True Knowledge

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suryavanshi

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True Knowledge

Post15 Jan 2008

Dear All,

Complete Knowledge of the self is true knowledge.

When we say "complete knowledge of the self", then it is The Knowledge of 84 births that the soul has taken. When a detailed or complete picture of the 84 births taken by a soul is realised, then only that soul would be considered as true "Gyani soul".

Till then, each soul is agyani or ignorant one. When one has realised this complete self-truth, then there is nothing else left to be known. The soul has become complete and has no desire to know anything then.

This wonderful realisation will be numberwise. The seed of this human tree (soul of Ram) has to attain, or will attain, this complete knowledge first and then it will be numberwise for other souls.

Om Shanti.
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ex-l

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Post16 Jan 2008

I do not know of one BK that has self-knowledge of all their birth. I do agree in theory that this would be "self-realisation" and it is the sort of "self-realisation" that is always spoken of by saints, gurus, Lamas and so on. It is said they do.

Indeed, even Lekhraj Kirpalani and the all dead Didis and Dadis did not have had this, they ... and the organization still ... has no idea if they took 83, 84, or even 64 births. They have no idea.

A handful of BKs might claim to know one or a few of their previous births and yet how can we tell if that is just wishfulfillment and imagination. Even Virendra Dev Dixit does not apparently know his last birth as Skewakram. And when pressed, the answer you will get is the usual nonsense.

You are right. the entire family parrots "Remember your 84 births ... Remember your 84 births" and yet not one does. If pressed, they just say, "Oh, Remember Baba ... Remember Baba" calling it down to Maya and skipping the question. So much for self-realisation.

Who really knows if they have had 84 births or only one?

shivsena

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Re: True Knowledge

Post16 Jan 2008

suryavanshi wrote:Complete Knowledge of the self is true knowledge. This wonderful realisation will be numberwise. The seed of this human tree (soul of Ram) has to attain, or will attain, this complete knowledge first and then it will be numberwise for other souls.

Dear suryavanshi Bhai.

I fully agree with you that only after Ram reaches his 100% nirakari stage, then He will have a realisation of his 84 births and only after that, all rudra 108 souls will also have the realisation of their 84 births numberwise.

It has been said in Murlis that ''pahele ShivBaba hai swadarshan-chakradhari aur phir woh aakar Brahmin bacchon ko numberwar swadarshan-chakradhari banate hain.''(ie Ramshivbaba first becomes swadarshan-chakradhari and then whosoever recognises Ramshivbaba, then that soul also will realise his 84 births). Those souls who do not recognise Ramshivbaba will not get any realisation of 84 births and that is why the vijaymala souls(queens), who do not recognise Ramshivbaba will never get self-realisation of 84 births. (as it has been said in Murlis that only ''Brahmin hi swadarshan-chakradhari hote hai, devta swadarshan-chakradhari nahin hote'')

shivsena.

suryavanshi

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Post18 Jan 2008

Those souls who do not recognise Ramshivbaba will not get any realisation of 84 births and that is why the vijaymala souls(queens), who do not recognise Ramshivbaba will never get self-realisation of 84 births. (as it has been said in Murlis that only ''Brahmin hi swadarshan-chakradhari hote hai, devta swadarshan-chakradhari nahin hote'')

But the rudramala is said to be of 500 crore souls. The whole world will recognise the Father in the end and everyone will become a Brahmin, so self-realisation will come to all numberwise.

suryavanshi

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Post19 Jan 2008

How is this self realization (complete knowledge of 84 births) going to occur or in other words what is the process that any soul will have to pass through to achieve this self realization?

This self realization should be based on the formula given in Gyan. It is a systematic process that each soul will pass through to attain this self realization. The number one soul (Soul of Ram) will catch hold of this subtle process first and attain the self realization first of all in this world. Then, it will be number wise for others.

This self realization is partially dependent on the shooting that the soul is undergoing in this new birth as a Brahmin. The subtle shooting of thoughts, words and action that the soul is going through currently in the shooting period does reflect the part of the soul in the broad drama.

Another important point here is that as much as one remains in the nirakari state (incorporeal/soul conscious state/seed stage), more and more one will travel further towards complete self-realization. So, this effort to remain in nirakaari stage is also number wise. Number one soul (soul of Ram) will be more nirakari compared to the number two and so on.
Toh is cchotein sein Sangamyug ke aloukik jeevan, aluokik praptiyaan, aloukik anubhav ko dwapar sein bhakton ne bhinna bhinna naam sein yaadgaar banaa diye hain. Ek janma ki aapki yah jivan, Bhakti ke 63 janmon ke liye Yaad kaa saadhan ban jaati hain, AV Vani 7/3/86.


So, the acts that a soul performs in Sangamyug, the method of remembrance that the soul adopts,extent of God consciousness that the soul develops and all the efforts made by the soul in Sangamyug to become soul conscious will be repeated by the soul in the 63 births of "Bhaktimarg" from Dwaparyug. And whatever is done in the past 63 births by a soul, will certainly appear in front of the soul or will be repeated by the soul in just one birth of the Sangamyug, i.e. the soul will repeat all the 63 births of the past Bhakti in just one birth of Sangamyug.

This subtle Bhakti of 63 births will not be considered to be over until the soul becomes constant and complete soul conscious which is equivalent to the start of the so called 21st birth of Swarg or 1st birth out of the 21 births in Satyug and Tretayug because swastithi sein bantaa hain swarg aur par-stithi sein banta hain nark. So, "bani banaayee ban rahee abh kuch banni nahi"

shivsena

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Re:

Post29 Sep 2008

suryavanshi wrote: But the rudramala is said to be of 500 crore souls.

Dear suryavanshi Bhai,

Are you quoting this from Murlis which you have read or just quoting from Advanced Knowledge given in cds. I believe that rudramala consists of 108 souls only (''koto mein koi aur koi mein bhi koi'') and the whole world will accept these 108 souls as their ancestors (purvaj) and will know God through these bap-samaan Farishta souls numberwise. (Vani point: ''apne apne ishta-dev dwara BapDada ki pratyakshata hogi'').

shivsena.
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arjun

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Re: True Knowledge

Post30 Sep 2008

shivsena wrote:Are you quoting this from Murlis which you have read or just quoting from Advanced Knowledge given in cds.

I think what suryavanshi Bhai has written is also correct from what I have read in Sakar Murlis.

shivsena

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Re: True Knowledge

Post01 Oct 2008

Dear arjun Bhai.

If all 500 crore souls are rudramala souls, then why it is said in Murlis that "koto mein koi aur koi mein bhi koi malaa ka danaa bante hai."

If anytime you come across the Murli point that all ''500 crore are rudramala souls'' then please quote the date.

shivsena.
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arjun

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Re: True Knowledge

Post08 Oct 2008

shivsena wrote:If all 500 crore souls are rudramala souls, then why it is said in Murlis that "koto mein koi aur koi mein bhi koi malaa ka danaa bante hai." If anytime you come across the Murli point that all ''500 crore are rudramala souls'' then please quote the date.

I had requested the nimit Sisters to provide Murli points, if any, on the above subject. And they have provided the following points:
1. Saari duniya bhi rudramala hai. Prajapita Brahma kee maalaa bhi hai. (Mu. 21.3.69, pg.2 published by BKs in Hindi)
2. Saari duniya may job hi aatmaen hain sab rudramala hai. (Mu. 7.5.83 published by BKs in Hindi)
3. Yah toh samajhtey ho devtaaen kiskay mala hain? Prajapita Brahma ke. Vah rudramala saari duniya kee hai. Fir har yek dharma kee alag mala. Devi-devtaaon kee alag mala. Unka badaa Prajapita Brahma. Islaami ka Ibrahim. Bauddhiyon ka Buddh. (Mu. 29.6.68, pg.1 published by BKs in Hindi)

The approximate English translation is as follows:
1. The entire world is also rudramala. There is a rosary of Prajapita Brahma as well. (Mu. 21.3.69, pg.2 published by BKs in Hindi)
2. All the souls that exist in the entire world are part of the rudramala. (Mu. 7.5.83 published by BKs in Hindi)
3. You understand that deities belong to whose rosary? To the rosary of Prajapita Brahma. That rudramala is of the entire world. Then every religion has its own rosary. The deities have a separate rosary. Their head is Prajapita Brahma. Ibrahim is (the head) of Islamic people. Buddha is (the head) of the Buddhists. (Mu. 29.6.68, pg.1 published by BKs in Hindi)

shivsena

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Re: True Knowledge

Post08 Oct 2008

Dear arjun Bhai.

I am aware of all the Murli points you have quoted about rudramala and i still repeat what i have said many times before. All BKs and PBKs take the Murli points in the literal sense about the hadh ka drama(hadh ka meaning) and Baba says everything about the behad ka drama and only his behad ke bacche(108) will take it in behad ka sense. So when it is said that ''sari duniya hai rudramala" it means that only 108 is rudramala to ShivBaba as they are the ones who recognise the practical personified form of Rudra ShivBaba and the rest of the world will just remember God as bindi-incorporeal-nirakar and so cannot be rightly included in true rudramala.

shivsena.
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arjun

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Re: True Knowledge

Post09 Oct 2008

shivsena wrote:If anytime you come across the Murli point that all ''500 crore are rudramala souls'' then please quote the date.

shivsena wrote:I am aware of all the Murli points you have quoted about rudramala and i still repeat what i have said many times before.

If you were already aware of all these Murli points, why did you ask me to quote them in the first place. It would have saved so much of time not just for me but for the nimit Sisters also. Please cooperate with us in this aspect.

shivsena

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Re: True Knowledge

Post09 Oct 2008

arjun wrote: If anytime you come across the Murli point that all ''500 crore are rudramala souls'' then please quote the date.
If you were already aware of all these Murli points, why did you ask me to quote them in the first place. It would have saved so much of time not just for me but for the nimit Sisters also. Please cooperate with us in this aspect.

Dear arjun Bhai.
I had never read the words ''500 crore souls are rudramala souls'' in Murlis, but i was aware of the rest of the points you have quoted, so i made that statement. Anyway, if you feel that revision and re-revision of Murli points is a waste of time, then i am sorry for it and i will think twice before asking for them next time.
shivsena.

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