Shiva Entering Brahmababa - Was there any physical change

Just a question to the BKs or even the PBKs.

Just like when BapDada enters the body of Dadi Gulzar, e.g. the jerk of the body or the face change with the voice as well ... Can anyone verify whether there was anything like that with Brahma Baba or in the same lines is there any physical change when Shiv enters Virendra Dev Dixit?

It will be interesting to see the responses since, at the end of the day, it is another soul entering the Body.

Yogi

Dear yogi108,

Omshanti. As far as i know there used not to be any difference when Supreme Soul Shiva entered Brahma Baba just as there is no physical change when Shiva enters Baba Virendra Dev Dixit (as believed by PBKs). My analysis is based on the recorded Murlis of Shiva speaking through BB that I have heard and the clarification Murlis as well as discussion classes that I have personally attended where Shiv speaks through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit. You can see that yourself by visiting http://www.PBKs.info

OGS, Arjun

Hi

This was discussed 2 years ago in this forum here : Who does ShivBaba speak through ? (no PBKs please).

Got to go, cannot stay.

As far as I know there was no change in BrahmaBaba.

Also Brahmababa had quite a bad cough even when Murli was spoken.

Thanks Bansy and Arjun and John,

is not it funny, since the thread bansy sent suggested somewhere that the jerk which Dadi Gulzar goes through is actually her subtle body leaving for the Subtle Region, why it did not/does not happen to Brahma Baba or Virendra Dev Dixit? At the end of the day, we all understand that Shiva needs a body but then is it not the same process that the subtle body of Brahma Baba or Virendra Dev Dixit needs to go some place so that Shiv can take over ...?

How do you know who is speaking what?

Yogi

How do you know who is speaking what?

That is the 6 trillion dollar question . It is said in Murli of Shiva, 'when I come and when I go nobody knows'.

I did ask questions to the PBKs for Virendra Dev Dixit to answer along the lines of, is he/was he ever aware of a seperate entity controlling his body. There has been no answer. The get out clause is that Virendra Dev Dixit does not claim that Shiva enters him, it is the PBKs who make that claim. It's all as slippery as an eel, when you try for any concrete answers.

There are things BKs don't know and there are things PBKs do not know. That is the conclusion I have come to. BKs are right about some things and PBKs right about others. That is my opinion.

If memory serves correctly, the book Adi-Dev does describe the changes the old man's body experienced when God came visiting. And it was more than red lights and sweat. It describes the trance state if I remember rightly. Anyone got a copy on hand to check as mine got used to light fires one cold winter's day.

If memory serves correctly, the book Adi-Dev does describe the changes the old man's body experienced when God came visiting. And it was more than red lights and sweat. It describes the trance state if I remember rightly. Anyone got a copy on hand to check as mine got used to light fires one cold winter's day.

I have the book, but don't believe the account of the story is true. I think it was just a vision experienced by the person present, who was some relation to Dada Lekhraj. A lot of people had visions and went into trance states in the presence of Dada Lekhraj.

If memory serves correctly, the book Adi-Dev does describe the changes the old man's body experienced when God came visiting. And it was more than red lights and sweat. It describes the trance state if I remember rightly.

Hi, Paul,

I don't have the book Adi-Dev handy and cannot remember also how that state was described in that book, but what I heard from some old Seniors was just the opposite. They could never tell when "God" was in Brahma Baba. They were saying joking that "God in Brahma Baba was very joyful, liked to play cards,played tennis, climbed to the rocks, made jokes with the children, stayed sometimes whole day and night."There was no difference when "God" was in him or not as they were telling.

God playing cards could be an obstacle for me, as I never liked gambling games like playing cards in lokik life. But like many other issues I pushed also those testimonies into the cupboards of my mind - labeled as 'Questions waiting for an answer' and never thought again until I found by chance all answers in this forum.

I am sure now, that "God" playing cards and squash tennis is the same "God" allowing Seniors to accumulate incredible sums of money from every impure source, from the poor BKs and from their wills and spending it instead of eliminating poverty, distress and malnutrition of millions ... for pomp and conspicuous consumption like new buildings and expansion of the organization.

For me it is very clear now, that this "God" is one of the very obsessive 'earth bound' entities of Indian origin to which initially Dada Lekh Raj and the Seniors have been obsessively attached. I think, that after Lakh Raj's demise, probably his spirit also has become earth bound and came to Dadi Gulzar as well as during Amrit Vela (half sleep situation) and during intense mediation also to the BKs so that mutual obsession continued.

I think that these entities, or this entity, knows some good methods and wise quotes about virtues and self progress as baits to attract his so called "long lost but now found sweet children", however at the same time accepts and supports all faults, the greatest mistakes and ambitious greed of the Seniors to control and manipulate the BKs for world rule.

This entity, or entities, have nothing to do with the merciful God in my heart who loves all equally.

This entity, or entities, have nothing to do with the merciful God in my heart who loves all equally.

To which I would add ... that this level of entity - and that does not deny its power or "positive" energies - thrives within the confusion and dissonance that it creates with its contradicting philosophy and instructions.

For me it is very clear now, that this "God" is one of the very obsessive 'earth bound' entities of Indian origin to which initially Dada Lekh Raj and the Seniors have been obsessively attached. I think, that after Lakh Raj's demise, probably his spirit also has become earth bound and came to Dadi Gulzar as well as during Amrit Vela (half sleep situation) and during intense meditation also to the BKs so that mutual obsession continued. I think that these entities, or this entity, knows some good methods and wise quotes about virtues and self progress as baits to attract his so called "long lost but now found sweet children", however at the same time accepts and supports all faults, the greatest mistakes and ambitious greed of the Seniors to control and manipulate the BKs for world rule. This entity, or entities, have nothing to do with the merciful God in my heart who loves all equally.

Bingo. The beauty of realisation, eh? I've had intense spirit realm connections with Brahma Baba when I was a "innocent' BK that were too real and too personal to discount as being "not real'. He certainly was love-filled at the time and very interactive with me, so I can respect what you say in terms of him accepting all faults and 'mistakes' etc that we see happening now. I can definitely say that he certainly exists in the spirit worlds, but its probably an ideal or world (or worm-hole) of his own creation too.

Alternatively looking at a bigger picture, and going with a 'Murli' point that I remember well as saying 'What you create - you will destroy", he could be alllowing and letting the manipulation and greed that is now apparent so that 'truth' will be revealed in its own way (The Anti-Christ syndrome?), revealing his non-truth by allowing all this to go on! At the end of the day, he won't look bad will he ...? He's not 'alive' any longer. Only the ones who are working the system will be on the receiving end ... and he could perhaps be doing this even if it is at the expense of many people within the physical, mental and emotional structures he's brought into being. I could see that it is love for his children that allows him to continue working with his children but realising that its their lesson to learn, not his, that keeps this going. If he's truly non-attached, which we know is the one of the biggest BKWSU world lessons, he won't be attached to the outcome of his original structures either. And Destruction that he refers to could in fact be the Destruction of the BKWSU by their own hand.

ex-l has posted info regarding channeling on another thread today which is pertinent to the 'energy' of this thread too. Unless the spirit entity is able to bring about new information and new systems on a daily basis, quite simply they're out-dated, working with old paradigms and so will the people seeking guidance from that entity be. Simple understanding to me.

... and that's how thinking this friday goes!

is not it funny, since the thread bansy sent suggested somewhere that the jerk which Dadi Gulzar goes through is actually her subtle body leaving for the Subtle Region, why it did not/does not happen to Brahma Baba or Veerendra Dev Dixit? At the end of the day, we all understand that Shiva needs a body but then is it not the same process that the subtle body of Brahma Baba or Veerendra Dev Dixit needs to go some place so that Shiv can take over ...?

This question is often asked in the discussion classes of PBKs with ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) and the oft repeated answer is that Shiva entered in Brahma Baba and enters in Shankar in a seed-form (i.e. without any subtle body) and hence there is no apparent difference when He is present or when He is not present in the corporeal medium. But in case of Gulzar Dadiji it is Brahma's soul entering with his subtle body and hence the physical changes visible through her body. Such physical changes are also visible when souls (ghosts/angels) enter in the bodies of particular persons in the path of worship (in Hindu religion as well as some other religions).

Dear Souls,

The jerk seen in Gulzar Dadi's body may be due to the entrace of subtle body of Brahma in addition to ShivaBaba. ShivaBaba is just point. So- no jerk in Brahma.
*PBKs take advantage of this jerk and say- No jerk occurs in VD. So Shiva really is present in VD and not in G. Dadi.
*Perhaps the reality is NOTHING enters VIRENDRA Dixit!

mbbhat wrote....Perhaps the reality is NOTHING enters Veerendra Dixit!

You sound a bit upset to me,....take easy

peterbindi.

Dear PeterBindi soul,

BKs can prove (by the jerk) at least Brahma Baba enters. PBKs can prove what?