What price morning class?

for ex-BKs to discuss matters related to experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
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ex-l

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What price morning class?

Post11 Jun 2008

So, how much does it cost to hold morning class in the UK? ... £441,000

Its a wonder they don't just save money, distribute the Murli via email and hold the classes at BK homes. OK ... OK ... the pedants amongst you will say it is not JUST morning class that cost £441,000, it says "regular discourses". But then lectures and seminars cost £314,000, Religious festivals and special events £120,000, and retreats £195,000.

    ... so what is left to cost £518,000!?!
Answers on the back of a £50 Pound note to the usual address, please. My guess would be, in common parlance, "political lobbying and PR for the Kripalani Klan".

From the BKWSU (UK) Annual return 31 December 2006
Sanjay Tulsidas wrote:
Who benefits from the charity's work?

    General public
How do you respond to their needs and how do they influence the charity's development?

    Charity offers group and individual courses
Key elements of your charity's medium to long-term strategy?

    Cultivate existing relationships and associations with similar organisation [sister in charge].
How does your charity measure the success of the strategy?

    By the increase in number of the attendees and a better understanding of Hindu Religion
What were your charity's main annual objectives and were they achieved?

    Serve General Public via:
<table border="0" padding="10"><tr><td> Regular discourses
Religious festivals + Spiritual events
Humanitarian emergency aid
Lecture + Seminar + Courses</td><td> - average 450 students in the UK getting insights into Religious teachings on a daily basis
- average or 9,450 in the UK benefiting
- Tsunami + Disaster relief
- an average of 2,100 members of general public benefiting with less stress/positive thinking</td></table>

What were your charities sources of income in the year?

<table border="0" padding="10"><tr><td>Voluntary income
Investment income
Incoming resources from charitable activities
Other incoming resources </td><td> - 75%
- 7%
- 11%
- 7%</td><td align="right">£1,586,000
£ 140,000
£ 233,000
£ 157,000 </td></tr><tr><td>Total</td><td> - 100% </td><td align="right">£2,116,000 </td> </tr></table>

What were your charity's most significant activities in the year and how much did it spend on them?

<table border="0" padding="10"><tr><td>Regular discourses
Lectures and seminars
Religious festivals and Special events
Retreats
Other</td><td align="right" > - £ 441,000
£ 314,000
£ 120,000
£ 195,000
£ 518,000</td></tr><tr><td>Total expenditure on charitable activities
Total expenditure</td> <td align="right">£1,588,000
£1,711,000</td></tr></table>
(note: Is that a balance carried over of £ 405,000?)

How will the overall performance last year affect your charity's medium to long term strategy?

    The charity continues to expand its activities in the UK where it has less presence.
What are your charity's main annual objectives for the next year?

    To be able to serve greater number of the UK public.
How does your charity ensure that its governance arrangements are appropriate and effective?

    The charities [sister in charge] activities are governed by the Trust Deed and managed by the Trust Board who have created sub committees to manage every area of the charity.

BK Sanjay Tulsidas 08/01/2008
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post11 Jun 2008

Excuse the double posting but I just realised something else (please correct me if I am wrong in any detail) ... but if there are only 450 regular students, e.g. Maryadas following BKs;

    surely that means they must donate £ 4,700 each per annum?
If one remembers that the average tithing the Brahma Kumaris suggest is "10% of one's wages" ... sure as hell the average wage of UK BK followers is not £47,000 ($91,885 per annum)! Especially considering that a whole load of them are retired, surrendered or unwaged mothers (... your demographic estimates please).

Now, out of that are the mortgages/expenses of running small centers, aren't there? So what is going on!?! Has the old Shrimat about not accepting donations from non-BKs been relaxed? (... answers on the back of a signed cheque to Baba ex-l's offshore PO Box in the Bahamas, please).

Alternatively, if it cost £1,711,000 per annum to run the Brahma Kumaris charitable services;

    surely that means it costs the Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University (UK) an equivalent £3,802 per annum to "sustain" each "student"?
Does that equate to good value for money and does it serve the most needy of society "alleviating poverty"? Obviously not if they earning that type of money.

bkti-pit

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Re: What price morning class?

Post11 Jun 2008

Who knows how much of the total income is from donations from the 450 regular students?

What are Incoming Resources from Charitable Activities and Other Incoming Resources? Does the sale of books and CDs figure somewhere in there?

Curious to know the kind of revenue generating investments they have.

It is obvious that the £441,000 expenses for the Regular Discourses apply to the 450 regular students but how much of everything else and thus how much really goes for the benefit of the general public?

How many of the average of 2,100 members of general public benefiting with less stress/positive thinking and how many of the average or 9,450 in the UK benefiting (from Religious festivals and Special events) are really from the general public (does it include the BKs sitting in the crowd?) and how many are really benefiting? :-?
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post12 Jun 2008

I did think that if it cost £3,802 per student to run, then at an average of 2 hours per day for morning class and extras, that equates to running costs of £5.02 per hour per student.

Surely at that rate, they could outsource their supply to chain to India and provide a much service using Indians at local rates? Oh ... you say they already are? Then why such high costs and what was that £500,000 black hole called "others" in their budget?
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Mr Green

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Re: What price morning class?

Post12 Jun 2008

I don't think literature is included in the BK budget anymore, I think it is registered as a seperate entity ... as a business rather than a charity I would presume.

bkti-pit

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Re: What price morning class?

Post12 Jun 2008

And how many are benefiting from the £518,000 other charitable expenditures?

And we have no idea of how much cash donations do not even show up in the numbers.
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post12 Jun 2008

Unfortunately, the Brahma Kumaris don't file detailed accounts and so we wont know for a while ... or until they are forced to make open and accountable financial statements for their financial donors benefit.
mr green wrote:I don't think literature is included in the BK budget anymore, I think it is registered as a seperate entity ... as a business rather than a charity I would presume.
<table cellspacing="10"><tr><td valign="top">Image</td><td valign="top">That is true. They "charge" or "pay" themselves $40,000 plus to manage Brahma Kumaris Information Services (BKIS), ltd. It is also said to manage and run 'Inner Spaces'. There is another similar set in South America, PEDRAZA SEVILLANO ISAAC ARTURO doing business as Publicaciones Brahma Kumaris and they may have set up Global Retreat Centre separately too. According to the records, the BKIS has a Mortgage report ... even if followers are not recommended to have them because of the imminent nature of Destruction and the burden on their intellects.

A strange one is ... "STEVE WILLS doing business as Brahma Kumaris Meditation". </td></tr></table>
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post15 Jun 2008

Still "promoting Hinduism" after all these years. (Scroll down or click to see).

BK_Hindu.jpg
BK_Hindu.jpg (37.04 KiB) Viewed 19444 times


Taken from the UK Charity Commission filing.
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arjun

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Re: What price morning class?

Post16 Jun 2008

mr green wrote:I don't think literature is included in the BK budget anymore, I think it is registered as a seperate entity ... as a business rather than a charity I would presume.

Quoted from the BK Section:
205.
“You should always first of all keep the picture in front of them. You should never ask for money. You job is to give them. If they have to give anything they will give on their own. If anyone asks about the price, tell them that Baba is a friend of the poor ones (garibniwaaz). It is distributed free of cost to the poor. As for the rich people, whatever (amount) they give, we will get many more (pictures/books) printed (with that amount). We don’t use the money for ourselves. Whatever we get is used for public service. It is the rich people only who build dharmashala (free of charge public lodging) etc. Here, even the poor people can set up centers. No cost is involved in it. Suppose someone says that he wishes to open a center or to open this Godly University. Even if 3-4 people get nice benefits from such a Godly University, then it is a matter of great fortune for those who opened it.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 09.02.08, pg 2 published by BKs in Hindi, narrated by ShivBaba through Brahma Baba; translated by a PBK; the words within brackets in the English version have been added by the translator to clarify the meaning)

The above extract clearly proves that during the days of Brahma Baba pictures and literature for Godly service was distributed free of cost to the poor people and whatever amount used to be given by the rich ones as the price of this literature/pictures used to be reinvested for printing more literature/pictures. But, today they have set up a separate Brahma Kumaris Information Services (BKIS), ltd. for this purpose. So, we can guess the direction in which the Yagya is moving.
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alladin

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would be too good to be true!

Post16 Jun 2008

Fair enough. Sounds wise and sensible. This attitude and approach attracted many of us to the BKWSO because we found it very clean, free from the usual dreaded hidden agendas of greedy gurus, churches, etc. God must be just towards is children and Prajapita, the old soul, Father of humanity must be wise!! From each according to his ability, to each according to his need!

So, what happened, was it too "communist" for the folks who took over the Yagya? Was the shift gradual, from being a progressive, transgressive and innovative community - at least in some aspects of lifestyle as well as creed - to an ultra-conservative group operating in the direction and interests of an elite, run by a lobby, like a holding or corporation? Why should any real BK be surprised if other members drop out, seeing such breaks in the principles and a restoration of caste and feudal system, run according to discrimination, segregation, oligarchy, plutocracy, a poisonous mix of odious Kaliyugi systems???

Like the band Steel Pulse sang, "I wanna know who's responsible", track from the album 'True Democracy' :D.

On this site, I was reminded that the principles Arjun copied from the Murli are so ancient and universal, belonging to 'primitive" societies and Christianity. Not to forget Karuna, compassion, which is a pillar of Buddhist philosophy. So, either we can do something even better or we should at least preserve such ethics!
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post24 Jun 2008

From the Trustees report, here.

I would like to flag up, as someone else did, the question of how much double counting has been going on in the BKs estimates of numbers. What would be interesting is to look back over the years and see by how much the numbers have increased for what investment.

OK. Update: they state, 300 BKs at Global Co-operation house and 450 elsewhere around the UK. 750 BKs in total? 35 centers, so an average of 12 BKs per center?

Including the women, children, surrendered and retired, does that not equal to an average donation of £2,667 per annum or £50 per week ($100 USD - 4,328 Rupees) ... it does not seem likely, does it?
BKWSU (UK) is a non-governmental, non-political, religious organisation, established in 1975. The charity was constituted under a trust deed dated 18th July 1975, with various amendments, and the latest being 191" March 1998. It is registered as a charity with the Charity Commission. The trustees define the charity's objects as being;

    (i) To promote the advancement of the Hindu Religion and other religions of the world
    (ii) To promote the advancement of education by educational courses, programmes and
    projects and studies of and research in the field of Hindu Religious Philosophy and
    Yoga (various techniques of concentration as defined and discussed in the Hindu
    Scriptures) and to make known the results of such studies and research
    (iii) To relieve poverty, mental and physical sickness and distress.
The activities currently carried out by the charity, to deliver these objectives can be broadly categorised into the following groups of programmes:

    • Regular discourses, including foundation course and advanced Yoga
    • Religious festivals, including founder's memorial day, Shivratri, Janmashtami, Raksha
    Bandhan, Navratri, Diwali, Easter and Christmas.
    • Lectures and seminars, including positive thinking, stress management, self esteem.
    • Retreats, including one day retreats and longer residential retreats.
    • Community outreach, including interfaith.
    • Humanitarian emergency aid, including earthquake, tsunami and flood relief.
BKWSU year ending Dec 2006 wrote:Reserves Policy

A substantial proportion of the reserves shown in the balance sheet are represented by assets other
than cash.

Of the reserves as at 31st December 2006 of £16,697,444, cash balances amounted to £3,082,146.

Several courses teaching the practical application of Hindu spiritual principles in life are taught each
month. Support materials are also provided via the Internet. Attendance numbers are as follows:

    ■ Raja Yoga Meditation attended by 776 people
    ■ Positive thinking attended by 245 people
    ■ Stress Free Living attended by 119 people
    ■ Overcoming Anger attended by 226 people
    ■ Self Esteem attended by 212 people
Monday to Saturday at our main centre, Global Co-operation House, these are attended, on average, by 300
people from a variety of cultural backgrounds, with 450-500 attending on a Sunday morning.

Around the UK classes are regularly attended by an average of 450 students in total.

    ■ Several religious celebrations were held throughout the year around the UK.
    ■ Founder's Memorial Day attended by 500 people.
    ■ Shiv Ratri (Festival celebrating the bringing of light into the world) held in February
    attended by 300 people.
    ■ Holi (Festival celebrating faith in God) in March attended by 500 people.
    ■ Raksha Bhandhan (the tying of a sacred thread on the wrist symbolising the connection
    between the soul and God) attended by 2,000 people from all over the UK over a period of 5
    days in July/August.
    ■ Janamasthami in August (celebration of Shri Krishna's birth) attended by 500 people.
    ■ Navratri (honouring of nine goddesses) in September attended by 150 people.
    ■ Diwali (the Festival of Lights) in October attended by 500 people.
    ■ Festivals of other faiths were also marked, such as Easter and Christmas.
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ex-l

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Re: What price morning class?

Post24 Jun 2008

So what are "representatives in the UK? Are local non-London BKs not volunteers?
BKWSU wrote:The charity delivers its charitable objectives in three ways:

    - Through direct delivery using volunteers.
    - Through representatives in the U.K.
    - Through the web

Who are BKs and who is just "General Public"? Is Shrimat not to not accept donations from non-BKs?
Voluntary help and gifts in kind

The trustees are very grateful to all the volunteers through their tremendous effort who have helped in delivering the objectives of the charity. The public has been very generous in also providing donations and gifts in kind.

The annual Christmas Pantomime was Charlie and the Chocolate Factory and the charity also contributed £23,309 towards disaster and tsunami appeal. £69,155 in 2005.

Now, 23,000 out of £2,000,000 is not a hell of a lot. We believe it is also the first time. And it is a strange construction, "the charity ... contributed £23,309 towards disaster and tsunami appeal" ... As I understand it, the charity did not. The charity had a whip round and the BKs donated and ADDITIONAL, special effort. But what is "disaster and tsunami appeal" .. which appeal? "The" disaster and tsunami appeal?

This one of the reasons why I asked. I mean, it could mean ANYTHING. Rebuilding BK centers for example ... I do not know. Does anyone know and know what the total was from any part of the organization rather than the congregation?

bkti-pit

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Re: What price morning class?

Post24 Jun 2008

I had a laugh reading the charity's objects:
(i) To promote the advancement of the Hindu Religion and other religions of the world
(ii) To promote the advancement of education by educational courses, programmes and
projects and studies of and research in the field of Hindu Religious Philosophy and
Yoga (various techniques of concentration as defined and discussed in the Hindu
Scriptures) and to make known the results of such studies and research
(iii) To relieve poverty, mental and physical sickness and distress.

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