Om Radhe (Mama) and her writings

for discussing revisions in the history of the Brahma Kumaris and updating information about the organisation
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arjun

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Post24 Jan 2007

Abrahmakumar wrote:Would it be an idea to keep the Mama's Classes part of the forum just for posting the classes rather than also interspersing it with questions and answers from/to BK's/PBK's etc etc. Not that the question you ask is without merit but you can imagine what will happen if in time the users have to trawl through lots of 'chit chat' before getting to the classes.

Dear Brother,

Omshanti. That is a nice idea. And I would suggest that instead of posting the Mama's classes in this thread in this Section, you/Admin. could open a new thread exclusively for this purpose in the BK Section and make it a sticky thread. Mama's Classes which have already been posted in this thread could be shifted to that new thread in the BK section with a request to the members/visitors not to post their views/querries in that thread.

If this thread in this section is to be retained with the same name, the new thread in the BK section could be named 'Mama's classes - Gyaan Sitaar'.

This would also send a positive signal to the BKs and encourage other BKs to come and participate in this forum.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun
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abrahma kumar

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Post24 Jan 2007

Om Shanti Arjun. Thanks for your feedback and GOD only knows what scenes in the drama are unfolding regarding this thread but for sure something is going on. Ah well can somebody listen out if there will be any classes full of 'good wishes' and 'pure feelings' :lol: for that soul who is posting those Mama's words on this site. Maybe even one whole class will be dedicated to warning him of the error of his ways :roll:

As for the points you mention I have no thoughts right now beyond those which I mentioned in response to your original question. Maybe this is much ado about nothing so let's see what the drama has in store.
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ex-l

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Post22 Mar 2007

The following is faithfully represented as originally typed by MATESHWARI Saraswati in 1942. The Brahmakumaris consider "Mama", or Om Radhe as she was known, to be the number 2 soul in the whole world. "Eve" to Lekhraj Kirpalani's "Adam". The first administrative head of the BKWSU who died on 24th June 1965 but, to quote BKWSU;
BKWSU wrote:her teachings continue to guide the institution

What is notable is threefold;
    • the belief that Man is God, indeed "God's Father".
    • that God takes birth in all 4 ages of The Cycle
    • that the Brahmin religion is one of the 4 main religions
    • God is the Brahm element
    • Union is with the Brahm
By the date, this is in approximately 1942 ... 6 years later ... so what about the Divine revellation in 1936 of Shivoham, Shivoham? Something does not add up. I don't think we have been told about this ... (I may have made a Hindi typo. So native speakers, please point any out)
The BKWSU PR Machine wrote:She came into the fold during the early period of its inception. She was able to digest Godly Knowledge, revise and churn it very accurately and stood out from the rest. She had a very sharp intellect, which she mobilised in the service of God. Her original name was Radhe. She came to be known as Om Radhe. From the moment she first heard Godly Knowledge, she was overwhelmed, her mind began dancing with joy, which never stopped. Rather the spiritual intoxication grew stronger as years passed. She recognised instantly that all the sensual happiness, which the world had to offer was without taste or merit. She determined immediately to adopt a life of Yoga and devote herself to spiritual service. She wedded herself totally to God and practiced every word of Godly directions. Total dedication led to total transformation in her.

Mateshwari had a powerful personality. She seemed a veritable goddess because of her virtues. She was awesome in her demeanor yet discrete and merciful at the same time. Her memory was legendary. If she met a person once, she would recognise him/her even in a crowd or after several years. She had a soft and sweet voice and was distinguished singer. A special kind of divinity seemed to flow with her voice and her songs were balm to the heart.

Entitled "OM Geet" I believe this is one of her songs. Any information gratefully received.
Om Radhe herself wrote:*)OM.(*

GEET.

Nanush ka kya, martaba, kyun koi nahin samjhavata.
(What is man's sublimity, why none explains).

Ishwar khud ap manava, kyan koi nahin hai manta.
(Man himself is God. why no one believes).

Ishwar ka bap,manava, kyun koi nahin hai janta.
(Man is God's Father, why no one knows).

Manush tan adhar sen khud Ishwar hin bolta.
(God himself speaks with with the help of a human form).

Bigar manava vairat srishti ka ant koi nahin kholta.
(Excepting man no one explains the mystery of Manifest Creation).

Ishwar kis ko nahin kabi marta jilavata.
(God never kills or vivifies anyone).

Ishwar khud manush tan lay onborta kabi charta.
(God himself takes the human form and again relinquishes it).

Sat, Treta, Dwapur, Kali-Yuga film la palta chakkar.
(Sat, Treta, Dwapur and Kali-Yuga are in the revolving wheel of the Creative Play).

Brahman, Kshetri, Vaishya, Shudra, nam khud hai dharvata.
(Brahman, Kshetriya, Vaishya and Shudra. God himself passes through these stages).

Veda Shastra, Granth, aur masjid, tikanay, marhi mandir.
(Vedas, Shastras, Granth, and mosques, temples, shrines and churches).

Manush kay ye karma sabh, kabi, pborta aur banavata.
(These are all man's actions, some times he makes hem and some times he breaks them).

Bigar kshetra swayam Brahm karta kabi kuchi bhi nahin.
(Without the Field or body, Brahm does not do anything).

Kshetra Kshetraya Yoga sen sabhi bolta aur nahin.
(Without the union of the Field and the Knower of the Field, all go abour and speak).

Brahm hun kahita hai manava, dharta nahin nij par iman.
("I am Brahm", says man, but has no faith in Self).

Moh nija Maya men phas khud hin ko hai bharmavata.
(Entangles in his own Creation, he himself becomes Atheistic).

Gyan bin mahutaji manava ki kabi jati nahin.
(Without Divine Wisdom, servitude of man never ends).

Aham Brahmasmi nischai Swaraj Pooran pavata.
(One attains Complete Self-Rule only through firm faith in "Aham Brahm Asmi").

Om Shanti

I know some senior BKs in my local zone center know this but I was never told. Am I making too much of a little mistake? If Brahmakumari teachings evolve to separate God from the Brahm, and we give then the allowance to evolve then ...

When did it happen and when did they go back and re-write their history?

If they re-wrote their history, under whose instruction and influence?

If they did it once ... and once to cover up 1976 Destruction ... and once to cover up that they thought WWII was Destruction ... and once to fluff over the 40, 50, 60 years predictions ... how many more times have their re-written their history and philosophy over such minor issues?

Oh, and do not mention that big financial donation that bailed them out in 1950 when the coffers ran dry because they don't accept financial donations from non-BKs ... like they do not accept government grants now.

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john

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Post22 Mar 2007

If this information is from a book or pamphlet in 1942, surely there must be others.
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ex-l

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Post22 Mar 2007

John wrote:If this information is from a book or pamphlet in 1942, surely there must be others.

And surely the BKWSU must know about it ... and Dadi Janki at least remember it?

My sources suggest younger BKs than her do too.
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Om Radhe's letters to Gandhi, Princess Elizabeth, Viceroy

Post23 Mar 2007

OK. Apologise for those on dial-up again ... here are "True Copies", from the Yagya's archive sent to others, of Om Radhe's letters to Gandhi, Princess Elizabeth, Viceroy of India and others on behalf of the Yagya from around 1939 to early 40s. Remember, Om Radhe is marketed as some kind of saintly Eve, Mother of Humanity, is not she? And we all have room to worship a saintly old lady, especially one that is dead and can be re-written.

What her writing exposes during this time ... and by every account it is a direct reflection of her caste and her mentor God Lekhraj Kirpalani's self-possessed, self-important state of mind ... is that they were horrendously arrogant, despising of others and right-wing to boot. More tyrant than angel. And from what I am reading elsewhere, they believe they were the cause of WWII ... well, who knows, but it would be a psychologist's wet dream to trawl through this lot and make an analysis of what was going on amongst this "world rejecting" cult.

You can say, "oh, it was just cultural" ... well, I am sorry but no, thanks. This is the Number One and Number Two soul in action and, frankly, these modes and attitudes still run through the veins of the Brahmakumaris today, underneath the facade. For example, their love of chasing the powerful and famous. But why Princess Elizabeth? She was just 11. Did they mean King George's wife aka 'The Queen's Mother'?

Clearly they thought WWII was Destruction. The BKs could get around it and say, "oh well, WWII was the start of Destruction and Baba just gave us more time" or something. They probably will. On the otherhand, Lekhraj Kirpalani or the unholy ghost might have just got it wrong again. The failure might have explained why in the later 40s Om Mandali kind of disappeared for a while only to re-invent itself later as the Brahma Kumaris with new prophesies. The public has a short memory.

It appears that for the famous 12 years of the Yagya, they were all thinking Brahma was God. Om Shanti does not figure at all. Peace of Mind was just their first first "Living Values" program. One other thing just to throw in this pot, after Lekhraj Kirpalani's death there was actually an increase in mediumship activity all around the centers until it settle down.

They speak of the Golden Age as the "Angelic Dynasty". As you can see, no mention of God Shiva, it is all Divine Father Prajapati Brahma.

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ex-l

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Post23 Mar 2007

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Post23 Mar 2007

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Post23 Mar 2007

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Post23 Mar 2007

Now I understand better the misunderstanding about destruction and what "intoxication" means.
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john

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Post23 Mar 2007

Even from 1939, they were saying 'there's not much time left' ... cry wolf?
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Post24 Mar 2007

I was thankfully reminded that the Brahmakumaris always said that number two soul in the work; Mama or Om Radhe, was so special because she never made the same mistake twice.

Well, between 1939 and 1949 she thought Brahma was God ... may be that only counts as one mistake for 10 years? ( I may be able to prove this was form 1936 meaning 13 years and I still have not found the end point yet).

Here is another Radhe quote that I will pass on to others;
Om Radhe wrote:If only thse downtrodden, destitute, Self-unrealised Bharatvasis were to divert their attention just for a week's time from their unbecoming lust for the filthy coin, concentrate their entire intellect upon the practical happens of 5000 years or a Kalpa ago and compare the War of Mahabharat of those days with the present World War, and in addition, focus their entire brain power upon these Divine Decress in perfect solitude, there is certainly a chance that they might rise fromt heir deep slumber!

Will they rise at all?
Om Radhe wrote:Well, it can be said through Divine Insight that they certianly will, at last, but not till they breathe their last on their bed of Annihilation, as happened a Kalpa ago; but by then, it will be too late because Divine Father PRAJAPATI Brahma has Himself ordained, "One who maintains constant contact with ME, and who after due concentration of intellect upon SELF, (Man Mana Bhava, Madhyaji Bhava) address himself entirely to the task of rendering the highest Divine Services under MY guidance, will ultimately enjoy along with ME for numerous generations the Sovereignity of Vaikunth of BRAHM-PURI (Angelic World).

It is interesting, they thought the Golden Age was Angelic Age and Brahm-Puri, so that is another change they made ... or may be there is something deeper in this and these people were just very deeply confused.
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john

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Post24 Mar 2007

ex-l wrote:I was thankfully reminded that the Brahmakumaris always said that number two soul in the work; Mama or Om Radhe, was so special because she never made the same mistake twice.

Also in Murli it is says (if I recall properly) she is able to churn and understand knowledge better than BrahmaBaba.
It is interesting, they thought the Golden Age was Angelic Age and Brahm-Puri, so that is another change they made ... or may be there is something deeper in this and these people were just very deeply confused.

I do think that is correct and they were confused, but the other important thing is
    How did they get this information?
Going on from thinking the Gyan evolved over time, I think it was only revealed as per the churnings of the BKs at the time. It could be that they were given pieces of the puzzle at a time and the churning part was to put it together.

Maybe a lot of knowledge came from them interpreting divine visions and from that they tried to decipher the whole picture. The most comprehensive churnings were then put forward as the correct understanding of Gyan. Maybe also what PBKs say, holds true, that The Knowledge at that time was from another Chariot Piu and from that Piu Vani came about.

Whatever, it seems Shiva was being very incognito and the BK org appears want to keep this all under wraps.
    But what is the reasoning behind them wanting to do that?
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bansy

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Post24 Mar 2007

These letters are historically interesting. Wonder how many received replies.

BKs are told to "check the pulse" and feel the vibrations-vibes when contacting souls but how this can be achieved through letters is a puzzle.

I don't want to play down the action made. It was courageous and the BKs must have believed it to be accurate to do so at that time, as it happened during some turbulent period, not just in India but across the world. However, it cannot be as turbulent as things will and should be getting according to Gyan and The Cycle.

So does that mean we will see more new letters to dignitaries coming soon, or were these Om Radhe letters an act of desperacy?
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arjun

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Post24 Mar 2007

ex-l wrote:I was thankfully reminded that the Brahmakumaris always said that number two soul in the work; Mama or Om Radhe, was so special because she never made the same mistake twice. Well, between 1939 and 1949 she thought Brahma was God ... may be that only counts as one mistake for 10 years? ( I may be able to prove this was form 1936 meaning 13 years and I still have not found the end point yet).

As per the advanced knowledge being given by ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit), it has been said that although Mama (Om Radhe) was good at churning and narrating knowledge, she still belongs to the Moon Dynasty (Chandravansh) because she followed the Moon of knowledge (i.e. Gyaan Chandrama) Brahma (Dada Lekhraj) to be the God of Gita.

And the above historical proofs prove this statement.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun
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