The Tao of the Traveller

I appreciate your desire for anonymity and, as such, I think I will take the same opportunity and resign from this forum. I wish you all the best.

Dear Brother,
Omshanti. I appreciate your courage to face direct questions being posed to you on this forum. I understand that it may be difficult for you to answer all the querries, but we will definitely miss you if you resign from this forum. So, I request you to reconsider your decision.

If you do not want to continue posting here as a BK (as you have expressed in the Admin. Section) you can continue as a lay person. With your special background in the field of arts, you can add to the richness of the forum.
Regards,
On Godly Service,
Arjun

The reason I am resigning is because this doesn't seem to be an open forum, but more of an interrogation. It began with questions about the film, which I answered as directly and clearly as I could. However, it slowly slipped into personal questions loaded with presumptions and misinformation from the responders, one of whom wanted very personal information about me but would not even disclose their name. The responses also seem to filled with quite a lot of bitterness which makes it difficult to have a proper conversation and becomes more like being in a court, than a healthy discussion between two people interested in matters of the spirit. So, for that reason, I withdraw without any ill will. I think this forum is wonderful for people who experience support and upliftment from it. That's important for everyone. With love and Om Shanti,
Tamasin

Dear msorange,
Omshanti. If you have taken a final decision to quit the forum, then I will respect it, but I feel that you could still find enough reasons to reconsider your decision. Your continuance on the forum would prove that you truly follow the values that you uphold as a BK. I think it would not be wise to completely quit from the forum because of one or few individuals. You can reach the sweet water and pulp of a coconut only after being successful in removing its hard cover.
With best wishes,
On Godly Service,
Arjun

ex-l mentioned "preferential treatment" for some BKs, especially those who gave considerable donations, mikes and IPs. Many of us have witnessed this and souls who have been object of such treatments enjoyed a BK life sheltered from certain kind of pressures. They can "get away with" many things for which low-ranks are not granted forgiveness. Since there's a price to pay for everything, it'd be interesting if any "spoilt child" of the Yagya, would describe what their experience has been.

I can only guess, but for sure they have often been surrounded by vibes of envy and mistrust and, possibly, the very fact that Seniors "leave them alone" more easily, don't want to give them a hard time (true or not?), they do not want to lose them by correcting them too harshly, means that they were not exposed to some tests "less important BKs" have gone through which lead either to transformation and development of powers or death .

This preamble is just to extract from previous posts, issue of anonymity.

For Ms Orange, and any newcomer on the Forum, there are many topics worth reading where people share, with no hidden agendas, their true experiences of having been judged, sentenced, banned from centers for just having expressed their opinions, like in totalitarian societies. If it was possible for all voices to be heard and respected in the BK org, there would probably be no need for a Forum like this. If there was no sanction or retaliation from Seniors and sisters-in-charge, I am sure every BK, ex, etc .. would have no problem in signing posts with their real names.

I don't know if Ms Orange has ever been victim of suppression or judgments (artists often are), however, having been in Gyan many years, I am sure she must have witnessed a lot of injustices happening to other people. Even close friends of hers. We may have not been slandered, rejected, abused or insulted but those who have been, deserve our comprehension, protection and solidarity.

Thanks for your thoughts Arjun. I tend to believe that my values as a BK are demonstrated more by the way in which I live my life, rather than whether or not I participate in an internet forum. With warmest wishes and in God's remembrance.

In response to Alladin's posting, after having been in Gyan for almost 24 years, I can honestly say I have experienced an extraordinary breadth of treatment and experiences, from the most exhalting to the most heartbreaking. Please do not presume that because I have made financial donations (to a cause that I feel was established with the purest intent and is being sustained by God) that I have been "protected from certain kinds of pressures". Not only have I experienced the normal pressures that come with leading a committed spiritual path where one is moved to live a life of extraordinary personal honesty that can be very difficult and uncomfortable at times, there are the extra pressures of people presuming a whole range of untruths (such as expressed on this forum) about who I am and how I am, based on the fact that - because of my life circumstances - I stand out.

This may be a supportive forum if one is an ex-BK, but clearly not if one has found a way to continue on this path, despite (or because of) the challenges that are part of this delightful and fascinating road to self-transformation.

I am not being very successful at resigning from this forum so far! I will increase my efforts in this department ... .

Thanks for trying to put oil on the waters Arjun. She can always rejoin again under some other name and start over again ... and anyone can have their rank removed or not use one. It is a question of choice.

I don't know. They were general questions that applied to all the actors and the BKWSU as a whole. It seems to me that the Beakies have put around these words "bitter ... embittered" as a way of discrediting close analysis. As if a desire for detail and accuracy equates to bitterness. How many of these BKs have actually spoken to any ex-BKs in person?

For those that do not know it, I would like to quote (and recommend) the Tao Te Ching. Its not Gyan but fairly universal stuff. I find it more pure and fine in its nature than the Gita and later vedas. But first a note to the I Ching that, in one of its changes, poses the alternative of the path of inner worth and external glory. It is not judgmental about either. Both are necessary for life. We each have the choice of either. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.

The following is according to public records but it is useful. Not all artists, and certainly not all yogis, choose the external path in the public eye. Largely the BKWSU appears to chose and chase the external path and yet it is uncomfortable when examined in the light of knowledge.

I am sorry ms orange but you misunderstand me. I wish to examine the operating principles behind the manifestation. The matter is not personal. If anything, given the track record of "creativity" with the leadership of the BKSWU, if you wanted to make it personal, I would consider you and your family to be victims of their abuse of trust. You can offer us a great deal if you are willing to document your experiences. But ...

The production company/registrant of taotraveller.com is;

Saligram Studios (saligram.com)
Administrative Contact: Robin Ramsay
Saligram Studios
*** Street
**** 3205

That looks awfully similar to your public membership details according to the The Australian Anthropological Society. So why the runaround on the funding and contracting issue ... and then the attack? What part did the leadership play in its development or what is their reaction to it? How exactly does the movie relate to the BKWSU and Brahmakumaris?

It seems I am not going to resign from the forum! At least not yet.

I know you said your questions were not personal, but in fact your questions were about my family, my contributions to the Yagya, my spiritual life and my reasons for making the film. These are not "general questions" but indeed very personal. You know a great deal about me, yet you are still not being open about who you are. I would love to speak to any and all ex-BK but you guys have to come to us. You know where we are every morning, but how do we find you? Especially if you don't disclose yourselves? Where are you? Send me a private message and I would be very happy to meet and communicate with you. I don't really believe in these divisions of BK, ex-BK, PBK and the slew of other categories anyway. We are soul Brothers. We are this, absolutely.

I answered your questions about why we used the term 'Tao', and I also answered - as best I could - your questions about the finances. My experience is certainly not one of chasing the external path at all. All of that is just bells and whistles. My inner path remains the same, bells and whistles or not. And that's all it is... noise and colour and movement. My personal path is the path of inner silence and remembrance. It truly is - this is the ultimate stage that I seek. But, in some cases, it must be done amidst the noise and colour and glitz of the external. I like the Buddhist saying: "before enlightenment, chop wood carry water; after enlightenment, chop wood carry water". Remain the same and true to the inner path regardless of the external forms that play their games.

I don't at all feel I have either sought fame or been victims of 'abuse of trust'. I have discovered that if you want to do something creative, it's good to just do it. It's difficult being an artist anyway, as creative ideas are often intangible and - in a world that works often in black and white - people who don't have that background don't quite know what to do with artists or their ideas. It can all be a bit nebulous. However, if something creative comes from a place of pure intent then - whatever people may say or think - it will work and do good. I can tell you that the film was certainly created that way.

The administrative contact that you posted is the home address for all of us, and our permanent address for all correspondence. This is why the address is the same. I would appreciate it in future if you don't put my personal details in this open forum. As for your suggestion of a 'runaround' on the funding and contracting issue, as I have previously mentioned, I cannot respond to something I don't know the answer to. Please contact the films producer if you are that interested in contracts and funding.

Oh, and in connection with your question about Duty of Care, you can get it from the head office in Sydney. I don't have the recent one with me on my computer.

I hope this is clear.
Love and peace.

Thanks for your thoughts Arjun. I tend to believe that my values as a BK are demonstrated more by the way in which I live my life, rather than whether or not I participate in an internet forum. With warmest wishes and in God's remembrance ... It seems I am not going to resign from the forum! At least not yet ... The administrative contact that you posted is the home address for all of us, and our permanent address for all correspondence. This is why the address is the same. I would appreciate it in future if you don't put my personal details in this open forum ...

Dear msorange,

Omshanti and thanks for changing your decision. I have not seen you acting on the limited screen (i.e. in the movie under discussion) but the role that you played here on this unlimited screen (i.e. this forum) is appreciated.

As regards your request about your personal details that have been posted on this forum, I think the Admin. can consider removing the address or part of it.
Regards,
On Godly service,
Arjun

It seems I am not going to resign from the forum! At least not yet.

Hope not, looks like karma is not easily settled. Is it not that BKs are supposed to have the most karma, since the most births taken ? He who is most degraded gets to the highest.

I don't really believe in these divisions of BK, ex-BK, PBK and the slew of other categories anyway. We are soul Brothers. We are this, absolutely.

I agree. But why do BKs call themselves "BKs" ? Because it says so in the Murlis. Although the PBKs claim that in recent edited Murlis, the "P" (Prajapita) has been added or altered. There is a lot of attachment of labels in the BK and PBK world.

Labels have been discussed in other threads, but unless the differences are resolved between the Chariot of BapDada in Dadi Gulzar, and the Chariot of ShivBaba in Virendra Dev Dixit (head of PBK), then such souls are not really seeing each other as souls. It is easy to hide behind the word "soul" and behind one's own soul until the very same own soul bites back. It is easier to hide behind a label.

The Tao

The Tao by Barbara Bossert-Ramsay

Respectfully revised and lovingly added to by Barbara Bossert-Ramsay and complemented by the thoughts of Dadi Janki

The title of the annual Mt Abu Forum in India in February 1998 was “The Spirit of the 21st Century”. Three themes provided the focus for the forum: simplicity, creativity and responsibility. During the forum Robin Ramsay, Barbara Bossert-Ramsay and Tamasin Ramsay adapted and performed The Tao to align with the themes, and then Dadi Janki shared a lifetime’s wisdom on each of the three topics. This is the essence.

Considering the above use, "development" or "take over" of another (NAME) religous concept by Dadi Janki and other "progressive souls" since 1998. Perhaps the current article needs to reflect the "use" of Tao/Taoism. Many here including primal.logic, Howiemac and others were lured by the miss use of Raja Yoga which is not the classical Patajali's Raja Yoga. Could the use of Tao now be used to lure in new members thinking it is the ancient Chinese path of Tao.

The Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual Organisation, also known as the Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual Organization, Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University (BKWSU), or Prajapita Brahma Kumaris Ishwariya Vishwa Vidyalaya. Teachers of a form of meditation, involving spirit channeling, called Raja Yoga and not to be confused with classical Patanjali's Raja Yoga. BK Tao, not to be confused with Taoism (or Daoism) which refers to a variety of related Chinese philosophical and religious traditions and concepts. These traditions have influenced East Asia for over two thousand years and some have spread internationally. Tao may possess another entirely different meaning within the BKs.

I am not trying to offend anyone, just pointing out something that needs addressing or at the very minimum clarification.

Reform or Re-invent , that is the :

THE Tao OF THE TRAVELLER

MEDITATION, GLASGOW, SCOTLAND RETREATS

SPECIAL EVENT FILM: THE Tao OF THE TRAVELLER
SUNDAY 13th APRIL 2008 3pm, Glasgow Film Theatre (GFT) , Rose Street off Sauchiehall Street, Glasgow
to view trailer visit http://www.taotraveller.com
GLASGOW FILM THEATRE
12 ROSE STREET
GLASGOW G3 6RB
BOX OFFICE 0141 332 8128

When knowledge as old as time falls into her hands a journey she never intended begins. There was no flash of lightning, no crash of thunder to mark the moment, but nothing would ever be the same again! Filmed on location in the rainforests of Australia, the mountains of New Zealand and the mango woods and villages of India.

Music by Dave Clayton of 'Simply Red'. With Clarke Peters, Lucinda Drayton and Tamasin Ramsay as the Traveller.

A new independent film from Australia.(2008) Running time 64 minutes.
MEDITATION, SELF ESTEEM, POSITIVE THINKING

Hi Bansy,

You seemed to be giving some thought to taking up Jayanti's offer of a friendly chat at one point, so why not consider a similar such rendezvous with ms Orange? And you never know, if fruitful, then that might help pave the way for a more technical tete-a-tete with the good ex-lady herself?

with regard
Ranee

I think there is nothing odd about a group of people creating a film that expresses their spiritual beliefs through allegory. That the film's screenings may lead viewers to contact with the producers' religion ... we would expect the producers to see that result as a positive effect. After all, they see value for themselves in their own relations with the group. Critics of the film or its makers or of the effects of its screening should make a case that such activities are inconsistent with the group's duty of care or cause other direct harm.

You seemed to be giving some thought to taking up Jayanti's offer of a friendly chat at one point, so why not consider a similar such rendevous with msOrange? And you never know, if fruitful, then that might help pave the way for a more technical tete-a-tete with the good ex-lady herself?

It is tempting, but there's too much of background chats. I don't like the idea of a bunch of children whispering in the corner, it seems so 'boardroom-like' sanskars in what is really a one world family. Besides, I have nothing personal against any BK as they are also spiritual seekers and travelers, and thus let views, criticisms, praises, strengths and weaknesses, out in this forum and learn from others and from myself.

Because the audience in this forum reaches out to folks all across the world, and across many other cultures often which I know little about, and not just from a safe little corner I would sometimes like to crawl back in. There's a lot of insecurity in both physical, material and spiritual aspects, and so acknowledge them from others to also be those of my own too. And so in this sense, feel less insecure.

Besides, spirituality is not a connection between one or two (other than the Supreme Soul). It is about connecting with as many as possible.

I don't know about others, but (besides the Murlis), in terms of discussion and churning, I learn a huge lot about the BK world in this forum than I would if only staying within the boundaries of the BK sphere. There is a saying that "As in Rome do as the Romans do", so in the BK world, do what the BKs do. Except that the Roman empire failed because it could not connect to the rest of the world as it was so enclosed in its own. In a sense, everything is doomed to fail such as the BK world itself nowadays the result of BK, Hinduism, is so vague. This is according to BK's own wheel of drama. So "nothing new".

At the same time, I am not attached to this forum because we all know that everything is transient. So we use everything that empowers one's own self as it will empower others. Discussions in this forum is open and unbiased, as the only bais is towards oneself because I am writing to a computer screen, and I don't know who is really on the other side as it does not really matter. For some, it may.

The only other person I really need to write to or have a one-to-one meeting is with the Supreme Soul. I would prefer to connect to all, not select the ones I prefer. This is what I understand from the Murlis "forget your relations" ... i.e. even forget the BKs as they are your spiritual relations, just remember the One.

I look forward to the viewing of TToTT. I am sure it is made with good intent. Though I much prefer the message to simply say "this is God and I am Shiva" and leave out pulling the audience to other actors, ironically the best video made by the BK so far (for me) is the one with the look-alike Lekhraj Kirpalani (already well discussed in the forum elsewhere) as it tries to say directly what it is really all about. (The PBKs may have a different view on this though). There are already too many ego actors in the world climbing for space and time, and so I would like the message direct, rather than like another Paul Coelho novel.

I think the need to "feel the pulse" is much lightened nowadays since people are so much more aware of spirituality and religion, and the countries heaped in so-called "exotic" locations of India, Middle-East and Far East are now no longer exotic but very open, there is no need to take a trip to Angkor Wat or the Peruvian mountains since they can now come onto the very screen you are typing with just a few googles.

God is very accessible now, you an get copies of (versions) of Bible, Gita, Koran etc on the internet for free, and so I have respect for folks that they are aware of God more instead of assuming they do not have a clue and only I possess to have the real knowledge.

It is said "come last go fast". It only takes a second to realise God. If anyone is interested (here's my free bit for the PBKs) the PBKs have put up a lot of new documents about the Gyan and explanations of pictures in their website, not just the clarifications, mp3s and videos. I am surprised the BKWSU have yet to even release Murlis or DVDs of BapDada, but it will just be a matter of time.

I've sort of rambled on, I don't get so much time on the forum now so I sort of chucked it all in this post for now. Surprised to find many responses on this thread, just goes to show that TToTT will be useful for others when it is released. I knew nothing about the people who made the DVD, though now I know a bit more but it doesn't matter.

I am glad ms orange (Tamasin) has boldly come onto the forum, as I am sure it is hard to accept criticism but at the same time there is a deeper message in that there are also many others who praise the work done and are not bothered with the financial aspects etc and take the DVD as it is at full value and will receive good benefits from it. And as long as that happens, all these thoughts are just transient.

To be fair, Tamsin, you told me to contact the producers for further details and so I googled the address of the production company.

I am sure it is by 'mere coincidence' that it was the same address as yours, openly published elsewhere on the internet. Given your family's involvement, do you know nothing about the actual production of the film? So ... come on ... why not just make life more easier and straightforward for us all? If folks want their integrity respected, they ought to respect others intelligence.

Ranee, its just unfortunate that when one enters into the world of publicity to promote a product, whether it is the self or something else, it is "fair comment" for others to question what is being presented. What is important for us here are the spiritual elements of any BK service, the morals and ethics behind it all. And, of course, deciphering it all for the rest of the world.

I support ex-BK pulling themselves back together
I support, empower and defend friends and family of BKs translating what it is their loved ones are going through.
I support BKs being honest about what it is they and the system is doing.

Critics of the film or its makers or of the effects of its screening should make a case that such activities are inconsistent with the group's duty of care or cause other direct harm.

I am not a critic of the film as I have not seen it but I am generally critical of the fact the BKWSU does not clearly label its service as such, BKs do not make clear their relationships and present themselves as independents etc ... and talking the name of another religion 'cross the line'. Then there is the business side of it all we have yet to discover.

May be they conceive that Barbara was original source of Lao Tzu's inspiration from last Kalpa!?! Nah, its plain wrong. The BKWSO, or any individual BK, cannot play it both ways ... pirating other spiritual traditions whilst pursuing exclusivity and copyrights ... and come out smelling like roses. And Janki Kripalani as "The Tao". You got your role play back to front. Lao Tzu was the one sitting by the river bank who refused to go and see the emperor in his palace ensconced on his golden throne.