BK hypocrisies and paradoxes: Food issues

As far as I can remember, the class was to Pukka BKs. I don't have any records as such to share so can not confirm but it was not for surrendered Sisters or leaders. Surrendered Sisters and leaders were always more strict and usually ate only in the centres.

I personally don't think this can be proved through science.

Another common yukti (trick) we were taught was to quickly offer to cook food for our family so we were the one "putting the vibrations in". Again, BKs would stop and stare at the food to "purify" it.

I personally don't think this can be proved through science.

It would be simple to design an experiment, e.g.

Three identical meals are prepared:

a) by a pukka BK
b) by a neutral control (non-BK/parent, normal state of mind)
c) by an individual in a high state of sexual arousal, e.g. watching pornography or action movies

The food would then to fed to two groups

i) pukka BKs
ii) a neutral control group

Who would then have to report back on any changes to their state of mind.

Accepted I think it would be best if the experiment was carried out for, say, a week to give it some time to effect them. Without knowledge, any belief is just Bhakti.

There are actually very refined and advanced brain scanners these days which could be used for further accuracy. We know which parts of the brains are involved in sexual responses, so it would not be difficult to check.

I read one quadi-scientific paper the BKs offer to support their CAD evangelism programme, 'Regression of Coronary Atherosclerosis through Healthy Lifestyle in Coronary Artery Disease Patients - Mount Abu Open Heart Trial'.

One hundred and twenty three angiographically documented moderate to severe coronary artery disease (CAD) patients were administered healthy and happy lifestyle (HLS) program comprising of low-fat, high-fiber vegetarian diet, moderate aerobic exercise and stress-management through RajYoga meditation.

It's funny because a "low-fat, high-fiber vegetarian diet, moderate aerobic exercise and RajYoga meditation" was *EXACTLY* what we were looked down upon, criticised and chided for by the Kirpalani Klan 30 years ago. I know well about this because I was one of those "health bhagats".

Excuse me if I am somewhat 'bitter' to see the 'sugar and milk fat crew' using it now as a service device! I'll even volunteer my services for free to be 'c)'.

tautologicallychallengednow wrote: In all my experience and association with BKs, no one recommended this as part of Shrimat and eating food from your parents was always allowed.

In general classes, especially where there are "barely" BKs and newbies, such things are said. Once anyone is considered "serious" or becomes part of the full-on BK mob, or inner circle, they will be 'advised" (i.e. expected) to be stricter, or risk being seen as less.

Taking one's own cooking utensils was fairly commonplace for 'real effort makers".
Like people who make loud grunts when they exercise to let the world know of how hard they train!

"One hundred and twenty three angiographically documented moderate to severe coronary artery disease (CAD) patients were administered healthy and happy lifestyle (HLS) program comprising of low-fat, high-fiber vegetarian diet, moderate aerobic exercise and stress-management through RajYoga meditation."

- what happens if you leave out the "Raj Yoga" proprietary form and use another meditation?

I think it does matter how the food is grown and picked. It would be best to grow and pick it yourself, organic and with care, but this is not always possible.

I don't think it is strange if for a certain situation, there are different advises, because there could be different solutions. I think we also can judge ourselves what is best to do, but i think it is not reasonable to say that the food is already corrupted anyway, farmed and picked without proper care. According to the situation we can always aim to do our best. If we cannot get better food, better make best use of what we can get.

I think that some rules does not always apply, it depends on the situation, person etc. We have to search for the best solution in every situation. For example it is said to wake up at 2 or at 4. If one does not have the practice, he can do that only out of very strict discipline for relatively short time and will soon be exhausted. So one can start from 6, if he had woken up even later, or at 5, whatever is possible for him and slowly to improve himself.

In general classes, especially where there are "barely" BKs and newbies, such things are said. Once anyone is considered "serious" or becomes part of the full-on BK mob, or inner circle, they will be 'advised" (i.e. expected) to be stricter, or risk being seen as less. Taking one's own cooking utensils was fairly commonplace for 'real effort makers".

You say what you saw around and what I had seen was different - probably because we may be talking of different times or the places or the practices of the top BKs/core vs general BK mob. I had seen own cooking utensil rarely and seldom for people not living in centres. My point was that I had not seen BKs not living in centres not eating food cooked by parents.

The conclusion is inconclusive then because I know of BKs who lived with their families yet cooked, prepared and offered their own food as they were instructed to do. I know because I was one! I prefer to accept what is written in the Murli etc as the definition of what is BK rather than how individuals interpret or modify it! Especially when it comes to lowering the standards.

What happens in India when a husband becomes a BK and his wife does not?

I am sorry to say it but, with your track record here and without seeing some evidence, e.g. it being clearly and officially written down somewhere, I would tend not to believe you or consider that you are only getting part of the story. For example, that BKs *might* on a special occasion and to calm, pacify or not offend "the lokiks" eat their food but it would generally be done with a little bit of discomfort and a lot of giving the food dhristi ... that it would not be a common place, every day event.

And, yes, that real effort makers, center-in-charges etc stick to the rules as PP says. Doing so goes right back to the beginning of the Yugya and figures in stories of how the early BKs "suffered" or had to make efforts. I'd say perhaps it is a bigger in the West where most non-BK families are meat eaters.

The truth is, a real BK would hardly see their family ... they'd always be out doing service or down the local center. Again, I know because I was one.

One thing I have never seen or know, is what do the top Seniors do when they are asked out to a formal event or occasion, do they play with a salad with a fork, or just eat fruit? The Seniors used to, or tend to, be fed special food even from the BK mob, as you call them.

There is the ideal and there is the compromise.

Better to advise compromise than make it too hard for the "mob" who may then get jack of it and leave.

What compromise do the 'role models" make? - asks ex-l.

Very little. Anywhere they go they plan meals and, like movie stars, advise people of their needs.

I have seen Seniors offered meals by "common" BKs in the traditional way of hospitality, and refuse it. And when it is insisted, please you must try ... etc, they will accept some fruit, tea (boiled water kills impure vibrations, boiled food does not ), or any item least likely to have been infused with inferior vibrations.

Hopeyougetevenmoreclearnow, you may have missed an anecdote I've shared elsewhere on forum, where the male centre in charge (from whom I heard this directly) was hosting a more Senior Sister for short while. He took a lot of trouble to prepare the centre, buy good ingredients, prepare food in remembrance of Baba, offered Bhog and had it ready in perfect timed for her arrival at lunchtime.

Upon arrival, she basically threw him out of his own residence and told him to take the food with him.

My point was that I had not seen BKs not living in centres not eating food cooked by parents.

Brahmakumaris consider non-Bks as Shudras with negative vibrations, So they suggest all BKs to not eat from non-BKs.
You are saying BKs eat food from their non-BK parents. I have seen BKs eating food from non-BK unmarried girls whereas denying to eat from their real Sisters who are married.

I cannot understand what are they trying to suggest ????

Firstly, the food vibration transferring BKism knowledge is just a BAKWAAS !!!!

If food prepared by a BK is with positive vibration, and it is said to pass on the eating person, then can you answer me WHY a BK Bhai and BK Sister living in BK centre eating the BK food murdered another BK Sister living with them? WHY BK living in Abu HQ, eating BK food were charged of child abuse?

I have seen Seniors offered meals by "common" BKs in the traditional way of hospitality, and refuse it. And when it is insisted, please you must try.. etc, they will accept some fruit, tea (boiled water kills impure vibrations, boiled food does not ) or any item least likely to have been infused with inferior vibrations.

If you see my comments, I was not talking about surrendered Sisters etc. Yes, they are quite strict about these. I was talking about practices of general BKs that is the majority and you are focussing on Seniors.

It was a question of perception really because centre niwasis did accept food from students or families and usually they were those who were seen to be following all Maryadas whilst they would be circumspect for others.

For most of the programs outside, there was always food that they carried from centres etc.

Brahmakumaris consider non-Bks as Shudras with negative vibrations, So they suggest all BKs to not eat from non-BKs. You are saying BKs eat food from their non-BK parents. I have seen BKs eating food from non-BK unmarried girls whereas denying to eat from their real Sisters who are married. I can not understand what are they trying to suggest ????

My point was only related to whether BKs eat food cooked by their non-BK parents generally or not.

My point was only related to whether BKs eat food cooked by their non-BK parents generally or not.

I am not targeting you as you said, you are not a BK. But why are you feeling afraid of giving your honest views of question asked. You cleverly use BK yuktis to skip the main question and you only comment to clarify what you said. My question was (in bold so that you can see it).

If food prepared by a BK is with positive vibration and it is said to pass on the eating person then can you answer me WHY a BK Bhai and BK Sister living in BK centre eating the BK food murdered another BK Sister living with them???

WHY BKs living in Abu HQ, eating BK food, were charged of child abuse???

Firstly, how can I comment on the cases you have mentioned when I don't know anything about them?

My views are clear- I believe food has an effect as expressed earlier. Now it will be childish of me to think that If I eat BK food I will become pure, free of all ill-will! Of course not - there is no point relating the food related discussion to such cases as they are exclusive. BKism is a combination of lot of practices and even if someone is perfect in one practice doesn't mean he has conquered his vices !

At a fundamental level, I never thought BKs were perfect and nor do the BKs believe in that. The belief is that a combination of the practices are the steps towards purity and perfection from the current state of being trapped in vices. Many falter in this journey as expressed in Gita as well - not all spiritual aspirants succeed in this journey.

On this path effort never goes to waste, and there is no failure. Even a little effort toward spiritual awareness will protect you from the greatest fear.

Bhagwat Gita.

I don't know about the cases and will not defend any BK if he has committed these and its proven. Old sanskars can take a life time to change depending on the intensity of spiritual effort- it's certainly possible for a BK to be defeated by his old /negative sanskars on this lifetime journey. This doesn't mean the journey itself is not right.

I don't know about the cases and will not defend any BK if he has committed these and its proven. Old sanskars can take a life time to change depending on the intensity of spiritual effort- its certainly possible for a BK to be defeated by his old /negative sanskars on this lifetime journey. This doesn't mean the journey itself is not right.

The journey towards spirituality is perfectly right, but BRAHMAKUMARIS who claim to be the only genuine traveling agents for this journey, are frauds and cheaters and their agency is not going to take any of their travellers to right destiny. The main aim of Brahmakumaris is to separate their followers from their family on food issues and then hunt them.

I don't know about the cases and will not defend any BK if he has committed these and its proven.

It's very strange !!!!

You know APJ Abdul Kalam's visit to Abu HQ and you gave all the details of his speech and his thoughts but you do not know about just two cases against Brahmakumaris, one of which was published in leading newspapers and, in that case of Agra BK Bhai and BK Sister, were even sent to prison. But, anyways, you are just interested in BKs' positive news so you not need to google search it.

You are talking of proof - Sister Shivani when asked about child abuse in one of her interview, she also accepted it.

And taking of your defending BK, you have all rights to defend BKs or not defending, however, anyone defending Brahmakumaris must have "MASTER IN YUKTIS" degree from Brahmakumaris university affiliated from no educational board of no country.

You know APJ abdul kalam's visit to Abu HQ and you gave all the details of his speech and his thoughts but you do not know about just two cases against Brahmakumaris, one of which was published in leading newspapers and in that case of Agra BK Bhai and BK Sister were even sent to prison.

I was personally in Abu during APJ's visit thats how I knew of his association and had seen cases myself on how the CAD treatments helped save lives. That's why I referenced it. As you have educated me now on other cases, I would certainly express my support for sending the BK Brothers and Sister to prison if they did that crime.

If you like you can share the links of the newspapers where this was published as I couldn't find it.

Is this "Agra case" the incident in Panipat where a Sister killed herself by setting fire to herself and the center-in-charge and other BKs removed the body and cleaned up the evidence before the police because involved? Yes, I'd like more details too.

As regard the CAD programme, we are still no further forward ... was it the change in diet and exercise that "saved" the individuals, or the BK meditation? As we have BKs still dying of heart disease, I think we can safely say it was the diet and exercise. A minor point is alluded to in the scientific paper, that of how well the BK programme helped people stick to their regime changes but not many conclusions were drawn from it.

I was not in Abu for Kalam but I do know Kalam went on to promote another health programme, not the BKs. It was called 'Help your Body' (Kalam also patronised Sai Baba's hospitals and teaching facilities, so it's just politics). I have no idea how effective it was ... poverty and malnutrition are an even great problem ... but his speach also refers to the Global Hospital Research Centre at Mount Abu, here.

The nine-year study, Abu Healthy Heart Trial (AHHT) concluded that the practices improved CAD regression by 11.82% the pumping of pure blood into the aorta by over 30%, and caused biochemical regression in the form of reduction of cholesterol by 24% ... that is all.

It is still a HUGE way away from the results of the ordinary Californian people (50%), the rural poor (30%) Seventh Day Adventists (10%) and, above all, the Japanese people ... who have as much as 20 times less heart disease!

So what does it all mean ...?

If the BKs want to prove the BK god is good, or even that they have some social benefit, should they not be promoting the Japanese diet and lifestyle or a even return to rural Indian standards ... !?!

Does God have to come to teach the urban middle classes that their wealth and overeating is making them sick?

Or is it just all about the publicity value and social climbing ... and justify the money they got from the Indian Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO) whilst not paying for their workers?

On the basis of the research findings, has the BKWSU issued global Shrimat that all BKs should now be eating brown rice and steamed vegetables (hooray) ... or are they still eating the same?

How much money did they get from the DRDO and how much did they spend on what? We'll never get an answer for that.