How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

for ex-BKs to discuss matters related to experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
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ex-l

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How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post24 Jun 2009

Just a quick note about how the BKWSU uses and has used foreigners in its global expansion. The first example given dates back to the 1970s, the second bringing us to in 2005 where "Foreigners attending Brahmakumari conference" is considered newsworthy enough an event to feature it. Funny, when one considers that both "foreigners" were Indians, B.K. Praveena from London and our very own Colonel Dr Hansa Rawal from the USA, notable for having left her husband and child to join the BKWSU ... and then marrying within it to another BK.

The latter repeats the now proven and "officially withdrawn" lie of Dadi Janki being "the most stable mind in the world".
terry wrote:On my first trip to India in '76-'77, we toured around "doing service" - stand up testimonials at public programs. We were among the first foreigners in Gyan, so we were a novelty & marketable - to show how BKs were now being recognised "in foreign".

One person was a hospital orderly/assistant, and they were regularly introduced as a medical doctor! Another person made a living as a craftsperson who made & sold leather goods at markets. Now a leather worker is close to the bottom of the heap in the caste system, so that person was told never to mention it. I had just graduated from film school, so was touted as a famous Australian film maker!
Foreigners to attend Brahmakumari conference - Tribune News Service Panipat, February 12 2005

A large number of foreign delegates will also participate in the world peace conference organised by Brahmakumaris on the HUDA ground here tomorrow. Some of these foreign delegates have already arrived in Panipat. They include cancer specialist from the US Army, Sister Dr Hansa Rawal also from the USA and RajYoga teacher B.K. Praveena from London.

Besides, the additional chief and overseas chief of Brahmakumaris, Dadi Janki, who has been declared woman with the most stable mind in the world, has also arrived in the city. She will preside over the conference.

I am sure we all know of and remember such cases. Of course, I would argue that "the power of the whiteman" (or whitewomen) also works and is exploited in South America (Ken O'Donell etc), South East Asia (formerly the of Lee James of Joel's domain) and so on. Ditto, in reverse, the exoticism of Indianess is also used in foreigners, a sari-ed brown skin Sister (but not South Indian/Dravidian ... please) giving authority and identity to the movement in places as far flung as Russia.

Awfully body-conscious, surely ... no?
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yogi108

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post24 Jun 2009

What about Sister Denise now in India?

Also they used to make those foreign Brothers and Sisters sing "Om Shanti Om", and for the average Indian it sounded funny. But believe me it works wonders, not only with the Indians in India but the huge NRI population globally.

Imagine a Hindu wife listening to Sister Maureen saying how she achieved purity and they, as a couple, became pure and became Pukka.

She is going to her husband and argue if a white couple can do that so can we ...

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ex-l

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post25 Jun 2009

yogi108 wrote:Imagine a Hindu wife listening to Sister Maureen saying how she achieved purity and they, as a couple, became pure and became Pukka.

It is not often I take this much liberty to reply, so excuse me, but I think it would be more of a miracle if Maureen got laid. Her not getting laid is hardly proof of God's existence. Its something I have raised in other topics but I often wonder if your average Indian wife has a kid or 4 against her will, just to ensure she is fed for life and act as a pension fund for old age, and then finds an excuse to stop it all? Becoming a Brahma Kumari adds an additional dimension to changing the power balance in relationships.

As foreign BKs, and it seems "foreign BKs" include non-India Indian BKs, were you used and did you get off on being presented as "the great white guru" for the sake of global expansion? Can soul-consciousness, and a spiritual renaissance, be expanded by skin color and imperialism?

I remember one of the original Western BKs, Aiden, was often wheeled because he had learned to speak some Hindi, and it used to make the Indians laugh too.
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yogi108

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post29 Jun 2009

Well, I understand that Maureen not getting laid is not proof for God's existence but all I am saying is that it does influence Indian women or men to take the aspect of celibacy/purity more seriously than ever before.

Yes, I was used to inspire daily Murli attendance and in public programs. There used to be one white, one African American, One Indian (me) and a surrendered Sister who make up the public programs as they call it. Nothing wrong with it except that many who inspire leave the organization and the ones who got inspired are left to wonder what really happened here.

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rayoflight

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post29 Jun 2009

yogi108 wrote:Well I understand that Maureen not getting laid is not proof for God's existence but all I am saying is that it does influence Indian women or men to take the aspect of celibacy/purity more seriously than ever before.

Hi yogi. It is good to bring awareness and education to people who don't have it, but the extremist solution to sex is celibacy and as we know, it is only moderation that leads man to equilibrium. It is not necessary to do the exact opposite. You do not have to "throw the baby out with the bathwater" so to speak. It is possible to live a happy, healthy, balanced life without swinging the pendulum left and right. No sex is just the opposite of too much sex and that is not the answer.

The word "purity" has serious religious connotations attached to it and implies that we are dirty. Education does not teach guilt, but oftentimes, religion does. A woman does not need to think that because she had sex she is impure. There are many people who have sex who are much more "pure" than a celibate BK and that is because they are at peace with themselves. It is their heart that is pure of negativity and assumptions. To strip a human being of his/her natural instincts and then supporting that by saying it is "God's will" can only lead to delusion and depression. A person can only live in a fantasy for so long before they wake up.
There used to be one white, one African American, One Indian(me) and a surrendered Sister who make up the public programs as they call it. Nothing wrong with it except that many who get inspire leave the organization and the ones who got inspired are left to wonder what really happened here.

Bringing foreigners into the organization is good for business during this time of globalization, especially because foreigners have money.

I too got inspired and very much so, but I left because I realized that I was considered to be a number and a commodity rather than a spiritual being (and I won't go into the negative projections I endured although you can read them in my other posts).

I was looking for a warm, loving, spiritual family, not an army. I was not signing up for the war of destruction but somehow I got drafted and realized that the goal of the BK Brahmin is to become a soldier. I had no interest in being a soldier nor in being promoted to captain of the squad. That was not my idea of spirituality and no matter how much the BKs try to play around the truth, people are now realizing that the game is over.
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yogi108

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post30 Jun 2009

Thanks for the note ROL. It is nice to get a detailed view of what people think.

I don't agree that sex is a natural instinct, I do not know of how many Ex-BKs actually regret the feeling of being pure. I, for one, actually continue in this path not because of the Dadi's or the Yagya or the rituals that most BKs follow. The pure feelings we can have for the soul irrespective of who it is actually is a magical experience and that for me is the most natural thing that we as human beings should experience. When we read that, "Lust is the number one Enemy", it is easy to dispose that as a wish-list and a tick off for reaching the Golden Age or whatever ... but for that is fundamental and it is about the basis LESSON NO. 1. Who am I?

Back to the Yagya and the way they treat the students, the whole muck of shady property deals etc ... I have spoken about it in detail in other posts.

I go back to a metaphor of what happened to many Musilms in the US after 9/11. They were hauled up in dingy unknown prisons without a shred of evidence against them to be released after 8-10 months. Now does that mean they all become terrorists and start to become a part of the many underground Jihadi cells? Does a stupid act of the US Government justify terrorism?

Does the mistakes of Dadi Janki and Jayanti bhen and the whole Yagya justify the students from questioning the very teachings and the principles of the organization? I guess this can be a huge debate which is never ending.

I have learnt to protect myself from the doings of the dubious so called leaders in the Yagya and also in the process of advising and helping people who are vulnerable to be aware of what can happen to them.

Now at the same time let me not rule out the benefits of the teachings the organization has given to me.

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rayoflight

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post30 Jun 2009

Hi again Yogi,

I appreciate your point of view as well. What you say is true: we cannot generalize.

I should mention though, that my feeling of "purity" is very different now that I have left the BKs. What I realize is that celibacy without the BKs has a different energy about it. There is no dogma attached to it. There is no school of thought or culture. It just is. And, most importantly, I don't feel superior because I think I am "pure." In fact, I don't even think about it.

The energy we have spoken of in this forum which I think is connected to the disembodied entity (Brahma Baba) is no longer there either. It is that energy which, in my experience, gave a false sense of magic. Or perhaps, since it feels real, then it must be real in context. That energy attaches itself to every principle of Shrimat giving it a feeling of euphoria and "true-ness."

It has been a short time since I fully (mind, body and soul) left the BKs so I have not thrown myself back into the world like a madwoman (yet ... although I do look forward to it ;-) ). The mind is the most important in my opinion, so clearing up my mind is the beginning. But, it feels great to have dropped the labels. The labels begin in our minds (I am celibate!) and then they are statements made to the world, "look at me, I am celibate and I am pure and you're not. Haha, I am better, I am better."

True, we cannot generalize, but if everyone gets fed the same Murli and the same dogma and propaganda, eventually the brainwash is also the same. After all, that is the goal of brainwashing. Individual thinking, or thinking outside the BK structure, is not the goal of the BK, nor is it supported.

(Have we digressed? perhaps this should be under another topic??).
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ex-l

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post30 Jun 2009

yogi108 wrote:I don't agree that sex is a natural instinct, I do not know of how many Ex-BKs actually regret the feeling of being pure ... Now at the same time let me not rule out the benefits of the teachings the organization has given to me.

I would never argue against the objective effects or benefits of individual components of a "yogi" life, e.g. giving up, or putting aside, sex without any doubt frees up a huge amount of time and energy for other activities. Not having other people inside your life is a great way to removing their rollercoaster rides from your existence, if you have something else you want to do. The loss, damage or pain element is not so much about "the sex" but about the loss of making connection with others and society, creating a family and worthwhile relationships ... even just becoming worldly-wise enough to survive.

I am not right in saying you came into Gyan when you were older and already had a family? Imagine a woman who lost her family making years, endure years of abuse and waste in the BK system and then falls out the other side with nothing ... There is even a "time for everything", as in best years to find the best mate which if not done leave one living outside of one's society in a bubble. Having spent one's self as been a "cultie" for those years is no benefit, it is a loss and a liability one is left paying for.

Ditto, any of the other individual components which, when looked at, are evident elsewhere and have been around for as long as "civilized" humanity, perhaps longer. But what I have been left with is the feeling that they are all offered and arranged as attractions or devices for the "something else" that is going on in the BKWSU, the spookery, the End of the World, the Global Domination Campaign of the Shiv Shakti Army.

In a sense, I encourage people to rebel against the idea that the Brahma Kumaris "own" them and, certainly, that they have a right to take a commission out of your mind, body and wealth for having told you about them.

Foreigners, that is to say Westerners, are used and are adding to this "shop display unit" now that the Sindhis and Indians are allowing them to add their courses and borrow metaphysics. To that we see "Successful Indians Who Have Made it and Money in the West" being added to the BK armory. Its funny but its back to that old thing where they don't like their adherents to chase worldly success but if they come with it already added, they will exploit it for its sales appeal.

Its all very lower-middle class and mercantile ... dare I say, "Sindhi", is not it? By that I mean, getting ahead and doing whatever it takes to raise one's position in society, going "foreign" to make your gains because there is no room and too much competition in India.
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rayoflight

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post01 Jul 2009

Okay, ex-l has officially broken the code.

If I was a Father who cared for my daughter and knew about the goings on in the BK, I WOULD NEVER EVER ALLOW HER TO GO NEAR THEM.

The bottom line is, they give bad advice. They should just stick to the positive thinking course and leave it at that. They should have the humility to know their abilities and limitations and stop there. (Fat chance).

To quote Madonna on her first Time Magazine appearance in the 80's: "Face it, if I weren't as talented as I am ambitious, I'd be a gross monstrosity."

The BK are ambitious but lack the talent and therefore, have become a gross monstrosity. Any and all life advice they give is selfish and self-serving period, thanks to that ******* ghost and his idiotic Murli.

A life is called a life because it is meant to be LIVED.

Definition:

Life: the organic phenomenon that distinguishes living organisms from nonliving ones; ie. "there is no life on the moon"
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ex-l

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post01 Jul 2009

I am just questioning myself about the class element to what I wrote ... I am guessing that the vast majority of BKs are NOT caste born Brahmins. In fact, I would imagine only a tiny minority are, I never knew any. Does anyone know the figures?

What caste are white people within India? On one hand "higher", envied or admired because of their wealth and power; on the other hand, lower and eternally excluded because they are, even in the Brahma Kumari system, "foreigners". Not Indian. To have had a last birth in India, or the Sind in particularly with Lekhraj Kirpalani, was said to have been the highest fortune in Kali Yuga for BK souls.

So, does that underline, again, that what the BKs are all really about is aspiring to "wealth and power" ... and social climbing? I mean, their fame has not been about getting down and dirty with the poor and unfortunate, is it? Bad luck is just their own bad karma.

In India, with the belief of "bad karma" being entirely the individual's own fault, lower caste people are seen as unlucky because they have been more vicious and need the punishment of their current condition. There is a lot of investment into keeping the caste system.
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tom

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post01 Jul 2009

I have known very few caste born Brahmins amongst the BKs, but nobody gives a ****. I noticed they also don't like to be remembered or asked about it.

In Madhuban they showed me few niwassis who are caste born Brahmins without giving any importance on it, because all BKs believe to be "Future Kings and Queens". Being a BK is becoming "The Topknot of God" as it is said in the Murli. The Seniors thought us that there is not any higher caste and position in the world and in Paramdham than being a BK and so we thought to the new ones.

All BKs are injected the feeling of superiority that we are God's special children and becoming angels, instead of having the humility of being servants for the whole humanity.
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ex-l

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post01 Jul 2009

Although "spiritually" or in these days of being politically correct and promoting equality for all, one would not like to think there is a difference, certainly in the potential of any individual; of course, there is.

Generations of wealth, education, responsible status within society, good breeding ... even regular food and nutrition ... does make a huge difference to one being. Not everything about caste born "Brahmins" are bad, as is often portrayed. The same is true of any upper classes in any society or nation. Very often, they are the individuals that have held the nation together and driven it forward.

Education ... mental exercise ... especially, is a very good thing. For example, the Jewish people's ascendency within the many societies of the world has often been put down to their tradition of intellectual purpose and, especially, abstract intellectual purpose.

A religion of uneducated leaders, born to merchant classes and not priestly or bureaucratic classes, is bound to have a different flavour. In broad brush strokes, the low ranks of Bhaibund were anti-intellectual, anti-education ... their interest only went as far as money and what it took to get it, arithmetic, languages and the ability to be "sugar in other culture's milk".

The fight that arose between Lekhraj Kirpalani and the Mukhi Mangharam could easily be seen as the anti-intellectual, and especially anti-Western culture against the intellectual and Western cultured. Lekhraj Kirpalani was a really quite a backward traditionalist ... look against all the anti-Western sentiments in the early documents ... "devils ... ignorance ... unself-realised ... pomp ... vice ...".

Its strange how they came around full circle, how the BKWSU is now being so Westernised and how that is sold as an appeal to the modern aspirant Indians ... "Look, even English people are believing." From Om Radhe being eulogized for singing "Twinkle, Twinkle Little Star" to their current faux corporate self management leadership identity, the Holy Ghost of Hyderabad has had a strange relationship with Westerners.
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yogi108

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post14 Jul 2009

ex-l,

I keep reading on many of your posts that Westerners are wealthy and hence admired and so on ... I don't know if you know how the BK centers are managed financially outside the country. Its all managed with the money given mostly by Indians ...

I am not saying that because I am an Indian. I was privy to the amount of money that comes from Indians who live abroad ... It is quite big ...

So why so much hype about double foreigners ...? I guess the average Indian thinks people who live abroad are rich people ... poor man doesn't realize that many of them make it only once in two years to Madhuban. They save for 2 years and with that money they come to Madhuban ...

Yogi
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ex-l

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Re: How the BKWSU uses foreigners for global expansion

Post14 Jul 2009

yogi108 wrote:I don't know if you know how the BK centers are managed financially outside the country. Its all managed with the money given mostly by Indians ...

Of course, I agree with this.

I don't know about now, but certainly in my time I would have said that the Westerners ... by Western terms ... were mostly not wealth at all. A few boys had trust funds or family money (Charlie, Simon, Robin etc), and the BKs sucked them up. A few were business people, but not that big. Most lived "hand to mouth". I only think that when it translates to a two week holiday to Madhuban, or the odd tour around some impoverished local service centers, even Western poverty seems like wealth.

VIPs, like Robin Gibb, are a different matter

I also agree that there was both much more money on the Indian side of the room and a much stronger tradition of giving. That they financed the operation and the blonde Sisters were the icing and fairies on the cake. Its seems strange why they chased Westerners ... but I do think that it was part of their "mojo" (magical charm bag). I am just trying to understand it.

I don't know why the "big white man" still has so much power in this world. We must have been taught something by our culture or gained by education to make others afraid or impressed ... Or perhaps it is just the simple legacy of Hollywood and the British Empire (the latter of which was ultimately financed by guns, drugs and slavery).

I honestly do not know. Western confidence translated as arrogance and ego?

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