BK Food issues

There was once a proper frothy coffee machine in the main dining room at Madubhan, but some spoilsport put pay to that

What was it ...

Shrimat from Baba? Some Bhai suffering from Maya induced attachment to early morning espressos? Or are cappuccinos just too body-conscious for the BKs?

It probably broke from overuse!

I thought drug use was prohibited in BK principles.

And, I have heard of Jayanti stopping off for a pizza in the past. Oops.

And, I have heard of Jayanti stopping off for a pizza in the past. Oops.

Oh, that is OK ... The people that make pizzas have been reduced to machine like consciousness by the capitalist system. In fact, they hardly have any consciousness left at all and so the food is neutral.

Its a wonder that she did not give a personal endorsement to one of the BKWSU's "senior faculty member" BK Brian Bacon's clients ... such as McDonalds for a veggie burger!

I have given a Cadburys chocolate bar by Dadi Janki ... should I have eaten it? Should I have been disappointed that I wasn't given food from the bhandara?

I have given a Cadburys chocolate bar by Dadi Janki ... should I have eaten it? Should I have been disappointed that I wasn't given food from the bhandara?

Wow. that is a 16,108 Dollar question. Just the sort of question a Pukka BK would agonize over for days ... what did that mean!?!

You were not good enough for real love and sustanence, you were fated for artificial, mechanical sustanence ... Baba was testing you to see if you would allow Janki to mislead you off the path of Shrimat ... She was giving you a sign that nothing mattered if only you had a level of consciousness as high as hers ... or she was just trying to dump some old stock on an impure Westerner that some Hindiwalla shopkeeper had donated to the center which they could not eat but which they could not been seen to refuse.

Yes, I remember a mini-Mars Bar/Milky Way incident one picnic. I am not even sure that they are vegetarian.

Yes, I remember a mini-Mars Bar/Milky Way incident one picnic. I am not even sure that they are vegetarian.

They contain eggs.

Come come. You should have at least demanded Lindt or Suchards surely from Dadi !

Do the Roman Catholics ask you to stop eating at your parents' house? I think not.

Although BKs and PBKs give some good reasoning for not eating the food prepared by non-BKs/non-PBKs, namely, due to the effect of the cook's thoughts on the food prepared by him/her and hence on the eater's mind also, but even then it is indeed a big problem for most non-surrendered BKs and PBKs.

Most of the non-surrendered BKs and PBKs cope up with this problem by either eating vegetarian food at their relatives houses or by avoiding regular visits to their houses to avoid hurting the feelings of their relatives. There are very few who follow the food-related rule while maintaining an excellent relationship with their relatives/friends.

One way out to follow the food-related rule without spoiling your relationship with the relatives/friends is by maintaining a good relationship with those relatives/friends in all other aspects, like talking to them regularly, helping them in times of need, enquiring about their well-being at regular intervals etc. Once you have a good relationship with people, they would definitely respect your feelings (rules). The problem arises when someone becomes a BK/PBK and then starts following the food-related rules without overcoming one's shortcomings.

Moreover, BKs/PBKs (especially the householders) should not become too strict/lawful in regard to the food-related rule soon after entering the path of knowledge. There are many items of food that can be taken at the houses of friends and relatives to at least maintain a cordial relationship. Like fresh or dry fruits, milk, curd, machine-made things like biscuits, bread, fruit juices etc.

The above problem is not just between non-BKs and BKs, but also between BKs and ex-BKs, BKs and PBKs, PBKs and ex-PBKs, etc. There are many BKs who do not eat food cooked by the PBKs and there are also many PBKs who do not eat the food cooked by ex-PBKs. But there are many BKs and many PBKs who have no problem in eating the food cooked by BKs/PBKs/ex-PBKs and vice-versa. I know many BKs and PBKs, who would not touch even the water (or the above mentioned permissible items of food) offered by PBKs and ex-PBKs respectively. Such people cause more damage to themselves and the Godly family than good.

I feel that whether one is a BK or a PBK one should be able to follow the food related rule without causing damage to human relationships. After all, the Murlis also do not advice one to do so.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

I agree with Arjunbhai.

Eating and preparing food has to be done sensibly. The eagarness for newcomers to BK life to show that one is "pukka" by becoming vegetarian, and by eating food prepared in alokik thoughts, can cause a more harmful affect to the surroundings rather than in harmony.

As with any practice, spiritual practice takes time. However, even though the above seems quite obvious, there are many situations where even common sense is overtaken.

I have seen situations where Dadis would refuse food cooked by certain people, even though it was prepared within the centre kitchens. In addition, also the bowls and plates and cutlery in which they are served. I had always thought that any food or anything prepared with best care and love, even if the BK forgot to "follow all the rules" (whatever they are) but regardlessly was cooking in remembrance of Baba for the Dadis, the Dadis would thereafter still bless the food, give the cook or the server a blessing, and maybe take a few bites, rather than wave it away in a sort of disgusted fashion.

Then what you find is when the Dadi's leave the table, the rest of the BKs eat on as if it was a normal family kitchen table on a Sunday morning. There is also not supposed to have talk at the table, but the Dadis do it. In Madhuban, the dining room can be like a typical school canteen hall, so much chatter, you cannot even hear the headmaster, I mean Baba, speak.

What are other members experience of cooking and eating around the table ?

Also what are the "rules", Murli points/shirmat or otherwise.

I have seen situations where Dadis would refuse food cooked by certain people, even though it was prepared within the centre kitchens. In addition, also the bowls and plates and cutlery in which they are served. I had always thought that any food or anything prepared with best care and love, even if the BK forgot to "follow all the rules" (whatever they are) but regardlessly was cooking in remembrance of Baba for the Dadis, the Dadis would thereafter still bless the food, give the cook or the server a blessing, and maybe take a few bites, rather than wave it away in a sort of disgusted fashion.

You make a good point, "the rules (whatever they are) ... ".

I can confirm that not even a Senior Sister but a middle management BK pulled food I cooked as a BK Brahmin out of a shared dinner without saying. It was daft really because it was oven-made, and healthy, not something that I had to stand over and fill with my vibrations. I did not know that the Dadis could be so picky and controlling over food. I do not believe that it was because they are super-conscious and can pick up micro-vibrations. I reckon that their are just as picky, personal and bigoted as any human being and use their power in a controlling fashion.

At the time many Westerners were trying to introduce natural wholefoods. Fat, oily Indians, including the SS were turning their nose up a them like spoilt children because they taste buds were so blown out by years of sugar, salt and curry abuse that they could not taste the food and did not want to make the effort to eat it. I also think that there was a class issue involved. Wholefoods, brown rice etc, was peasant food. Can you clarify what you saw? Yes, I can also agree that I hurt the feelings of good people and separated myself from them, better people that I was while being a BK, by refusing to eat their food.

It was Mr Green that raised the issue that there are separate food rules for centerwasis, and presumably senior Sisters too. I never saw these written down. I reckon a lot of this is just done on whim and personal prejudice rather than some Godly plan. If the Dadis can purify a bowl of vegetables ... how the hell are they going to manage to purify the whole of the world?

• On the "level of consciousness" issue, who is to say whose consciousness is higher?

Again, it goes back to that "just because you don't have sex, does not mean that you are going to heaven" issue. So what if you get up at 4am every day IF you are also bigoted, ignorant, dishonest, financially manipulative, contradictory of Gyan and personally controlling? What if someone is just a sweet little old loveful lady who never did anything wrong in her life .. or some super intellectual humanitarian lawyers working for charity ... are you telling me that those individuals are truly lower in consciousness - as Shudras - than some of the potato sacks, or little Hitlers, sicking in Morning Class?

I could not say that any more. Life is much more 3 dimensional than the black and white BK world. And as we are discovering, they may actually not be in the right as far as God goes.

As far as I can say, the food rules that the Shiva and the BKs put out are three fold;

1), they are rooted in Hindu class bigotry (some of which is reasonable due to the risk of infection and spread of disease in tropical countries, e.g. 'class Shudras' do not have access to the same water and sewerage than 'class Brahmins'). This is a little bit laughable as the majority of India BKs are not class Brahmins and so who are they trying to kid, aspire to, rebuff ... act out as if they are "special".

2), they are clearly designed to divide and separate the BK Brahmin from all and any other connections, relationships, influences and connect the BK Brahmin to the BK family and the Shiva soul. Whether Shiva and the BKWSU are doing this for their good, as in HE/THEY FEED OFF THE BK Brahmin SOULS, or whether he is doing it for the individuals good; I would say the jury is still out. At present, I think it is the former.

This point also applies to other religions that apply similarly divisive food rules, e.g. Jewish. Originally, there was some practical commonsense to it. Latterly, it is just all about divide, rule, control and make money out of it

3), Neo-Hindu superstition. Belief in the power of toli ... Bhog ... Dadi's vibes based on past Bhakti.

Eating lies at the heart of all families and communities not just for nourishment but also for strengthening and establishing relationships through working, sitting and talking together around food. It is one of the few places that families sit and talk and share together. Pull the individual out of that ritual and ... like proy and his "control them in their bedrooms" factor ... you are have largely captured their minds not just their stomachs.

We note that in theory BKs are also not meant to talk at meals either but sit in Yoga. More separation. How this works in a village situation where neighbors are required to work together to plant and harvest crops, I do not know.

• What science can sustain that MORE spiritual energy - if any - goes into planting and harvesting foods than in cooking them?
• Ditto, what science can sustain the BK theory that conscious vibrations have how much effect?

On the basis of my experience, I would say a tiny fraction of what the actual material food is itself. I would like to see it tested. They will never do it because it is really all about social control for their own ends.

(As an aside, I think we ought to combine all the food topics into one).

(As an aside, I think we ought to combine all the food topics into one).

I agree. Even the name of the thread could be changed to 'BK/PBK food habits' if required.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

This point also applies to other religions that apply similarly divisive food rules, e.g. Jewish. Originally, there was some practical commonsense to it. Latterly, it is just all about divide, rule, control and make money out of it

Here is an extract from chapter 6 of, "Infinite Love is the only Truth, Everything else is Illusion" by David Icke. It shows how even the proponents of these food laws know they are used to induce a state of fear, and to use that fear to control. They also make a lot of money out of it - the kosher food inspectors make money for doing next to nothing. Also it seems we must be doing the Devil's work on this forum!

"In September 2004,1 saw a television documentary series called Jewish Law, on Britain's Channel 4. The series featured Jewish people trying to follow the strict Judaistic law in every area of their lives. And I mean every. It was so extreme it was almost funny, but by the end I found myself deeply sad for these people.

There are also the hypocritical expressions of the Jewish laws like the one that bans the drinking of wine that is not made by Jews. AskMoses.com says that wine is only kosher if it has not been 'handled by a non-Jew before the bottle is sealed ...'. I wonder why that is not considered racist when it would be if anyone else did the same? Personally, I don't care what anyone freely chooses to eat and drink, it's none of my business, but I am sick of this we-can-do-it-but-you-can't arrogance that pervades such matters.

Rabbi Kaye said,

'This book here actually tells us what you do when you get up in the morning, how one gets dressed, how one acts - before praying in the morning we don't eat - how you can greet someone in the morning, what you can say before you pray, what you cannot say, how you get to the synagogue, what you do in the synagogue, what happens if you turn up a little late for prayers, what bits you miss out, all these things are all there.'

Rabbi Furst said:

'We apply this kind of thinking to everything we do - what if this can happen, what if that can happen because we are afraid. We are afraid of the spiritual damage that may come to us.' (My emphasis)

He said food could affect a person's soul. If they ate food that had been made in the kosher way it had a positive spiritual affect on the soul - 'and God forbid if he should eat things that have been made in a way that violate strict kosher laws, it can have a negative effect on the soul'.

Rabbi Furst said:

'Everyone DOES know that God exists and that He is in charge. All unsaved humanity does seek to be free of what they see as his "tyranny". We are at a threshold in history. Never before have the techniques of "breaking free" - the techniques of sorcery, been so close to being presented to the general public. [/b]And the presentation is such that it bypasses all "religious" terminology.'

Only to a victim of the God Program could breaking free be condemned as the work of the Devil.

Sources
1 http://www.faqs.org/faqs/judaism/FAQ/05 ... on-42.html
2 http://www.ecademy.com/node.php?id=26320)
3 http://www.understanding-islam.com/rela ... on&qid=417"

Also what are the "rules", Murli points/shirmat or otherwise.

"Kahtey hain ham toh beemaar rahtey hain, fir bahoo aayegi, unkay haath ka khaana padega. Baba kahega bhal khao. Na karengey kya! Circumstance aisey hain khaana hee padey kyonki moh bhi toh hai na. Ghar may bahoo aai toh baat mat poocho jaisey ki devi aa gayi. Itnay khush hotay hain. Ab yah toh samajhney kee baat hai. Hamko fool ban-na hai toh pavitra kay haath ka khana hai. Uskay liye apnaa prabandh karnaa hai, ismay poochna thodey hee hota hai. Baap samjhaatey hain tum devata bantey ho, ismay yah parhez chaahiye. Jitnee jaasti parhez rakhengey utnaa tumhaara kalyaan hoga. Jaasti parhez rakhney may kuch mehnat bhi hogi. Raastey may bhookh lagtee hai, khana saath may lay jaao. Koi takleef hoti hai, laachaari hai toh station vaalon say doubleroti lay khaao. Sirf Baap ko Yaad karo. Inko hee kahaa jaata hai yogbal. Ismay hathyog kee koi baat nahee hai, sharir ko kamzor nahee banaana hai. Dadheechi rishi misal haddi-haddi deni hai, ismay hathyog kee baat nahee hai. Yah sab hain Bhakti marg kee baatein. Sharir ko toh bilkul tandurust rakhna hai. Yoga say 21 janmon kay liye tandurust ban-na hai. Yah practice yahaan hee karnee hai. Baba samjhaatey hain ismay poochney kee darkaar nahee rahtee. Haan koi badee baat hai, usmay moonjhtey ho toh pooch saktey ho. Choti-choti baatein Baba say poochney may kitnaa time jaata hai. Badey aadmi bahut thoda boltey hain." (Brahmakumariyon dwara prakaashit revised Sakar Murli, dinaank 22.06.05, pg 1&2)

"Children say, “We generally remain sick. Then daughter-in-law will come. We will have to eat the food cooked by her.” Baba will say, “You may eat.” Will He say ‘No’! Circumstances are such that you will have to eat because there is attachment also, isn’t it? When the daughter-in-law arrives at home, then they feel as if a Devi (a female deity) has arrived. They feel so happy. Now it is a matter to be understood. If we have to become a flower, then we must eat the food cooked by a pure person. For that we have to make our own arrangements. One need not ask in this matter. Father explains – You become deities. This precaution is required in this. The more precautions you take, the more benefit you will reap. There will also be some difficulty in taking more precautions. If you feel hungry on the way, then carry food with you. If you feel any difficulty, if there is any compulsion, then you can obtain doubleroti (bread) from the persons of the (railway) station. Just remember Father. This is only called the power of Yoga. There is no question of hathyog (physical or mental Yoga performed by forcibly controlling the body or mind). One should not make one’s body weak. One must offer one’s bones like the Sage Dadhichi. There is no question of hathyog in this. All these things are matters of Bhaktimarg (path of worship). The body must be maintained fully fit. One has to become physically fit for 21 births through Yoga. This practice must be done here only. Baba explains – there is no need for asking questions in this. Yes, if there is a big matter, if you feel confused in that, then you may ask. Asking petty questions to Baba wastes so much of time. Big personalities speak very less.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 22.06.05, pg 1&2 published by BKs)

Personally, I don't care what anyone freely chooses to eat and drink, it's none of my business, but I am sick of this we-can-do-it-but-you-cannot arrogance that pervades such matters.

Not being afraid of appearing a parrot, i too echo proy's words. I was a vegetarian for many years before meeting the BK's so that little exhortation did not require any lifestyle adjustment from me. But recently though after declining the offer of a biscuit on account of my being a vegetarian I got the response, "so was i when i was younger but I finished with that rebelliousness sometime ago".

That response made me wonder if that is what some people saw in my eating habits i.e. delayed adolescent rebellion, . Of course, I will never allow that to sway me from the personal choice that led me to that lifestyle change but I am now wary of any 'system' in which one is required as part of belonging to do any one thing or another (especially when no real rational reasons are offered). And from personal experience, I have heard a young child growing up in a vegetarian household express his/her reality thus: some people are meat vegetarians and some people are vegetable vegetarians.

My adult mind sees that as an expression of innocence and acceptance. So why do we adults try to make such big matters out of issues that should really reflect an individual's own personal choices? Dressing it up as any other thing seems manipulative. But then again I am biased, aren't I? Eat meat if you want to and if you don't want that's fine by me.

I remember being told in my early BK years that the reason why my intellect was so sharp - (love bomb?) - was because I had prepared myself for the spiritual journey so many years prior to Gyan through my vegetarian diet Ah well, some will capitalise on any opening they find.