Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939? Significances of history revision

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panini

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post02 Feb 2010

Let's concentrate on knowledge itself delivered by Shiva and contained in the Murlis; they contain the story of the Yagya. Nothing that humans say can be considered to be the true story of the Yagya according to the rules that BKs are supposed to follow. If they do consider human words as truth, they cannot be considered BK, because by their behavior they violate Shrimat.

So, let's concentrate on what is supposed to be the ultimate source of the Truth - the Murlis. The information delivered in these articles make the words of God lies. The points from Sakar Murlis are: "Murlis started from Karachi" ... "I enter in vanaprastha avastha" ... "How can you know that God has entered him? When he narrates knowledge." If Dada was 44 in 1939, he would had to wait 16 years to become a Chariot of Shiva. It becomes 1955. How could you explain it? Who was the Chariot till then? According to what the advanced explanations based on Sakar Murlis points, say the first Chariot at the very beginning must have left till 42. It can be calculated on the base of the physical age of the body of the one who has been revealed in 1976 as the same soul from the beginnig. How can you explain the gap that arises, if we assume that Dada was 44 in 1939?

Let's be honest fully. If we want to prove that someone lies, it is not enough to say and show that this and this are lies. It is necessary to show what is the truth. Otherwise, there is no difference from what the BK Seniors do. They claim that something is not true and leave it without saying what is true. The weapon used in this way always cuts both sides. It leads to increase of conflict and confusion, not to revealing the truth.
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button slammer

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post02 Feb 2010

When Dada Lekraj kicked his own wife aside in favour of Om Radhe, when the foundation of the 'family path' is corrupt then it is possible for other mistakes to be made. You are asking for proofs yet are bringing nothing to the table yourself.
panini wrote:Will the same be done now by the other side? Do those who have presented these documents have unbroken proofs that these are original documents based on the true and verified data? Do they have unshakable proofs that this is the TRUTH not a little scandal or selfishness of the author who wanted to create a piece of hot news? After all, these two articles shows that not only BKs lie, but PBKs also lie about Dada Lekhraj and make up facts.

Please bring verifiable Sakar Murlis dated and spoken by Dada Lekraj from 1950 onwards. Or just demonstrate anything to verify your own existence rather than refering to the clarifications which are based anyway on possible corrupted material.

Or do you still wish for others to spend time money and effort on your behalf?
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ex-l

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post02 Feb 2010

panini wrote:So, let's concentrate on what is supposed to be the ultimate source of the Truth - the Murlis. The information delivered in these articles make the words of God lies.

It is much easier than that ... it is not god.

You are joking panini ... even in my years of BK watching (more than 25 years), I have seen the Murlis re-written and shortened several times by the scribes in Abu. Do you see the original posters!?!

There was no God Shiva in the BKWSU until after 1950. Only "God Lekhraj Kirpalani Brahma" and omnipresent divine light.

So, both the spirit who speaks the so-called Murlis is false ... and the Murlis themselves have been re-written.

Personally, I think the newspapers are not as strong evidence as copy of the legal documents published in the book "Is this Justice?" by Om Radhe, in which Lekhraj Kirpalani is listed as 54 in 1938. Therefore he was 52 in 1936.

Why would the BKWSU themselves ... in 1938 and with Lekhraj Kirpalani in his full faculties ... give the court a false date of birth!

ALL the evidence points to the fact he was not 60. The BKWSU knows this. They know the history is false.

nischaybuddi

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post02 Feb 2010

ex-I wrote:Now, please bear in mind that the Brahma Kumari cult started with a middle age man in his 40s or 50s (Lekhraj Kirpalani) surrounding himself with beautiful young women and either claiming to be God, or allowing them to claim he was God, and the Gita Sermonizer for about 18 years until 1950. At that point he or they changed then their claim so that he was "not God" any more ... but the only true medium of another God.

ex-I, I don't know your age but even in your 80's, I am sure you cannot follow purity with these types of thoughts in your mind ...

Be aware ex-I, I think you are crossing the limits.

Just read the following practices to be followed in order to save purity.

    1. Eating pure food
    2. Sleeping with pure thoughts in mind, to avoid impurity even in dreams.
    3. Practicing soul consciousness through out the day,
    4. Looking at others as a soul.
First, try practising these disciplines, you yourself will get the answer ex-I.

I don't understand what are your intention to misguide sincere followers. If you don't believe why don't you just keep quiet. Why you want to take burden of spreading negativity among others?

Or I say, you come out with your truth if you know. Can you show people even dream of new viceless world with full of peace, purity, happiness, even in dreams?

If no, then why don't you shut up ...?
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Mr Green

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post02 Feb 2010

Now now calm down
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ex-l

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post02 Feb 2010

Just because BapDada is not God does not mean that he is ALL bad. If only the BKs would follow the good bits in the Murlis ... but they do not either!
nischaybuddi wrote:Why you want to take burden of spreading negativity among others? ... If no, then why don't you shut up ...

"Negativity" is one of the most loaded and manipulated words in the Brahma Kumaris' dictionary. One of the most used words in their mind control.

To them, "negativity" means "anything that questions or exposes their falsehoods ... (and especially leaders like Janki Kripalani)", anything that challenges their delusion, any facts that wake them up out of their dream.

Truth ... hard facts ... simple honesty ... are "negative", according to the BKWSU. Only their delusion, their hagiographic fantasy of Lekhraj "Prajapati God Brahma" Kripalani is "positive" and pure.

Well, I am sorry to wake you up to reality nischaybuddhi. The yugya is built on lies and promoted by lies ... how can an "Age of Truth" be built on lies and fabrications ... the sanskar of lying and fabricating? Those are the facts.

Like the Brahma Kumaris' spirit guide told them Destruction was going to be in WWII, 1950, 1976, mid-1980s ... IN THE Murlis ... and then some mindless monkeys in Mount Abu rubs it out, changes it, changes the pictures, in order to deceive newcomers about how wonderful he is. Same with the stories of Lekhraj Kirpalani ... newcomers are deceived about how wonderful he was and, yet, for 18 years he thought he was God. He that had married his 15 year old daughter off to a 50 year old man to climb socially.

Facts ... reality ... are very positive and pure. They are the foundation for a very strong stage. By "purity", you really mean unquestioning conformity and weak submission to those individuals that fabricate false realities.

So, come on, tell me ... the Murlis used to say, "50 years for Destruction, 50 years for Creation" (the length of Confluence Age). That has magically disappeared from them. Now it is 70 years later. When are we going to have an absolute cut off point at which you will accept you have been deluded?

nischaybuddi

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

So, come on, tell me ... the Murlis used to say, "50 years for Destruction, 50 years for Creation" (the length of Confluence Age). That has magically disappeared from them. Now it is 70 years later. When are we going to have an absolute cut off point at which you will accept you have been deluded?

... then you must also be knowing, BapDada also says, the final Destruction depends upon the completeness of your stage, the karmateet stage ..., it all depends upon you children ... the day you are complete, that day Baapdada can raise the curtain.

ex-l, you have not responded to
Or I say, you come out with your truth if you know. Can you show people even dream of new viceless world with full of peace, purity, happiness, even in dreams?

If no, then what is the point in unnecessarily putting people in dilemma? Those who are experiencing the truth. I've seen many old ladies and gents not feeling comfortable in their lokiks, many young students feeling insecurity regarding their career, jobs, many poor people insecure in high competitive market; they are coming to centre, feeling great and light serving Baap Dada, learning contentment, learning spending their lives in small income and remaining happy ...

More over Baapdada is promising the Golden Age practically. The VICELESS AGE. Don't you want to come there ex-l? :|.
in other topic Mr. Green wrote:What do you want?

panini

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?

Post03 Feb 2010

button slammer, you are attacking a person and bring arguments that are contradictory to the consequences of what you have written under your nickname - PBK.

No one here in this forum, particularly you button slammer as a demonstrated PBK, has made the slightest effort to think and give answers to questions that I have raised in relation to believing blindly that Dada Lekhraj was 44 in 1939. There are some consequences of accepting that he was 44, aren't there? Could you think about it first? Or will you continue to shout for the sake of shouting trying to prove yourself and demanding the same from the others?

I have brought to the table an invitation to a rational discussion over the topic that raised naturally after publishing in the forum the articles claming that Dada was 44 in 39. I have brought some results of research that I have been doing recently and placed them initially as the response to these articles. What have you brought? An aggressive tone and statement that disqualify the one in whom you, as declared PBK, believe. So, what the benefit to carry on with presenting the other facts, if you have disqualified me at the beginning?

I don't see that all this creates an atmosphere of the true love for the truth, minimum of the mutual respect and cooperation. Thanks guys! Take care. May you be successful in what you are doing. ;)
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john

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

nischaybuddi wrote:More over Baapdada is promising the Golden Age practically. The VICELESS AGE. Don't you want to come there ex-l? :|.

This will only be achieved by the truth, so why fight?

Only a foundation of complete truth is unbreakable.
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ex-l

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

Panini ...

you are right. The so-called Advanced Knowledge is often just as wobbly as the BKWSU's "Knowledge". And Virendra Dev Dixit is can be just as slippery, failed and inconsistent. I suppose it is traditional and acceptable to Hindus.

Nichaybuddhi ...

Happy until they all face a miserable retirement and the BKWSU does not want to look after them as they looked after the Kripalani Klan. (It is a numbers game, a pyramid scam. Only a small number of Brahma Kumaris will ever benefit from the BKWSU power and wealth).

Look ... just give me FACTS. Go and get the FACTS. Go to Abu or Janki Kripalani, show them the evidence about Lekhraj Kirpalani, no God Shiva and 1950 etc and ask them for the truth. Do you not know what to know the truth?

    Fact: a) We no longer know what the spirit guide of the Brahma Kumaris said or says ... because its words have been so tampered about with by the monkeys on Mount Abu trying to cover up and whitewash its mistakes, inconsistencies and politically controversial comments, e.g. the apparently racist, caste-ists and other discriminate comments about handicapped people and so on.

    Fact: b) The spirit guide of the Brahma Kumaris regularly and consistently contradicts itself. It really does not care.

    Fact: c) The logic of the spirit guide (or spirit guides) of the Brahma Kumaris is basically, "It is true because I say it is true ... even when it is not true or was not true the last time".

The level of logic of the Brahma Kumaris is, "It is true because Baba's says it is true ... even when what Baba says is not true or was not true the last time". There is always a 'get out' clause ... a slippery exit point.

    That is not logic ... never mind "divine logic".
Again, we have to decipher BKspeak ... "those who are experiencing the truth".

We here study, look for and "experience the truth" of the BKWSU. BKs do not. They cannot bear it. In their own way, the PBKs seek, question and experience the truth of The Knowledge, probably to a far greater degree than BKs.

    You do not even know who or what BapDada is.
I have just spent some time reading over teacher training and procedure manuals for the BKWSU and they canonize a false history. Likewise, the BKWSU canonize a false truth about Lekhraj Kirpalani and the likes Janki Kripalani. From a knowledgeable - metaphorical - point of view, they are making false icons of out them ... entirely contrary to what is said in the Murlis. Yet more inconsistencies.

So, what ... you can brainwash and hypnotise people into feeling anything ... and if throwing their lives away on the false promise of Destruction and a Golden Age makes them happy; come back in 2036 and tell us what the BKWSU is fabricating then. And how many have left with nothing because yet another false promise. I can just imagine what they are going to say ...

    "Oh Baba never predicted the specific date of 2036 only some of the children did ... It is your fault if it is not heaven yet. Make more efforts ... surrender your house and wallet to us."
They are already taking specific dates and years off posters and books, and getting rid of old ones.

nischaybuddi

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

nischaybuddi wrote:Or I say, you come out with your truth if you know. Can you show people even dream of new viceless world with full of peace, purity, happiness, even in dreams?

You reply with only the ... NOT ... part. Try using ... OR ... ... AND ... to make the logic.

You mean to say, people are following the strict disciplines (rules) of BKWSU, like strictly following celibacy, not involving in outer world, cinema, food, etc ... just for nothing?

Following celibacy for common people is not that easy ex-I, unless some power is with them. Do you consider the couples, rather young couple, they are following strict celibacy, while the outer world is full of vices, people are making extra-marital relationships in this world? Do you consider BKs are following it just for nothing? Ask them who are following and achieving.

Don't calculate it materially only. People are busy earning materialistically and are earning billions but inside they are empty.

Yes, Brahmakumaris are also earning high ... both material and spiritual.

See their contented faces, smiling faces, expectation-less state, not to expect anything from human being still remaining happy. See the way they work their Karmayoga, finishing every work just easily and perfectly, you must have seen the working in Madhuban. Do you believe common people without uncommon power could be able to do that?

They (we) have made GOD as our companion, so no more expectations are required.

The experiences of human companions are terrible. It is difficult to adjust with them with their egos, selfishness, and much more ... How you can say that the future what BKs predict, (heaven, deities etc) are just bogus???

I beg you. Please don't take these teachings in terms of falsification of events or incidents and I again suggest GOD's work is un-understandable.

Thanks and please bear with my English.
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ex-l

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

Your English is fine.

No, of course, I do not believe that a Sat Yuga, like the BKs paint, will exist in 26 years.

    And if I ask you HOW it will come about ... all you can tell me are wand waving fairy stories. It is impossible.
You have at least half a brain ...

    • Just tell me how you are going to remove all the 30,000 objects launched into space and floating about before the start of the next Kalpa and insert all that metal back into the group where it came from so that it is there next Kalpa?

    • Or tell me where and when how all the dinosaurs died (you do know what a dinosaur is, right? The idiot old Sindis did not.)

    • Or tell me why God did not know Judaism existed when he first came to Earth ...
Your god BapDada, Lekhraj Kirpalani and the senior all said that Destruction was going to be in 50 years. Quote unquote. Just like they said it would be in 1976 and 1950 ... it did not happen.

So, BapDada makes you happy enough to break families and leave homes ... BapDada is not god, just some spirits you think are god. I defend your right to religion and if you want to be hypnotized, that is your business ... but please don't claim exclusive rights to "God" when you god spirit fails and your leaders are false.

We know too much about the all the vice and abuse within the Yugya; the financial funny business, the fake immigrations, the fake weddings, the suicides, the legal battles for property, the love affairs going on in Mount Abu, Texas, London, Italy and so on ... the sisters-in-charge with other younger Sisters in their beds. We can name them all.

It is no big thing to be celibate ... my grandmother was celibate for 40 odd years ... most old ladies are. So are most young Indian women. Half the BK Brothers could only find a girlfriend if they paid for one ... what is the big deal?

That billionaires are unhappy is a myth. They are doing what they love ... look at Bill Gates, giving away billions of dollars, not wishing 6,000,000,000 humans were dead so they could have a heaven to themselves!

It is all myth ... myth ... myth ... and false logic based on exploiting Hindu Bhakti sanskars.

nischaybuddi

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post03 Feb 2010

You are changing my post ex-I

see the quote in my previous post it was my question to you again and again.
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ex-l

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Re: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post04 Feb 2010

nischaybuddi wrote:You are changing my post ex-I ...

No, I am not and I am not changing what you have said at all. Stop distracting others from the conversation and address the issues at hand ... Lekhraj Kirpalani's age, the falsified Murlis etc.

I have no intention of exploiting good, ordinary, simple people with a fool's dance of Destruction and "Heaven on Earth" afterwards. That is not a great thing. For me, that is abusing individuals' religious superstitions, personal vulnerabilities and religious tendencies ... wasting their lives which could be more practically spent.

I have every intention of waking up BKs' critical faculties ... making them think for themselves again ... making them look at the lies and deceptions ... making them sort of the inconsistencies in the teachings. In short, wake them up out of their sleep.

    It is the Brahma Kumaris who are the real Kumbhakarnas ... deluded by their would be God Krishna.
Let us accept for one moment that the spirits called BapDada, who possesses Hirday Mohini's body and speak through it, is the ghost of the deceased Lekhraj Kirpalani. We do not know that. It could be some other spirits all together pretending to be him ... or it could be him AND some other spirits, he still might be possessed ... who knows, who can tell. We cannot.

    If Lekhraj Kirpalani is "perfect" ...

    • How is he capable of making false promises and predictions, lying and deceiving?
    • Why does he go along with his followers lying and deceiving, cheating tax and immigration systems?
    • Why does he go along with them breaking up families and taking properties off followers under false promises (e.g. Destruction in 1976)?
    • Why does he go along with the false history and re-written whitewashed Murlis?
In short ... has he ANY morality and integrity at all?

Brahma Kumari adherents can be a drugged up and high as they like, and love the feeling ... but none of that is Divine. None of that is "perfect". None of that is "Angelic". Those are the facts.

BapDada is none of those things ... he is a false messiah. An "Angel of Light" come to deceive. Lekhraj Kirpalani was deluded for most of his middle and old age. FACT. Now, the question is ... was he just stupid and unbelievably egotistical or was he deluded by the spirits that possessed him ... and if so, who are those spirits?

Why does the BKWSU not want to resolve it all ... why don't they just ask them instead of having secret "off microphone" discussions with BapDada when he comes ... why do they not allow some serious thinkers, philosophers or spiritualists to interview BapDada?

dreadi

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Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...? (was Stay on the

Post05 Feb 2010

nischaybuddi wrote:... I beg you. Please don't take these teachings in terms of falsification of events or incidents and I again suggest GOD's work is un-understandable. Thanks and please bear with my English.

nischaybuddi, as I observe the above extract from your post I marvel at how it evidences the kind of typical BK disingenuousness designed to pull the wool over one's eyes: "you again suggest that GOD's work is un-understandable" Really nischaybuddi, you are 'suggesting' that the BK teachings uphold that belief? Do you mean GOD's work is un-understandable like how the Murli describes the holy men uttering the phrase 'neti, neti' when referring to the extent of their comprehension of the Supreme?

And if you do not mean it like that, then please explain what you mean because I think your words do the BK teachings a great dis-service ... unless at its core BKdom is but another manifestation of Bhakti. In which case, all of humanity is still waiting for the real G.O.D to make itself known to us. In which case, your statement would be true ;)

And no nischaybuddi, I am not engaging in a vanity-display regarding the depth of knowledge retained in one's intellect BUT I do not think it is fair to pretend that BKs believe that their teachings are, as alleged by you, just as UN-enlighten[ed/ing] as those of other religions! IMHO, the core deception, innocent or otherwise, behind such statements as this (and the earlier one "Baba himself said, that he is also in control of DRAMA") ought not to go unchallenged. Jeez, why am I defending Shiv Baba so ... is it the programming? :oops:

If GOD's work is UN-understandable wtf do we spend so much time studying the Murli and engaging ourselves in all of the other paraphernalia of BK-life? All this in order to not understand the un-understandable?! Better to pray I think.

Question: Lekhraj Kirpalani 44 years old in 1939 ...?
Answer: Neti, neti
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