Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

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ex-l

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post10 Oct 2021

Emboldened by the awareness that no one really care how crazy their beliefs are, the boys from the BKs appear becoming more & more emboldened about speaking out about them. Here's is an expert from the "Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University", BK Saravana Kumar, predicting that dinosaurs are about to come back - apparently on the evidence of a combination of the Jurassic Park movies, & the BK scripture. Supported by his audience.

Gives a good indication of where they are at, still spouting nonsense, & telling people to "just wait" 10 years when it will all just come true. He goes on to claim that dinosaurs also existed between 5,000 and 2,500 years ago ... only not in India where the BKs claim they are going to be experiencing heaven on earth having inspired the nuclear holocaust that will wipe out the rest of impure humanity.

Such are the advantages of targetting a largely uneducated following ... but how do Western BKs go along with this?
Hi Everyone

And they call this "education"??? I hope there aren't children watching this nonsense.
ONline Sakar

yes it is, you heard the saying 'fact is stranger than fiction', just wait for another 10-15 years.

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ex-l

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post10 Oct 2021

Another BK boy has even published a book of their theories which appears to have been accepted as an official publication ... 'The Secrets of Dinosaurs' by Brahma Kumaris, B.K. Rajiv Gupta.

Again, how to serious politicians, colleges & NGO organisations like the UN tolerate associations with such belief?

B.K. Rajiv Gupta appears to be a stalwart of the Brahma Kumaris 'Spiritual Applications Research Center' (SpARC) which does "research on history of the world, geography and the future of the world in relation with knowledge imparted by Brahmakumaris". Or, in other words, "making **** up" so BKism appeals slightly better to those with technical, scientific & engineering backgrounds, e.g. using decades old strategies of publishing "MOUs" with impressive sounding foreign organizations, even when the signatories ... don't even work for them any more.
According to Hindu sciptures, heaven on Earth existed during the Golden and Silver Age civilization in India on the Pangea, or Gondwana continent, while the dinosaur roamed the other part of the world, in some remoted islands, very far from the deity kingdoms...

When and where did the dinosaurs lived?

The Evolutionist believes that dinosaurs lived between 230 and 65 million years ago, in a time known as the Mesozoic Era. It is sometimes called the Age of the Reptiles. But the author believes that they lived around 5000 years ago in the Age of the Deities and not reptiles.

There are few things that led me to believe that dinosaurs existed in Golden and Silver Ages.

1. The sites containing dinosaur fossils have been distributed on all the continents— including Antarctica, which was once the part of the supercontinent “Gondwana land”. This does not mean that dinosaurs lived in polar region.
During the time of the dinosaurs, the world was much warmer, and Antarctica had forests.

So the Age of dinosaur is the Age of Gondwana land and the Age of Gondwana land is the Age of the Golden and Silver Age [5,000 to 2,500 years ago].

At that time, during Golden and Silver Ages [5,000 to 2,500 years ago], all the continents were one. Bharat (the ancient name of India) is the imperishable land...

These continents got separated at the confluence of Copper and Silver Age (Dwapuryuga) [2,500 years ago] and the Paradise were lost...

BK_dinsosaurs.jpg
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ex-l

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post10 Oct 2021

One of Rajiv's other lectures is, "The History Of Yagya And The History Of Nuclear Weapon - A Comparative Study", a strange correlation between historical events within Brahma Kumarism and the development of nuclear weapons, seemingly further normalising the idea of nuclear holocaust wiping out not just all of humanity but surely nature too.

Nice to see him use materials discovered & first published at this website ... uncredited as usual. (Hindi only). Part one is here.

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post13 Oct 2021

Karl Popper's definition of what can be put forward as a scientific theory, as opposed to a non-scientific theory, is that it can be formulated in a way that it can potentially be falsified, e.g. If I say, "Every swan I have ever seen is white" that is not a theory of swans, it's an observation.

But if I say, "Every swan I have ever seen is white therefore all swans are white", I have put forward a hypothesis that can be tested, falsified. So as long as only white swans are observed, the theory holds true. All it needs is for one black swan to exist for the theory to proven false.

Yes, indeed, Popper is saying that science cannot prove anything absolutely but only provisionally ~(as far as we currently know), but science can disprove absolutely, that science-based knowledge is built on the elimination of falsehoods and misunderstandings.

So all it needs for is for one piece of real evidence that such prehistoric creatures did exist in India to prove BK Numbskull and BK Smartalec wrong. They have set themselves up to be easily proven wrong. They really need to do their homework rather than simply make up "rational sounding" stories.

Their claim obviously does not deny dinosaurs but seeks to rationalise it within the framework of "Gyan". They do this by saying there were no dinosaurs in SatYuga Bharat but did exist elsewhere - but Gyan says the whole world was under water except for Golden Aged Bharat, so they need to sort the out, and then they say dinosaurs existed but only 5000 years ago, let's wait a few (more) years and it will be seen to be true.

So, the links below show dinosaurs found throughout the Indian subcontinent. As to the timing, well, these are dated according to various dating methods which are all cross checked with other dating methods.

BK Genius Bhai will need prove how these methods of dating are wrong then come up with a dating method that proves these fossils and bones are from no more than 5000 years ago.

India’s fossil heritage is vast. It’s also under threat

and

List of Indian and Madagascan dinosaurs
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ex-l

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post13 Oct 2021

Their "Bharat", at that time, being tucked down under Africa, next to Antartica.

I suspect apart of it is the appeal of infantile relationships between "the boys", and their "mothers", the loving but completely uneducated elder women, and even their Dadas (elder men). The boys can come up with their unchallenged fairy stories, using intelligent sounding words & (second hand, non-BK) concepts; and the mothers can coo with pride at efforts, in a sort of "my son's an "-ologist" kind of manner.

From the article,
The Indian fossil record of dinosaurs is good, with fossils coming from the entire Mesozoic era – starting with the Triassic period (a geological period that started 251.9 million years ago and continued till 201.3 million years ago), to the Jurassic period (201 million years ago to 145 million years ago) and Cretaceous period (from 145 million years ago to 66 million years ago), when globally all non-avian dinosaurs and 65 per cent of all life became extinct. Madagascar also preserves various unique dinosaurs from the Jurassic and Cretaceous.

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post13 Oct 2021

Talk of a devil, I see Julian Boles finally did publish his big book of all things theory. Along with offering a US$9,000 prize to "whoever can disprove time as cyclic" ... Flash Time: The Discovery & Meaning Of Cyclic Time. is not that a "burden of proof" fallacy, i.e. "it's true because no one can [be bothered to] prove it's untrue? It's only taken about 35 years to complete. He apparently forgot to send us a copy for review but it's on sale at a discount price on the BKs own bookshop, Inspired Silliness.

Seems to be BKism, clearly from the front cover, hiding behind the work of Immanuel Velikovsky. I wonder if he credits 'the source', i.e. BKism?

Got to love how those English public school boys still refer to each other by which boarding house they lived in 50 years ago.
Julian-Boles-Flash_Time.jpg
Julian Boles (Chandos 72)

Class News

Julian’s moving book Flash Time that revolutionises human thinking is in print with 90 pictures and causing a stir, offering a US$9,000 prize to whoever can disprove time as cyclic, hence why déjà vu shows time repeats. Revising geology he learned at Stowe and Einstein/Hawking, Flash Time shows exactly how Big Bang is impossible. This new world view is available on Amazon in print and e-versions. Already called ‘the most controversial book in history’, no-one has ever disproved it. He also continues as Director of the British Gemmological Institute (BGI) valuing rare gems for Lloyds insurers.

Interesting review on Amazon,
NONSENSE WITH NO PROOF OF ANY OF THE CLAIMS MADE IN THE BOOK
Reviewed in the United Kingdom on 3 January 2019
Verified Purchase

The author makes numerous random claims about time being a cycle of 5000 years with no scientific or credible evidence to back it up. Regularly repeats the same weak jokes and anecdotes in multiple chapters, indicating a lack of proofreading throughout. A book with made up reviews on its cover is always a warning sign - especially when they are not even given any real names or real accreditation! Even to the strangest of conspiracy theorists this book would be a waste of time as it is generally pompous and lacking in any concrete proof of anything. Childish in its writing style and childish in its methodology. A waste of time
Assertions not evidence

The book is written as assertions and questions. "What if ... is not true?" The author insists linear time is incorrect and says no one has disproved cyclical time. But this is the problem. The author presents cyclical time but does not spell out any direct evidence that it exists nor what would count as disproof. The author includes a chart of symbols from many cultures, but cites no evidence that they refer to the author's concept of cyclical time. They could refer to the cyclical pattern of the seasons or even sunrise and sunset.

The claim that one of the rings of Saturn shows a "young" age is interesting, but this assertion has no supporting citation. If it is true, it may mean the rings are a recent phenomenon or that the universe is younger than claimed. By itself it does not establish cyclical time.

The author claims science was wrong to dismiss the work of Immanuel Velikovsky, this is simply false. Velikovsky is still seen as producing pseudo-science. The author makes profound connections between superficial similarities or correlations; for example, the shape of Stonehenge is said to represent cyclic time. The henge may have more to do with the astronomical cycle and ritual - why would we expect that its builders would have a perspective outside time?

Anyone can make assertions against accepted reality and support it with a mish-mash of unconnected "facts" - witness American politics - but a new scientific paradigm needs more rigour and more data.

It is also untrue that science is necessarily locked into an incorrect worldview - many scientists rejected Einstein's understanding of space-time. Their minds were changed, not by bald assertion but, by experimental evidence. This is what this book seems to lack.
Poor writing skills spoil what could be a much better book. However, some worthwhile content.

Verified Purchase

This book seems to have been published far too quickly. Some concepts are interesting, even thought provoking, but the book needs the attention of a good editor. At the moment it reads like a late night conversation in a bar - a disjointed collection of half digested thoughts expressed despite attention deficit disorders. My advice? Skim it, cherry pick it, and then draw your own conclusions. I believe there is food for thought here, but it is a shockingly badly written piece of work.
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ex-l

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Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian Boles

Post13 Oct 2021

Julian goes on to recommend himself a Nobel Prize for his work, here (page 22 to 24).

There's a spoken interview, here, Discovery and Meaning of Cyclic Time with Jules Boles.



More reviews from Goodreads,
Elentarri wrote:Interesting concept. Flawed execution.

According to the author's hypothesis (and own words); Flash Time is "the concept that time moves in repeating cycles of events, so the universe always exists and was never formed in a Big Bang as claimed. Flash Time Zero moment or ‘effect’ occurs in a cyclical ‘instant’ in which events begin to happen again as they did before. In that ‘zero moment’ time begins again. This Flash Time model suggests the universe can ‘update itself’ faster than light via a Grid, when rotational energy imbalances trigger the ‘switch’ in Order outlined here, causing The Cycle to continue, as implied by Gödel (c1931) and Bell in 1964. This causal circle of events requires a faster-than-light cosmos thus removing the need for a slower-than-light cosmos using a ‘no communication theorem’. These issues appear resolved finally with a triple cycle entangled spacetime state where past, present and future act in unison during any one cycle, in which outcomes must conform to that pattern. Freewill is then maintained, yet depends on what was chosen in the last cycle, while usually being unknown, though not always (déjà vu applies here). Bell realised later a conflict with freewill, yet without the ‘non-linear triple cycle’ effect of entangled ‘triple time’ as above, and so decided against a perfectly repeating event sequence, even though one was implied. This Grid enables this to be so, since it appears to allow superluminal update speeds from local realism, and suggests a reform of the Dirac equation’s reliance on linear time."

I am providing Boles's own words because I am not entirely sure I understood completely what he was writing about. Flash Time is an interesting concept. However, while the author might be onto something, he does not do a very good job explaining the concept. No-one doubts time is cyclical in terms of seasonal cycles, life cycles, nutrient cycles etc; but having time go around in a circle then just start from zero again after a catastrophe doesn't really work for me. Time is still linear for those of us living on the planet. Rotating through various natural cycles (Earth-wise or cosmologically) seems pretty normal and self-evident to me, but Boles did not explain the whole start over concept to my satisfaction. Or why a particular cycle couldn't go through eons instead of the few thousand years he suggested.

The author doesn't manage to adequately explain why his numerous examples are supposed to be proof of Flash Time, rather than just proof of insufficent data, faulty hypotheses/theories or someone buggering up the mathematics. Boles criticises science for making assumptions and modifying/inventing new hypotheses, but he is quite happy to use the end-results of scientific studies when they suit his hypothesis. The author also contradicts himself, makes a vast number of wild/unsubstantiated speculations, cherry-picks DNA/geological dating results, uses old (discarded) hypotheses, and generally provides no solid evidence for flash time. This book is esentially a dissertation on what is wrong with various scientific methods and hypotheses, such as Carbon-14 dating (and other geological dating methods) and the Big-Bang. All these less than 100% accurate scientific findings are supposed to be proof of flash time. The author never states WHY this is supposed to be evidence of Flash Time, as opposed to evidence for something else, or even just evidence that scientists don't know everything. Getting the maths wrong, does not prove flash time.

The writing style of this book is not particularly pleasant as the reader has to wade through multiple repetitions, jumping around with disjointed topics (from neanderthals to the Big Bang in one paragraph), wonder where he got the information from for a large number of odd statements, and lack of cohesion. An editor would have been useful. It would be interesting to see what a physicist or cosmologist has to say about the Big-Bang chapter, since most of the theoretical physics went over my head there.

Flash time is an interesting concept, but I did not manage to grasp the concept adequatley just reading this book, nor do I agree with the manner in which the author provides "evidence" for his hypothesis. Further research is needed!
Ceri Sambrook wrote:rated it did not like it

I gave up after a couple of chapters. It read too much like a crackpot conspiracy theory. There's only so many times I can read the line '...but the facts don't add up...' when discussing modern scientific theory without the author specifying exactly what facts and why they don't add up in detail, before I get bored. Throw in a handful a rather tenuous arguments about some vague cultural or historical coincidences and I decided to not waste any more hours of my time.

It could be the author has an interesting concept to share and I am missing out on something revelatory, but the author needs to republish the book, this time with the assistance an editor and perhaps a ghost writer so it doesn't come off as the literary equivalent of listening to the fevered mumblings of a someone wearing a homemade tinfoil hat.
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Re: Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian B

Post20 Oct 2021

I must apologise to the world. I was partly responsible for convincing Julian (Jules?) Boles and his then wife Lucy that the BK Gyan had merit, and turned him into a lifelong cult devotee. His expertise in analysing gem stones, a profession shared by Dada Lekhraj, and being from an above middle class family background, endeared him to the non-egalitarian world view of the Indian Dadis and he was given lots of "attention".

I am not sure if it set up a mutually perpetuating arrangement built on sizeable and/or regular financial donations. Probably. I do know he set up some connection with some minor "VIPs", so that got him lots more of brownie points.

I remember back at the time when he became a BK - late 1970s, I had actually asked for a meeting to speak with Dadi Janki about a theory I had, not unlike his flash time idea. She entertained my enthusiasm for a few minutes then made it abundantly clear that she was uninterested, that no rationalisations were needed, just accept it at face value, no need for explanations, because it's all part of the divine revelation etc etc.

Did I seed that "theory" in his head? I do remember talking about it to different people.

If it was me, then once more I must offer my apologies to all citizens of earth. I was young and foolish. I know am less of the former so I'd like to think I have less of the latter quality as well.

As to his "offering a US$9,000 prize to "whoever can disprove time as cyclic" - I refer readers to my earlier post in this thread about how that does not fit into a basic principle of a valid scientific theory.

If a theory cannot be falsified in any way, even conceptually, it is not worth considering as a "scientific" theory, i.e. If Julian Boles wants his idea to be taken seriously as a physical, scientific theory and not simply wild conjecture, he would need to put forward how it might possibly be falsified. "My theory is valid unless you can show x,y or z"

science.jpg


So, I hereby challenge Julian Boles and anyone else - and will offer double his $US9000, I offer $US18,000 - to disprove my theory: that time is a random squiggle that sort of looks like a rabbit if you defocus your eyes :D.

More seriously, if Julian reads this, I'd like to ask him - what makes you think time has anything to do with shape or direction? It is to misunderstand what Time actually is, ontologically.

He might like to refer to current physics for its view of the nature of Time and its relationship with Space, or to catch up with the last 40 years of cosmology which has left behind the whole Big Bang idea, or rather, puts it into its place as a theory that was valid based on the evidence of its time but has since been superseded by theories based on new discoveries with more valid models built on the exponential growth in computing power etc etc.
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Re: Dinosaurs Arriving Again Beware - BK Saravana & Julian B

Post20 Oct 2021

That's a big & serious confession there. And a conscience that all of we, ex-BKs, have to bear to some degree ... the responsibility of, let's be honest, ruining some other people's lives by inveigling them into BKism. And, as Jules Boles was partly responsible for my enculturation into BKism, I'll hold you doubly responsibly & use it to manipulate your guilt.

It's one of those strange things, as with the Neville Hodgkinsons of the BK world, how can such clearly intelligent minds & good wills get so caught up in, not so much the nonsense, but also the fallacious promotions & defences of it. I mean, what is the logic of offering a £9,000 prize to argue,
"Ha!!! No one has claimed it, so it must be true!!".

In BK terms, that is an argument worthy of a Sanjay.

I have not read the book so I really have no idea what "Flash Time" is that is not BKism dressing up in pseudo-science waffle, but there is something about it as a marketing concept that can only make me thing of, "Flash ... Ah-Ha! ... Master of the Universe!". Firstly, no physicist worth his salt would get out of bed in the morning for £9,000 prize. Secondly, no physicist with any standing whatsoever could risk his credibility to go anywhere near BKism.

I am still waiting on one of them to do the maths, to work out how much energy is required to reset every molecule in the universe back to where it was 5,000 years ago, to reverse light, where it's going to come from, how "spiritual energy" converts into molecular energy, & explain how it's all going to happen etc.

I'll claim my £9,000 prize for proving the infantile state of mind necessary to believe in such fairy tales, as evidenced by your Dadi Janki comment. Janki was a demon for ripping apart in public anyone who challenged the limits of her understanding. Like you say, she was all about conforming, defering to seniority, & unquestioning clan loyalty.

Flash, ah
Saviour of the universe
Flash, ah
He'll save every one of us

Klytus I am bored
What plaything can you offer me today?
The inhabitants refer to it as the planet Earth
Most impactive, your Majesty
We'll destroy this Earth

Flash, ah
Saviour of the universe
Flash, ah
Flash, ah
Flash, ah
Flash, ah
Saviour of the universe

He's for every one of us
Stands for every one of us
He'll save with a mighty hand
Every man, every woman, every child
With a mighty flash

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