Accurate remembrance

In Paramdham, the souls are in the nirsankalpi stage or beejroop (seed form) stage.

Suryavanshi Bhai, PBKs believe that Paramdham is 'dead silence' world where we cannot experience peace, bliss, happiness etc, i.e in Paramdham, souls are totally unconscious or inert like a stone on this earth. Would you like to say that this stone is in 'Nirsankalp' (thoughtless) stage? You say that we cannot become soul-conscious without a body. We could be soul-conscious or body-conscious living in the body. Similarly 'Nirsankalp' stage is achieved living in the body. The stone cannot have 'Nirsankalp' stage. Same principle may be applied to soul. If in Paramdham, the soul is intertial or unconscious, then it cannot be nirsankalp' in Paramdham, we are in our full consciousness & have experience of complete peace, bliss etc. There we are unlimited celestial degrees complete.

Again the seed of a tree is not inertial or dead. If it is so, it would not be possible to emerge The Tree from that (inertial or dead) seed. Similarly if in Paramdham, if souls are in complete 'dead silence' stage without any experience of peace, bliss, happiness etc, then how could that soul be termed as 'seed-form'? How could that unconscious soul be the seed of conscious living world???

It is hard to remember a point of light (just a point of light). There cannot be love or hate towards it.

I never understood why the BKs keep saying it is hard to remember a point of light. It is not. In a sense, all it seems to be to be is an admittance of there Bhakti dependencies/addictions, e.g. Krishna worship.What could be easier than visualizing a point of light and using it as one connection to the divine spark or Shiva? Its as easy as flicking a switch. Light in the darkness.

I can also share that in my practical Raja Yoga meditation experience there has never ever been anything easier than the 'method' which ex-l has shared with us. I never questioned its validity - having experienced the type of 'benefits' that i was after when i meditated - because it fitted in with my understanding of the form of the soul and of how I could stabilise myself in this consciousness. Ideally, it is once this awareness of my 'self' as a point became more or less 'unwavering' that i then went into 'expansion' (no need to share any of that here i do not think).

ex-l is speaking the truth when she says that BKs assert that this - point of light stuff - is a difficult process. Till now I must have totally glossed over that oblox because on the basis of my experience i never felt 'blocked' from using the point of light form in my meditation practice. There may be other reasons but who knows ...

In sharing these things, I am not claiming to have understood The Knowledge 'better' than anyone else; nor am i asserting that me or my practices have been 'elevated'. I am a mere human whose thoughts, words and actions can sometimes be a lot more screwed-up than those of a soul without knowledge. How does it go in the Murli? Something like: You are souls with good and bad sanskaras ...?

We are all different and so natural 'law' would decree that each of us will respond differently to different methods. To have one's potential for experience "inhibited" by teachings about how difficult something is could be a whole new and interesting topic.

regards
abek

Accurate remembrance will be the one according to the aim. Remembrance is the means. Remember just a point of light and become the same. Remember Narayan to become like Narayan. There is no margin for what is right and what is wrong. The Supreme Father has not come to punish us if we do wrong, but we punish ourselves with our way of thinking and acts. He only gives knowledge of what is good and what is bad and what is the relation between what we do and what we get.

Then some think that opposing the knowlegde will make it disappear, but no it is here for us. We cannot hide or change it if we don't like it, but we will have to change according to it and according to our choice and our acts we will receive what we have made effort for, and as it has been described in the know-how. That's why it is said that knowledge is light, because it throws light, gives us understanding of something, whilst ignorance is not only called not-knowing, but giving and takling wrong-false knowledge.

ShivBaba has come to give the kingdom of the world - through the power of remembrance and some soul must have taken up this aim. For him the method of remembrance is different.

Instead of making the corresponding effort for the specific aim, the aim is taken, the means i.e. rememberance is taken but knowledge (the relation between the two) is changed eg. "I am the master of the world, and i have become, because ShivBaba enters me, or I am ShivBaba himself" (I am the narrator, the one who will reveal the new knowledge, the new relation between what we do and what we get and in this new relation it is said that i do something else and receive something else)

For the No. 1 master of the world, for this kind of effort it is already too late because only one can become No. 1, the effort has been done and the status received because the Supreme Soul has come to give us the fruit of our devotion. We have done devotion in the past, according to the extent we have done we become knowledgeful here when we receive knowledge. And this knowledge will be revealed for the highest No. 1 that he will be able to realise himself first who is he that I am No. 1. Other is claiming without realisation.

This reward of knowledge and kingdom is also based on the past. Will it be fair if someone has made wrong (according to Shrimat) acts for 63 births and for 1 birth of the Confluence Age he makes the effort to wipe it out. The law is like this, or drama made in such a way, or The Knowledge describes such a case that he will not be able to make the effort for the No. 1 throne.

That's why The Knowledge is like a mirror to see our past. After Copper Age there is no Shrimat but the golden and silver ages are established according to Shrimat. So these souls who after Copper Age continue in the same, good, old way they make less mistakes. For them the effort in the Confluence Age will be easier because they will not have gone too far from what is being thought now.

The Knowledge describes that there is only one such soul who has never stepped back from what is true (Shrimat) after the Copper Age for which it is said in the Murli that there is nothing permanent on this world but ShivBaba only is permanent. So he gets entitled to the No 1 throne. For this one soul it is said in the Murli that "on uttering Baba, a point of light comes in your intellect". For the rest, on uttering Baba comes a corporeal personality with incorporeal stage. So it will also be called ignorance to deny the No 1 throne, like changing the history.

Dear John,

Imagination is impractical and reality is always practical. If I collect a bunch of souls and ask you to identify the Supreme Soul from that bunch of souls, then how can you identify Him through your imagination. But when Supreme Soul in reality comes in some body , then one can say that in this world of 500 crore souls, this is the particular Chariot in which supreme Father is carrying out His task.

Also, before Brahma Baba left the body, everyone who were in contact with Brahma Baba used to remember Supreme Soul in His body and not in Paramdham.Why would one remember Him in Paramdham when He is practically on this earth.

It is only after Brahma Baba left the body that the Supreme Soul had to take a new Chariot to play the role of Father , Teacher and Satguru. Since He has only changed His Chariot after 1969, the method of remembrance remains the same as it was during the times of Brahma Baba except that He has to be remembered now in His permanent Chariot which is the duty of we children to identify on the basis of third eye of Knowledge and not blind faith,of course.

The faulty practice of remembering Him in Paramdham started because of the assumption in the Brahmin world that He (Supreme Soul) has returned back to Paramdham. There is no point in the Murli to believe that He would leave the world stage in between without completing His task of establishment of Heaven on earth. In contrast, there are points in the Murli which on deeper understanding reveal about the future part of Supreme Soul in His permanent Chariot of the soul of Ram, the Father of Humanity. Also, no one can say that Heaven was established by 1969.

It is in the Murli, "One becomes what one remembers". So, if one has the practice to remember gross Paramdham, then one would leave the body and reach Paramdham in the end. So, gross Paramdham has not to be remembered according to knowledge.

Also, you said, "What makes remembrance practical or impractical if it is all in the Intellect/mind/thoughts". Although everything is in mind but thought is such a important energy which can make or mar one's destiny. For example, the seed of happiness and sorrow is our thought. So, the importance of each single thought cannot be undermined.

Also, as already said as you think so you become. So, since everything is in the mind, we have to give a right direction to our thoughts to reach the stage of perfection. Your quote: what is the destination of someone who remembers Shiva in the Soul World and what is the destiny of someone who remembers Shiva in a Chariot? What if they remember in the wrong Chariot?

One who remembers Supreme Soul Shiva in the Soul World would achieve only mukti.
And One who remembers Him in a Chariot will attain not only mukti but also jeevanmukti( jeevanmukti is the experience of freedom from bondages of life even though the soul is in the body). And in the Murli, it is said that I give you children the inheritance of both mukti and jeevanmukti.

If one remembers Him in a wrong Chariot, then one would imbibe the virtues of the soul to whom that Chariot belongs to.

One who remembers Supreme Soul Shiva in the Soul World would achieve only mukti.

Quick but important points (more later).

So, in this you are saying all BKs who remember Shiva in Soul World will only get mukti. Surely Golden and Silver Age is age of jeevan mukti, so that very large proportion of BKs will not come in Golden and Silver Age?

Why do senior BKs teach remembrance of Shiva in Paramdham, if they themselves do not practise it?

So, in this you are saying all BKs who remember Shiva in Soul World will only get mukti. Surely Golden and Silver Age is age of jeevan mukti, so that very large proportion of BKs will not come in Golden and Silver Age? Why do senior BKs teach remembrance of Shiva in Paramdham, if they themselves do not practise it?

We are told in the Advanced Knowledge that all the souls irrespective they come in the Golden and Silver Age or not, they receive both mukti and jeevanmukti. It means that nomatter a soul can come after Copper Age its first births are of jeevanmukti, i.e. they experience happiness through the body and don't experience sorrow. Some souls receive jeevanmukti in Iron age. The difference is that in Golden and Silver Age all souls are in a stage of jeevanmukti stage (to different extent), whilst in Copper and Iron ages some are in jeevanmukti stage and some are in stage of bondage (to different extent).

The other difference is whether the stage of jeevanmukti is achieved whilst being in the body, with the power of ones own efforts or after taking birth.

When we see, feel, hear we automatically remember that. Remembrance is natural, automatical process. For the senior BKs who have seen and experienced the Supreme Soul in the body of Brahma Baba, they naturally will remember this, even against their concious wish. That's why against the Shrimat from the Murli they keep his photo but because it is difficult to teach someone to remember something that they have not seen, experienced and because if they cannot teach rememberacne of a personality from the past, or because they don't know or don't accept any other possible Chariot than Brahma Baba, then what can they teach. They will chase the Supreme Soul back in Paramdham or put him in the Subtle Region in the body of the subtle Brahma (again against the descriptions of the Murli - that "I don't enter in the Subtle Region dweller").

This is also a way to empower ones own position, because he only came in the past - they say - and taught the ones who were there at that time (me) so now when he is not here there you have to study from me. This is the shooting of the bodily gurus. And since they could be souls who don't make the effort to come directly in Golden Age with the body, because whatever you remember, so you become, then whatever aim they take - they teach others the same. They leave the body like Brahma Baba.

But we are taught that easy Raja Yoga cannot be though by anyone else other than the Supreme Father. So what they teach is human being's hatha Yoga of effort. In such cases it is checked whether one will listen to what is said in the Murli or to what it is thought by the BKs, because there is contradiction between both and some prefer the teachings of the BKs and this is the shooting of the different religions of following different leaders. That's why also the ability to remember now something or other or kepp someone's or others' company, is also atributed to the past experiences with the different souls belonging to different religions.

Please, inform if these possible answers have been satisfactory to you.

Please, inform if these possible answers have been satisfactory to you.

Not at all. Please Andrey, do not feel obliged to answer further.

I was asking Suryavanshi to explain his/her statements on Mukti and Jeevanmukti.

Imagination is impractical and reality is always practical. If I collect a bunch of souls and ask you to identify the Supreme Soul from that bunch of souls, then how can you identify Him through your imagination. But when Supreme Soul in reality comes in some body , then one can say that in this world of 500 crore souls, this is the particular Chariot in which supreme Father is carrying out His task.

If as PBKs claim 3 souls enter Virendra Dev Dixit, then how do you identify which one is Shiva.

Also, before Brahma Baba left the body, everyone who were in contact with Brahma Baba used to remember Supreme Soul in His body and not in Paramdham.Why would one remember Him in Paramdham when He is practically on this earth.

Can you really say ALL BKs remembered Shiva in the body before 1969. Were you around at the time?

Brahma Baba except that He has to be remembered now in His permanent Chariot which is the duty of we children to identify on the basis of third eye of Knowledge and not blind faith,of course.

I really like your assertion here, nothing, not even Advanced Knowledge should be taken on blind faith.

n contrast, there are points in the Murli which on deeper understanding reveal about the future part of Supreme Soul in His permanent Chariot of the soul of Ram, the Father of Humanity.

What you are really saying is 'with a different interpretation'?

If one remembers Him in a wrong Chariot, then one would imbibe the virtues of the soul to whom that Chariot belongs to.

There has been some talk of sex in connection with Virendra Dev Dixit and some surrendered Sisters, which no PBK has yet confirmed or denied, can you confirm or deny that?

Dear John,

Just a short post here ... will write more later ...

As andrey has already explained, everyone will receive mukti and jeevanmukti from Supreme Father but the difference is some souls will expereince both in this birth itself and others will experience jeevanmukti in their first birth after destruction.

Also, souls have different perception of mukti. For some it is leaving the body and reaching Paramdham to get freedom from sorrrows. For others , it is the stage to be experienced while in this body only. Both groups will receive mukti in the same way as they perceive it to be.

So, those who perceive mukti as soul leaving the body and reaching Paramdham will get this kind of mukti. And then in their next birth in the Golden or Silver Age( depending on one's efforts in this Confluence Age) when the soul enters the body ,it will experience jeevanmukti.

But, Supreme Father has come to give as the inheritance of mukti and jeevanmukti in this birth itself (if one studies now, then one should get his/her degree in this life itself and not in the next birth). So, when in the previous post I wrote that some will only get mukti and some will get both. I was talking about this birth and not the next birth (first birth) in the broad drama.

I was talking about this birth and not the next birth(first birth ) in the broad drama.

Thank you for clarifying, that makes more sense. So from that, which souls or how many would become karmateet in this very life, i.e. not having to experience Dharamraj to get complete purification and be considered to have achieved JeevanMukti?

I thought it was only a very few souls who did not experience purification through Dharamraj.

New Knowledge,

A soul is not a stone but a conscious entity as we all already know. Nirsankalpi stage is the state of the soul in which the soul is not affected by the happenings in the outside world. It is as if completely oblivious of the happenings of the outer world though the soul is in this world in the body.The soul is instead absorbed in the remembrance completely.

If we hit a stone then we hurt but the stone is not affected a least. It is not hurt at all by the external blow in other words . So, when a soul attains that nirsankalpi stage in the body it will not be affected even if one hurts that soul. The state of soul would be the same before and after one hurts that particular soul, i.e. there will be no change in the state of the soul as if it is in Paramdham. It is then said that the soul has achieved satgati. So, when a soul is in the Paramdham it is not affected by anything. It does not experience any sorrow or happiness. So, when one attains that state in this body itself then one can be said to be in Paramdham in this world itself.That is also equivalent to be in muktidham or shantidham.

So, at the end Paramdham, muktidham or shantidham will be on this earth and not somewhere above (although existence of gross Paramdham is not denied here). Since sukhdham (or swarg or Vaikunth or heaven) would be on this earth .similarly the shantidham would be also on this earth itself. In Sakar Murli, it is said that in your one eye there should be shantidham and in the other eye there should be sukhdham. That is ShivBaba wants we children to have an aim to reach these two dham. Souls would reach these dham numberwise.

It is only through complete Gyan can true satgati be attained.True satgati is the one described above and not the soul leaving this body and reaching Paramdham. Even people who do not believe in Gyan would attain that kind of satgati. So, real challenge is to attain satgati while the soul exist in this body.The method of satgati is Shrimat and Shrimat is the mat or opinion of only supreme Father. Ek Satguru hi hamaari sacchi satgati kar saktaa hai (There is only one Satguru[ supreme Father] who can help us attain true satgati.

Satgati is not possible through any bodily being on this earth even if that person is a big brahmakumar or brahmakumari. All except supreme Father are bodily beings, i.e they have their own bodies. Murli says that Shrimat se satgati aur manushya mat se durgati (Shrimat only can help one to achieve the perfect stage and not the opinion of bodily beings).

I thought it was only a very few souls who did not experience purification through Dharamraj.

Om Shanti. As I know only top 8 and BB with Mama won't experience that. All others will, according to their number. The higher number (I mean 178999 higher than 16555) the more punishment from Dharmraj.

With regards, Shankar

If as PBKs claim 3 souls enter Veerendra Dev Dixit, then how do you identify which one is Shiva.

Firstly, it is the Shrimat of Supreme Father that we children do not have to distinguish whether it is soul of Ram or soul of Krishna or soul or Shiv baap speaking through this Chariot. We just have to understand that He (Supreme Soul Shiv) is speaking through this Chariot. Whatever is spoken by soul of Ram or Krishna is the responsibility of the Supreme Father.

But one can distinguish (which is against Shrimat) because if supreme Father is speaking He will only speak the points of knowledge. The souls of Ram or Krishna will speak about their lives or about the dharna and divine virtues. But it is not advisable to distinguish. The points of Gyan spoken by Supreme Father are such that they cannot be spoken by any other soul on this earth. It is only through Gyan spoken by Supreme Soul can one identify Him to be in this Chariot because one cannot see the soul.

In Murli also it is asked, how can one say Supreme Soul is in this particular body? And the answer is given that One can identify Him only through The Knowledge He speaks while in that body. The Gyan He spoke through the body of Brahma Baba was new (which is not in any worldly scriptures). In other words, this Gyan was not spoken by any human soul on this earth until then.

Even the soul of Brahma did not know anything about this before. You can ask this question to yourself that why did you believe Supreme Soul to be in the body of Brahma Baba before 1969. Why did you accept this knowledge and became a BK? The answer would definitely be that Gyan spoken through Brahma Baba by Supreme Soul Shiv was completely new, logical and absolute truth.The Gyan fitted in your intellect and you became the mouth born child of Brahma. You did not accept The Knowledge at BK organization just because everyone said that Supreme Soul had spoken that Gyan.

The same way one can identify Him to be completing His task of establishment of Heaven on earth in this permanent Chariot of the present.

Why do senior BKs teach remembrance of Shiva in Paramdham, if they themselves do not practise it?

Firstly, why do you say that BK do not practice the remembrance of Shiv in Paramdham?
And secondly if they do not remember Shiv in Paramdham then where do they remember Him?

Firstly, Why do you say that BK do not practice the remembrance of Shiv in Paramdham? And secondly if they do not remember Shiv in Paramdham then where do they remember Him?

I made an assumption here that you were saying that BKs before 1969 remembered Shiva in the body of Brahma and souls becoming BKs after 1969 remembered Shiva in Paramdham.

Therefore older BKs like the Dadis and Didis still remembered in body of Brahma, even though the general teaching was to remember Shiva in Paramdham after 1969. Actually, I do not know myself if they remembered Shiva in body of Brahma before 1969 as no BK has come along to confirm it. I was taught as a BK to remember Shiva in Paramdham (gross Soul World) I assumed at the time that all BKs did the same. So to clarity over this can you explain what you know in these matters?

Firstly, it is the Shrimat of Supreme Father that we children do not have to distinguish whether it is soul of Ram or soul of Krishna or soul or Shiv baap speaking through this Chariot. We just have to understand that He( Supreme Soul Shiv) is speaking through this Chariot. Whatever is spoken by soul of Ram or Krishna is the responsibility of the Supreme Father.

Where was this Shrimat given? I have never seen in any Murli, that whatever is spoken by Ram is the responsibility of the supreme Father.

The points of Gyan spoken by Supreme Father are such that they cannot be spoken by any other soul on this earth.It is only through Gyan spoken by Supreme Soul can one identify Him to be in this Chariot because one cannot see the soul.

Yet the other parties say they are speaking new knowledge and it is from the Supreme God Father. In Advanced Knowledge what is new?

The lectures are Murli clarifications, not new Murli, it is an explanation of the old Murlis and how it fits in with the old scriptures and how it all circles around Virendra Dev Dixit and Shiva. In Murli Shiva says 'I never pick up any scriptures to read, it is the human gurus who do that'.

I was taught as a BK to remember Shiva in Paramdham (gross Soul World) I assumed at the time that all BKs did the same."

As already discussed in detail in previous posts, the remembrance of Shiv in gross Paramdham or remembrance of gross Paramdham itself is not practical and complete inheritance is not acheived by that kind of remembrance. The correct interpretation of the Murli does not call for this kind of remembrance as discussed so far. It is only due to misinterpretation.

Where was this Shrimat given? I have never seen in any Murli, that whatever is spoken by Ram is the responsibility of the supreme Father.

There are Murli points which indicate this:

Ek baap doosra na koi (one Father none other )... i.e. you children have to remember me alone because even these Ram and Krishna are human souls who degrade to a lower stage after many births.

"Is Brahma ki bhi photo nahi rakhni hai tumhein" ... you children don't have to keep the photo of even this Brahma.i.e. do not remember this Brahma also.

"Is Brahma mein bhi mujhe Yaad karo" ... (Remember Me even in this Brahma).

So, it can derived from these points that our intellect should not differentiate between them instead we have to fit in our intellect that Shiv is speaking through this Chariot. If we distinguish then, our remembrance will be broken intsead of being stable in the remembrance of One and no other.Even if they speak anything in between then Supreme Soul will take care of that ... it is not our job.He is the Authority in that Chariot.

I would come up with more points later , in this regard.

"Yet the other parties say they are speaking new knowledge and it is from the Supreme God Father.

In Kalyug, there is dominance of Raavan Rajya and there are lots of other religions each trying to claim its superiority over the other. But we understand that since God is One, Truth is also One. So, since truth is only one, others are false by default. It is the test of our intellect to judge for ourselves and understand where is the ultimate truth. Why do you say that Brahmin religion established by Brahma is the truth and all other worldly religions (Christian, Buddha, Muslim, Sanyaas , Sikh dharma, etc.) are not the ultimate truth. Why do you follow the Brahmin dharma and not other religions of the world.

Because you recognised that real truth is in this religion. Now, again amidst these multiple parties coming up(they are like other religions trying to prove their superiority over each other ), it is again the time to identify through The Knowledge the true Chariot in which supreme Father is accomplishing His final task of establishment of Devi-Devtaa religion on this earth and destruction of all the other religions which are untruth. Truth cannot be destroyed. What is false will not stand the test of the time. The boat of truth will shake but not sink.

"In Advanced Knowledge what is new?

Knowledge becomes new when one delves into the deeper meaning of the Murlis and understands them deeply.( If you read some text book on a particualr subject and re-read that same matter again, then you must have expereinced that what you understood previously during your first reading is totally different from what you understand now after your second reading. So, here after second reading your level of understanding has definitely improved and you have a better grasp of the subject now compared to before).

Since the words spoken by Supreme Soul are not superficial (have deeper meanings) and since those words cannot be spoken by any human soul on this earth because everyone is in the bondage of life and death, therefore those words cannot be understood also deeply by any human soul on this earth.If they were understood in depth by anyone( human soul ) after they were merely spoken( not clarified) by Supreme Soul, then heaven on this earth should have been established after Murlis were spoken.

So, this shows that clarification of those words or exact interpretation of those words is also the task of the Supreme Soul and not within the capacity of any human soul on this earth. He cannot clarify them by sitting in Paramdham. He has to enter some Chariot to accomplish this task after 1969.

how it fits in with the old scriptures and how it all circles around Veerendra Dev Dixit and Shiva. In Murli Shiva says 'I never pick up any scriptures to read, it is the human gurus who do that'.

I have not understood properly what you say in the last paragraph of your post. If you can write in more detail, then I can get a better idea of what you are saying.