from a nation that created the caste system. Whose karma is that?

This subject came back to me when talking to a senior BK recently - we had discussed Cambodia and the reign of terror and murder inflicted by Pol Pot. (Pol Pot and his cronies murdered up to 3 million people of a population of 7 million from 1975 to 1978). He looked at me and said in amazement "what karma is that?" The implication of that question is "how impure the souls of Cambodians must be to suffer such a burden of karma". It has been some years since I left the BKs and had stopped thinking like that. I was appalled at the implication being made.

The irony is that it is the concept of karma that has enabled the oppression and exploitation in Cambodia (and in the BKWSU) since anyone can remember.

Briefly, when Cambodia was at its peak from 800 AD to 1400 AD it was the massively wealthy and powerful kingdom known as Angkor that dominated South East Asia. Angkor was a city of a million people when London was a town of 50,000. Typical of many past great kingdoms, it was built on slavery and exploitation of the masses - the peasants. This was achieved through religion.

Hinduism dominated ancient Cambodia before the rise of Bhuddism in the 1400's. In both cases the kings, who represented the pinnacle of the national religion, used the Law of Karma to suppress the masses into acceptance of the status quo. It was simple - the Kings case was - "I am wealthy beyond belief, I have health and power. According to the Law of Karma, I deserve this magnificence as a reward for my past, obviously meritorious, deeds. You, as slaves and peasants, live a life of suffering which is proof of your past, and obviously significant, sins".

No one could argue the case - their only education was in religion. They did not have the scope to argue. So they accepted it. And nothing has changed. In Cambodia til now, the presidents and politicians maintain the same line - "my position, power and good manners are all proof of my past merits, therefore I deserve to be here". And the peasants don't argue. Cambodians are famous for their benign acceptance of the status quo.

And the BKs are the same. Dadi Janki, Sister Jayanti etc etc are all 'obviously' more powerful souls because they still carry the good karma to achieve high positions in their religion, even after an entire cycle! And the masses - the BK peasants - accept the status quo. And Dadi Janki as their 'king'. And so they continue to be manipulated, controlled, exploited and enslaved. They give everything to their king and religion, and get nothing but promises.

Dadi has moved from her palace in Oxford, a place that was occupied once by the peak of English royalty, to her castle in Mt Abu, where the masses adulate her, bow at her feet and give her everything they have.

Welcome to the Cambodian Kingdom of the Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University, where once again the black people are enslaved to the Kings, where black is too impure to be accepted but more than okay to be exploited!
Online
User avatar

ex-l

ex-BKWSU

  • Posts: 9581
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2006

Post06 Jan 2008

I am reminded of my favorite Dadi Janki quotes, "we do not think about anything ... do not think too much".

Dadi Janki was awarded 'The Courage of Conscience Award' - Boston, USA, 6th June 2005 and is, apparently, a member of the United Nations' prestigious "Keepers of Wisdom". According to the BKWSU, "her own mind-body relationship has been a field of experimentation for her. So, her conclusion is that we don't need to think or analyze."

Mind you, they also said that, "Dadi Janki was one of the original 16 women Lekhraj assembled in 1937 to found the organization and forge its rapidly expanding vision of the future ... soon vesting control of his entire fortune and all administrative responsibility for the organization to those original 16 female students."

And that was not true either. We still have no evidence yet of any proper trust per se ... and if there was a trust controlling his wealth, how was Lekhraj Kirpalani able to offer to give it all away to the Indian Government in 1976 when Destruction was to happen? It would not have been his anymore to do so.
Offline

john morgan

ex-BK

  • Posts: 397
  • Joined: 06 Oct 2007

Post07 Jan 2008

Perhaps Dadi Janki's real point here was the where there is purity there is no suffering or where there is no suffering there is purity.

No one has made this point though it was not difficult for me to pick up. I suppose it all depends on what one is looking for. The philosopher Karl (I think) Popper talked about having a theory that all swans were black then trying to prove it even to the extent of ignoring white swans. Very often I ask myself what I am trying to prove. I also check my thought creation and frequently understand that it is not worthy of putting into action. I then go back to the drawing board and start from scratch.

Conclusions can be dangerous things. Using life to prove my theory can have pitfalls. Far better to remain open to what is new and create new ideas. Experimentation and observation are two components that are essential when seeking to improve ones life but when I use everything that comes to me to prove my pet theory, am I being fair to myself and others?
Online
User avatar

ex-l

ex-BKWSU

  • Posts: 9581
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2006

Post07 Jan 2008

I have no interest in pet theories either. Nor sustaining the myths. I just want to get to the irreducible facts.

This makes people uncomfortable, socially and personally uncomfortable. They try and take things off into the subjective by way of a defense mechanism. Somehow doing so engages their egos and they start to fight as the myths they have made the foundations of their realities, their social orders, are challenged.

Someone else on forum wrote that they thought Janki Kripalani was a charlatan. Others have mentioned how limited, or even hurtful, she could be and what she has been party too. For me, personally, I will watch with interests to see what she does with the Yagya but I wont expect miracles.

I appreciate for some she is important, they need to have someone "important" in their lives, and the Yagya sure as hell milks the old cow even yet; but for me she never really impressed me that much at all and all the cover up we have discovered, the more recent mishandling of events including the child protection and financial abuses does nothing to impress me.

But we will see ... its her shop now.
Offline

john morgan

ex-BK

  • Posts: 397
  • Joined: 06 Oct 2007

Post07 Jan 2008

The short time that I have visited this forum has been highly educational for me. For a long time I thought that I was the only one who had difficulty with this knowledge and with Raja Yogis.

But I hold no grudges or malice and feel that I understand the past much better now. Yes, I think that I was misunderstood but there again I did not even understand myself.

This forum is very necessary, no matter what time of the day or night I come here people are logged on. Most are guest users, possibly indicating that they wish to remain anonymous for some reason, I hope the reason is not fear not because I consider that a life that is love orientated is far superior to a life that is fear orientated.

Dadi Janki was a highly experienced person when I first met her and I have never seen her in a situation where she was in difficulty or at a disadvantage. Really I have very little insight into her even though at one time I had memorized her vocalised thought patterns quite well.

Improving sankaras can be both easy and / or difficult. The fact is that at morning class students are very often given strength to make effort that would otherwise be impossible.

The trend of banning students and trying to stifle free speech makes me wonder if i would like to resume the study which in fact I never left. Yes, there is a lot of pain here but if this forum can deal with matters that the Father, Teacher and Guru of all is unable to deal with that is good service. Bullying and the extraction of money from gullible persons I do not like but I was not there. Raja Yoga, in my experience equips one very well to deal with incidences of psychosis without psychiatry, we are warriors after all and some battles with our own nature are very worthwhile. It all depends on the person. Many people have suicidal thoughts at one time or another though suicide is always a mistake. VIP service - the quest for name and fame is interesting. I recall one Brother proudly announcing that BapDada had said that he would serve VIPs in future. Well, for me everyone is a VIP. I think that this is the case for BapDada also.

The Law of Karma seems to be a great leveller. Universal, no one is exempt. By becoming friends with this law one cannot help but improve ones life. All the BKs are doing is to show people what they really are and that is much closer to being like BapDada than many imagine or suspect.

All this from a comment from the 80's - interesting!
Online
User avatar

ex-l

ex-BKWSU

  • Posts: 9581
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2006

Post07 Jan 2008

john morgan wrote:This forum is very necessary, no matter what time of the day or night I come here people are logged on. Most are guest users, possibly indicating that they wish to remain anonymous for some reason, I hope the reason is not fear not because I consider that a life that is love orientated is far superior to a life that is fear orientated.

Nice post John, very kind and fair.

Yes, sadly, a lot of BK folks are afraid of it being known that they read or post here and it would make a difference to their BK careers. But eventually we will reach a critical mass where we are not only accepted but respected for what we are breaking through.

Even in the West, folks are being banished from BK centers JUST because they went and investigated what the PBKs are teaching, an academic was warned off and brickwalled for wanting to know too. I mean, a BKs or two can shag each other, or take "little holidays" from the Maryadas and sell Gyan, that is OK
    ... but knowledge is power and free discussion is much more dangerous and powerful.
Offline
User avatar

alladin

no label

  • Posts: 915
  • Joined: 27 Feb 2007

taking law in one's hands

Post07 Jan 2008

Sensitive matters have been brought up in this topic, such as; genocide, collective karma, and the cynical comment Primal Logic reported from a senior BK
"what karma is that?" The implication of that question is "how impure the souls of Cambodians must be to suffer such a burden of karma"

speaks volumes about the legalized cynicism of BK indocrinated people. We got accustomed to it, and we are not surprised as lokiks would! Philosophies and Universal Laws can be bent and misused to justify anything. So, the simple statement John Morgan made,
By becoming friends with this law one cannot help but improve ones life.

brings me back to ME and my responsibility, my conscience and the sense of feeling well and light within myself. After all, any negative thing I think, say or do which is harmful to others, harms me first and instantly, unless my conscience is dead and my third eye blinded.

There are ramifications in the BK teachings about Karma that I have been thinking about recently. One is "do not take the law in your hands". Banning people from centers or excluding them from service, (i.e. from reading the Murli, cooking, giving courses or seminars, etc.), or appointing them to do a service that maybe doesn't even reflect their specialities but a higher rank has decided that "for the cause" such a person should be used in some department, is definetely an action of "taking the law in your hands".

Such a slogan, can be artfully used to brainwash weak people so that within the organization, and in other walks of life, they become tamed and meek and do not react to any abuse. It's good to feel unburdened and think, "Well, Baba will fix it ..." but this can become an excuse for not being assertive or "masters". One ends up feeling that it is not royal to react or protest.

The outcome? An army of doormats, unable to speak up, unloving to the self and deprived from the power to face and more. Those in power decide who and when has to "merge" and "adjust" and "tolerate". I see no virtue in that.
Offline

peterbindi

PBK

  • Posts: 73
  • Joined: 03 Jan 2008

Black people are the most impure-dadi Janki

Post08 Jan 2008

That black people are the lowest of the earth has also been say by JOSEF RULOF, a Dutchman who was a medium for some soul's who speak some knowlege.

This is a occult Christian area.

Greetings, peterbindi.
Offline
User avatar

sparkal

BK supporter

  • Posts: 438
  • Joined: 04 May 2006
  • Location: Shivalaya

a whiter shade of pale

Post08 Jan 2008

We still await a, one, any worthwhile explanation as to why having a black body should make a soul more inferior?

If black people are closer to apes for example, then apes would be great musicians, as black people are. They are not. Birds are, but I cannot see any resemblance. We are still working on whales etc. The theory of evolution may only apply to certain people/types. Others may be declining at their expense (?).

If you really are at the bottom of the food chain, you may want to find someone to make lower than your self, as what may be going on with regards to our cold, non-loving, no compassion rulers. And besides, it depends on whether you have precious minerals, fuels etc under your land. Then there is religion and sacred spots which they may want to remove people from, the Fire of London comes to mind.

And who said that black people are black? Is it not the white people who are pale/white? If you go to Thailand, you can see the mess made as a result of the American and British soldiers having been there. One big brothel among Buddhist monasteries. They are working hard on religions which still give the knowledge of the soul. They don't seem to like that, because it empowers people.
Offline

john morgan

ex-BK

  • Posts: 397
  • Joined: 06 Oct 2007

Post08 Jan 2008

I am white skinned though I recognise that black people are genetically superior to me. This is because, in these days of global warming and thinning ozone layers, many rays that are harmful to white skinned people find their way through the earths natural defences. Coloured people (for no one is truly black) belong to a superior gene pool. They do not get sunburn and they have additional protection from the rays I mentioned earlier. They have evolved genetically and the fairer skinned races have yet to catch up. When we dig a little deeper than skin colour, and look at the soul, everyone is white no matter the colour of the skin. This has been seen in divine vision by certain yogis and yoginis.

At this time in our earth's history, there are many very successful coloured people in sport, medicine, religion and politics to mention just a few areas where this is true. Unfortunately some white persons react to this obvious superiority by falling back on the very passe, or outdated attitude, that they have a divine right to think themselves superior. Of course, many coloured people have seen this attitude and look kindly on people of fairer skin, this is most fortunate for we "whiteys" because some of them are world class BOXERS!

Cultured society tends to judge people (if at all) by the quality of the causes they create and hue of skin is not an issue.
Online
User avatar

ex-l

ex-BKWSU

  • Posts: 9581
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2006

Re: Black people are the most impure-Dadi Janki

Post08 Jan 2008

peterbindi wrote:That black people are the lowest of the earth has also been say by JOSEF RULOF

Yes, and Tiger Woods is only good at golf because of the 1/8th European blood in him. :shock: I do not know Josef Rulof but I am sure he has a hard time saying things like that, true or not. Did he say "lowest" spiritually evolved? I rather like the idea that different "soul groups", or races, have slightly different colors (Something the beakies have ven tried to capitalise on even thought it is not in there Gyan).

I agree that BKWSU folks do and did make statements like the above and it goes along with other regarding, e.g. the Jews. it all correlates to my continued questioning of our understanding or faith in "Karma", as Janki's organization teaches it. For folks not up to speed on sweet Janki Bhakti, here is a nice little video that gives you a good feel of a Janki visit to a center.

For the Jews to have suffered collectively generation after generation as the BKWSU says, they must have caused suffering. Ditto for the blacks and "their sex lust" issues that makes Gyan so difficult for them, as we have heard. Slavery, and the ravages of Western Imperialism, must have been their fault, according to the BKWSU.
    So ... is a black or Jewish birth a place for souls to go to when they have caused too much suffering? (Not necessarily my opinion, I am asking a question based on BKWSU logic.)
OK. Black is not a religion. Race does not figure in "The Tree", only religion. So, "black" could be a place to go to suffer ... but what about "Jewish"? Jews are Jews as Christians are Christians (or at least Jews and are Jews to Jews ... they are Islamic to the BKWSU ...), so that excludes transmigration of the soul between religions. Or perhaps do we say that the Jews that suffered in the Holocaust were not "real Jews" but just souls that needed to suffer because they have sinned in previous lives? How could one religion be "karmically" destined to suffer? If Karma is true, then this is true. How can there be any exceptions?

In India, the darker your skin, generally, the lower your caste is ... proof of your low spirituality and justification for social injustices. Laborers are dark because they are out in the sun; royalty is light because their karma is not to labour. Hence why Whites were so attractive to the BKWSU, at least in the early days. My feeling is this lives on at a deeply level as well as the taste for fenugreek.
Offline

john morgan

ex-BK

  • Posts: 397
  • Joined: 06 Oct 2007

Post09 Jan 2008

Thanks ex-l,

At least one person in the world understands my sense of humour.

I looked at the Dadi Janki video - which, probably being a Janki Bhagat now retired, I quite liked.

It occurred to me, whilst watching the video, that preparing for Destruction is what Knowledge is all about. Scotching bad karma and creating good karma. Knowledge of Destruction helps to create a learning situation, it teaches the value of time if nothing else.

Its not a fear based thing, its a "let's do my best" thing. Focused attention on constructive thoughts attitudes and actions can only be progress. If I squander time then sooner or later I'll end up doing even more useless things than I am now. When I value time as a priceless resource it can only help to improve my life.

The Jews have suffered much persecution during recorded history but always they bounce back. There must be something good in their religion!
Offline
User avatar

alladin

no label

  • Posts: 915
  • Joined: 27 Feb 2007

scarecrows

Post09 Jan 2008

blacks and "their sex lust" issues that makes Gyan so difficult for them, as we have heard.

The way I always heard BKs talk about this racial or geographic areas topic. "it's a hard ground ...", makes me think that this is the core issue for a sexuophobic institution.

Africa: a whole continent inhabited by lustful people, poverty and AIDS stricken, because they are sinners. Beautiful analysis to be printed on some prestigious newspapers front page!

John Morgan, I like the way you explain the motivations for using imminent Destruction as a bugaboo. But this scarecrow technique, sounds more medieval than New Age to me, more appropriate for an infant school than for the self-proclaiming World Spiritual UNIVERSITY, more for simpleton illiterate natives, than for educated folks, international VIPS and academics. This is why, in front of Big Mics, the topic of Destruction, becomes magically merged, like a sick, ugly looking relative you don't want to show to your high class guests.
Offline

peterbindi

PBK

  • Posts: 73
  • Joined: 03 Jan 2008

black people are the most impure-dadi Janki

Post09 Jan 2008

Dear ex-l.

It was a evolution theory spoken by this man around the 60's. Start in black and ends in white ... and I do not follow it myself.
And, yes, you're right. This club is in trouble. Court cases are running against them from Christians, it doesn't cope with the bible, etc.

I think everyone hase some value, also in this world full of poison. And it needs a lot of respect and patience to come out. My best friend was a black man, with a body like a god and a mind so soft. He died because of this hard world, a white man's world.(':evil:')

BTW. Tiger Woods is a brilliant golf player. Greetings peterbindi.
Offline

john morgan

ex-BK

  • Posts: 397
  • Joined: 06 Oct 2007

Post09 Jan 2008

Alladin, I hear what you say - thanks.

Kind regards,

John
Next

Return to Commonroom

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests