Accurate Yaad (Accurate Remembrance)

Dear John soul,

Only the points related to BK-PBK issues are edited. But dharna points are not edited. I will write about ego in detail in the next post.

Quoted from the BK Section for reference:

228.
“Shiv means point. A soul itself is a point, isn’t it? What is a star? How small is it? It is not as if the souls would go up and grow in size. It is a sign (of the soul) that is shown in the middle of the forehead. It is even said that a wonderful star shines in the middle of the forehead. So, certainly only such a small soul would be able to live in the middle of the forehead. So, as the soul, so is the Supreme Soul. But it is a wonder that the part of all the births is recorded in every such small soul which never gets erased. It will go on for ever. These are so secret matters. Were such matters narrated earlier? Earlier it used to be said that He (i.e. God) is in the form of a ling; He is in the shape of a thumb. Had these matters been narrated earlier you would not have been able to understand. Now it fits into your intellect. Everyone would say that it is a star. Even the visions that people have are of stars only.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 22.02.08, pg.2&3 published by BKs in Hindi, narrated by ShivBaba through Brahma Baba; translated by a PBK; the words within brackets in the English version have been added by the translator to clarify the meaning)

I think this issue was discussed long ago. It is only a proof that in the initial days of the Yagya BKs used to remember Shiva in the form of a ling and then in the form of the shape of a thumb and then in the form of a point of light/star. Remembrance of this point of light Shiva in the middle of the forehead of Brahma Baba must have evolved much later on.

Can a PBK and a current BK.Share exactly how they do Yaad? What do they remember exactly? (I think this is very important to understand this). I am trying to understand if both the PBK and BK are doing correct Yaad. Please be as descriptive as possible, for example, do you remember someones body (which one) or no body and do you remember anything else?

Omshanti. As already described in this thread, I, as a PBK try to remember the incorporeal God Father Shiva through the body of His appointed Chariot (according to me) Baba Virendra Dev Dixit (known as Shankar/soul of Confluence-Aged Ram/Confluence-Aged Krishna/Confluence-Aged Narayan in the advanced knowledge). Just as some BKs try to visualize Shiva in the middle of the forehead of Brahma Baba, in the same way I try to visualize Shiva in the middle of the forehead (between the two eyebrows) of Baba Virendra Dev Dixit.

To be true, I hardly get any time to especially sit and remember Baba, the remembrance is mostly while performing some or the other action, like cooking, bathing, travelling by bus, exercising, walking, etc.

As a BK, I used to remember Shiva either as a point of light in the Soul World or as a point of light in the middle of the forehead of Brahma Baba.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

It is only a proof that in the initial days of the Yagya BKs used to remember Shiva in the form of a ling and then in the form of the shape of a thumb and then in the form of a point of light/star. Remembrance of this point of light Shiva in the middle of the forehead of Brahma Baba must have evolved much later on.

It would be good to have specific dates for each of these.

They must have evolved fairly quickly during the 1950s and early 60s and I wonder why and under whose influence. The "middle of the forehead" perhaps even later.

Arjun,

Thanks very much for your explanation. I am wondering is it possible that the soul one might be visualizing in the middle of Virendra Dev Dixit could be mistaken as his own soul and not Shiva's?

I am trying to understand the term used in BK knowledge "Easy Raja Yoga" your method seems relatively easy. I am just concerned how can one identify between Virendra Dev Dixit soul and Shiva's soul because if we remember Virendra Dev Dixit than do we not become like him?

Is there not a chance of a mistake in this?

Thanks for your response and patience.

I am wondering is it possible that the soul one might be visualizing in the middle of Veerendra Dev Dixit could be mistaken as his own soul and not Shiva's?
I am trying to understand the term used in BK knowledge "Easy Raja Yoga" your method seems relatively easy. I am just concerned how can one identify between Veerendra Dev Dixit soul and Shiva's soul because if we remember Veerendra Dev Dixit than do we not become like him?
Is there not a chance of a mistake in this?

Your doubt is valid. Shivsena Bhai also raised a similar question earlier. But ShivBaba has given a direction to the children that we should observe ShivBaba and not the soul of the corporeal Chariot. We should always think that it is ShivBaba who speaks. Here is a related Murli point:
"Baba-Mamma cannot go to the exhibition to explain. When a big personality comes from abroad, then so many people go to see him that who has come. This (Father) is so incognito. Father says – I speak through the body of this Brahma. I am only responsible for this child. You always think that it is ShivBaba who speaks. He teaches. You must observe only ShivBaba; you must not observe him (i.e. Brahma). Consider yourself to be a soul and remember the Supreme Soul Father.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 06.04.05, pg 3 published by BKs)
If we observe only the Supreme Soul Shiv through the corporeal medium then we will not be influenced by the actions of the corporeal medium. And even if any mistake is commited by the corporeal medium, ShivBaba is responsible for that or to correct it.

Can any PBK send me the quote and date of Murli in which Shiva mentions that ''nirakar ko saakaar mein Yaad karo''?(i have 30 registers of Murlis and i have not found this quote in Murli.)

Whilst explaining how not to remember the above passage does not give an explanation of remembering Shiva Baba in the corporeal.

Dear Brothers,
Omshanti. I have come across a Murli point in my records which speaks about remembering the incorporeal through the corporeal.
• "Yah ShivBaba ka Yagya hai. Toh Maat-Pita ikatthey hain. In Mama Baba say toh kuch bhi nahee miltaa. Behad kay baap say hee sab kuch miltaa hai. Vah ek hai. Mama Baba kahaa jaata hai shareerdhaari ko. Niraakaar ko toh shareer hai nahee. Toh Baap kahtey hain ki saakaar kaa bhi mureed mat bano. Yaad maamekam ko karo.....Mahima ek kee hee hai. Unkay sadkey inka maan hai. Tumko koi bhi dehdhaari ko Yaad nahee karnaa hai. Dehdhaari say unka parichay miltaa hai. Lekin Yaad unko karnaa hai. Baba bhi dehdhaari hai, sab parichay detey hain. Parantu bahut aisey bhi besamajh bachhey hain jo kahtey hain ham toh direct ShivBaba kee prerana say gyaan ley saktey hain. Agar aisa hota toh fir is rath may unko aaney kee kyaa darkaar padee hai. Aisey bhi hain jo samajhtey hain is saakaar say hamaara kyaa kaam. Baap kahtey hain manmanaabhav. Unko Yaad karo parantu through toh inkay kahtey hain na." (BKs dwara prakaashit revised Sakar Murli taareekh 16.03.06, page 1 & 2)

“This is a Yagya of ShivBaba. So Mother and Father are together. Nothing is achieved through this Mamma-Baba. Everything is achieved from the unlimited Father. He is one. Mamma-Baba are said to be bodily beings (dehdhaari). The incorporeal one does not have a body. So Father says that do not become the followers (mureed) of the corporeal. Remember none but one (maamekam)....The praises are for ‘one’ only. This corporeal is respected because of Him. You must not remember any bodily being. His introduction is received through the bodily being. But we must remember Him. Baba is also a bodily being. He gives the entire introduction. But there are many such ignorant children who say that we can obtain direct knowledge with the inspiration of ShivBaba. Had it been so, then where is the need for Him to come in this Chariot? There are such people also who think that we do not have any dealing with the corporeal. Father says Manmanaabhav. Remember Him, but it is said ‘through him’, isn’t it?” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 16.03.06, page 1 & 2 published by BKs)
I think the above point is fairly clear about the process of remembering ShivBaba.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Arjun,

Thank you very much.

For some clarification if you remember the way Virendra Dev Dixit moves is this accurate or does the point of light in the middle of the forehead need to be there?

Much appreciate it because I believe when I wen't to BK center that this is to be Easy Yoga and did not find this as such by sitting and meditating.

Thanks,

For some clarification if you remember the way Veerendra Dev Dixit moves is this accurate or does the point of light in the middle of the forehead need to be there?

I suppose you are asking that if we remember ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) as a person on move or as a person doing some work, then do we need to see the point of light in the middle of the forehead? I think it is preferable/better if you are able to see the point of light Shiv in the middle of his forehead even while remembering him as a person on move or as a person doing some work, but it is also OK if you remember His Chariot but with a consciousness that the Chariot belongs to the point of light Shiv and not to the soul of the Chariot.

Much appreciate it because I believe when I wen't to BK center that this is to be Easy Yoga and did not find this as such by sitting and meditating.

Here are a couple of Murli points that support your view:
"One must remember Baba every second. It is not a question of sitting in faith (neshtha) at one place. One must be in remembrance even while walking and moving.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 01.10.05, page 3 published by BKs in Hindi and translated by a PBK)

"Ghar-ghar may tum yah hospital khol do. Tumhaarey hospital may davaai aadi kuchh bhi nahee hai, sirf Baap ka parichay dena hai ki uthtey-baithtey Baap ko Yaad karo. Aisey nahee ki ek jagah baith jaanaa hai. Yah toh jab koi Yaad nahee kartey hain toh sangathan may bithaya jaataa hai, sangathan may bal milega." (Brahmakumariyon dwara prakaashit revised Sakar Murli, dinaank 17.09.07, pg 2)

"Open this hospital in every home. There is no medicine, etc. in your hospital. You should just give the introduction of the Father that - remember the Father while standing and sitting. It is not that you have to sit at one place. When someone does not remember (the Father) then they’re made to sit in a gathering so that they get power in the gathering." (Revised Sakar Murli dated 17.09.07, pg 2 published by BKs in Hindi, translated by a PBK, narrated by ShivBaba through Brahma Baba)

With regards,
OGS,
Arjun

There is really no big deal about the Beggary Period ... Why did they go and get jobs like the rest of us rather than poncing off donations even back then? Who made then have to live without working? It only came Lekhraj Kirpalani ran out of money. It is a utterly false myth. No money ... go into business or get a job ... it is as simple as that. ... Then BKs do not call themselves "Half-caste" Brahmins. ... If the BKs insist on "serving us" ... cant they send someone more pukka? ... 26 out of 900,000 ... hardly a strong argument ... I know this to be true.

Dear ex-l Soul,

1) I had heard in a general class in Madhuban (may be around 1990) that during beggary part, there was not even a bit of worry in BB (Brahma Baba)’s face. Once during BB’s operation, there was need of blood. But BB said, I refuse blood and said he would not like blood of a body-conscious (means vikaari, may be) person putting into God’s Chariot. Then the BKs present there sent Sandeshi and got instruction from ShivaBaba and then only blood was donated to BB. Such a sacrifice and determination he had. During the beginning of Yagya, BB invited the person (whose aim was to murder BB and was sent by anti- om-mandli party) lovefully and the person apologized and left off happily. *Now - I do not have any proof for these and hence incapable of explaining you to the full extent. So I will take step backward in such issue/matters.

2) Then BKs do not call themselves "Half-caste" Brahmins. That is also not true. "Half-caste Brahmin" has a specific meaning within BKWSU. There are many other similar errors in your posts. You seem to think that by flooding people's minds with so much stuff you can appear correct. I don't understand why someone that cannot even go to morning class is here pretending to be the embodiment of The Knowledge. If the BKs insist on "serving us" ... cant they send someone more pukka? – This is your quote.

Murli says- “You are half-caste Brahmins now. Because you are incomplete”. So actually every BK should have in his mind that I am still incomplete, not a perfect Brahmin. It was not about how BKs behave.

* I am not sent by any BK. Accidentally I have seen this ex-BK website and just entered. Please do not think bad. Since these points were directed towards PBKs, there was small misunderstanding. That’s all.

3)You said, “26 out of 900000 ... hardly a strong argument”.

But it is not 26! There are several families in India which are fully in Gyan. There is no need to show. It is open and visible. *Not only that- I have already said- final proof will be in the end. Can you find Christ’s quality in any Christian (or at least in Pope) today or at any point of time in the history? If you can’t find any Christian equal to Christ, do you say, “Christians belief in Christ is wrong?

So is it correct to demand proof from BKs who are effort makers? If you find some bad or weak BKs, do you say BK philosophy is wrong? There is only one God to the whole world. Do you say- “just one out of 600 crores ... Hardly a strong argument!?”

So, I think, for proof, just one example is sufficient. Just one who can do open eye meditation at any place or can do Yoga very well while doing action is enough. Just think, only eight souls realize God fully! And that is the end result. Another thing is - you may not have fortune to see those souls! There are many beautiful ladies in the world. But very few ladies come on to stage and get crown of Miss Universe. Do you say, other ladies are not beautiful? If an ordinary person challenges an international boxer to fight, the boxer may ignore the person. He need not project himself in front of others. If a dog barks at an elephant, elephant need not respond. Similarly, there may be many silent powerful BKs. I have challenged in this forum. You will find another challenge in this thread.

We (BKs) believe that we become emperors in next birth, not in this birth. If you ask me, “Prove that you are world emperor, do you think I should physically rule the present world?” Power is being filled in this birth. One who is not influenced by the whole world in this birth will become world emperor of tomorrow. This is the necessary condition (say) to become World Emperor. To the extent one is capable of getting detached from this world (unlimited disinterest), his status becomes better. So if a person proves his detachment, it is really a proof.

So, proof of pure household path does not necessarily mean that one should marry and show or just married people have to prove it. Even a Kumar or Kumari having capacity of not influenced by lust even while seeing and doing action(karma-yoga) is a proof.

4) “Lastly, if all it takes is one lesson and two hours a day, why the BKWSU needs to squander multi-millions of its donors' income every year?”- This is your quote. My reply is below.

BKs spend money for SERVICE. Is it wrong? Baba has said, drop phamplets from aeroplanes, put message in a full page of a newspaper, put ladder picture in airports, have big sizes of pictures, do projector show even in villages, celebrate Shivaratri grandly, etc, etc, etc. What I meant is, once you realize Baba (developed faith), you do not need money for self-effort. You need just Murli. That’s all.

But I agree with you that BKs sell their products like literature, cassettes, etc. I was really surprised when I saw it just a month before. Actually, it should be made freely downloadable. Really I feel it is bad. But that is a small issue. I will comment such things at a later stage.

5) Do you think in spirituality, there is difference between official website and (unofficial!) website? Because in spirituality, each believer is like on official duty(continuous duty) for the whole life. I have seen two websites of PBKs; [most probably- http://www.PBKs.info and another like adhyaatmik ishwariya vidyaalay, something]. Like PBKs, BKs are also just followers of ShivaBaba. God is body-less. God is invisible. Then what is the significance of official in spirituality?

Dear Global Soul,
This was your quote- “Are you kidding me by this? Why are the Seniors seen as Sisters?

If you do not believe in advertising than why on the main site do you mention your UN relationship?”

1)The words brother- Brother or brother- Sister mentioned by me was meant for PBKs. PBKs believe that all the present female PBKs will turn into males. That is, they say- the present female body (of a PBK) also will turn into male. Hence they call bhai- Bhai. So- their bhai- Bhai is limited to only small numbers.

But BKs consider all the souls of world as Brothers(souls), because the goal here is to forget body and treat everybody as soul. But for communication purpose in society- a male has to be called as Brother and female as Sister. * But Baba has said in Murli to consider all as souls. Even though I am calling a female as Sister, I should not feel her as Sister! I should feel her as Brother(soul). *Sometimes I say to some BKs who listen to me to make an easy understanding about soul-conscious stage. “In 100% soul conscious stage, you will feel BB also as your Brother”.

2)I did not say- I do not believe in advertising! In fact, the aim is to use all the available media to give Baba’s message to each and every corner of the world. [You might have written in hurry. Even I had written in hurry- right? That is OK. It was just small mis-understanding].

Dear John Soul,

INDIANS HAVE HIGHEST and LEAST EGO:-

1)Indians have highest ego- That is why there are many different religions, culture and scriptures. There is no common belief. Each religion has its own scriptures. *Consider Hinduism. Each religion has just one scripture. But Hindu religion has many scriptures. You can see totally contradicting statements written in Hindu scriptures. Not only that- even the most important scripture Bhagavadgeeta is interpreted in different ways by different people and has given birth to several geetas like Gandhi-geeta, Tagore-geeta, etc. This is an indication of high ego. Each tries to differentiate from the other.

*But- Indians have least ego- Even though there are so many religions, culture ..etc, , they live together in one country! Even though there are so many cults, subcults in Hinduism, they all come under one category- Hinduism. See unity in diversity!

2) See the highest ego in Indians:-. A Hindu person(so called jagadguru) declares himself as God. There are so many JAGADGURUS in India. These gurus and some of the scriptures say, these human gurus are even greater than God! Just see the ego level! *You might have heard human beings uttering in India- ‘Shivoham’(I am the lord Shiva)!

*On the other hand, Hindus worship even trees, snakes. Indians consider animals also God! They bow their head to everything! This is an indication of having no or less ego(of course, may be of ignorance)

3)Indians are more attached to religion. There are so many (blind) faiths in them and they do a lot of sthool pooja, worshipping and rituals. If somebody insults their God or deity, they will get very angry and start fighting. This indicates that there is high ego.
Even British people have pointed this and have said- “Don’t touch their religion. Then you can divide and rule them”.

*On the other hand, Indians are ready to sacrifice their religion and get converted into other religions! Hindus are easily converted other religions! This is an indication of having no belief in religion [detachment(less ego)] So- just see what a foolishness are these!

What I mean is- Indians have highest and least ego. But- foreigners or other religions always have some gap or distance. Foreigners stick to their religion with body-consciousness. Christians stick to Christ, Muslims to Mohammad, etc. Their religions are created by human beings. Without Jesus Christ Christians have no existence and Bible has no value. Similarly without Muhammad, Muslims have no value. So- all these religions are directed to bodily personalities. Hence there is some minimum ego. [I am not blaming these religions. I am trying to compare and explain the significance].

But in Hinduism, there is no one God in practical. They have forgotten their real religion- the deity religion. Hence they are like having no ego(also no self respect) and hence are like wandering. Hence they are ready to listen to the Godly knowledge (or anything they see or hear). This is the reason why Godly knowledge sits in Hindus’ intellects more easily and most of the BKs are Hindus. [Hindus have no value anywhere in world. Even today, in India, Hindus have less value than other religions. When British people ruled India, there were some boards- “NO ENTRY TO INDIANS AND DOGS”. See the pitiable state of Indians and ego of English men!]

*Even now, what America is doing? It has technology, richness, natural resources, everything. But it interferes in other countries. It is throwing bombs on small countries. What Muslim terrorists are doing? Putting bombs in any place they like. See the ego level or lack of tolerance in other religions. Have you heard of any Hindu putting Bombs?

Hindus love God maximum and also insult God maximum(due to wrong directions from Human gurus and scriptures). They praise God a lot. They treat everything as God. This is a big insult to God. Treating snakes, trees God is a huge insult to God.

*But ego in Hindus is mainly due to wrong things written in scriptures. So- when an Indian develops faith in BK knowledge, he realizes that the scriptures are wrong and his ego is easily vanished. Indians do not have high life styles like other religions. Any rich Hindu (even ruling party ministers have done and are doing) will remove his shirts in front of statues of God or Goddess in temples even though whole public would be present there. They will not only bow to the poojaris, but also touch their feet for blessings!

4)All the religions that came after Copper Age have forced some ego(discipline) in it. The advantage is there is some discipline in these religions. They maintain self respect to considerable extent and also give respect to some extent. But there is no discipline in Hinduism. Why? They do not know their religion at all. They do not know practically how to behave in society. They do not know how to maintain respect and give respect. It would not be wrong to say that many Indians do not know how to stand, sit, speak and walk. Their behaviour would be irritating in many places. This may be one of the reasons to the board as mentioned above “No entry to Indians and Dogs”

5)Indians do not know how to pay respect to their own people. They quarrel with themselves. This is the reason why as bluesky soul said- “In India, there are many cases of wives being splashed with kerosene and burnt”. In India, women have no or very less respect. THIS MAY BE ONE OF THE REASONS WHY Baba HAS GIVEN Indian WOMEN MOST IMPORTANT PLACE IN Yagya.

6)*Indian women have highest attachment and least attachment:- In India, even employed women will not leave their family easily even if there is misunderstandings in their family. She will not take divorce for small issues. The society is also like that. She may lose respect in society if she takes divorce. So- she is not capable of overcoming it. She is WEAK.

*But see BK sisters- They leave their family and do not bother about their future and surrender in Baba’s service! Many people in their close relations comment, but these Sisters are least bothered about them. [Some may comment here that BK Sisters are enjoying a luxury life in Centres by grabbing students’ money. But for a new surrendering Sister, the Yagya is a highly challenging life. (There are many cases where these Sisters have to work from morning to evening and I need not mention here). So she is very POWERFUL also!

Dear Global Soul,
This is your quote:- “Your beginning to sound like a parrot. I asked you if you are married, are you?”
1) I might have missed your question while fast reading. Hence I did not reply. So- if possible, excuse me. But I had mentioned in the beginning itself in this forum, (in some other thread) that I am a Kumar(unmarried).

2)I hope some of your questions have just responded by me in this thread. My views about marriage:-

I am both male and female.

*Compared to (my) body, the soul is(I am) male. So I am husband (powerful, ruler) of my body. So I got married as soon as I took physical birth(when the soul(I) entered mother’s womb). That is my first marriage.

*Compared to Supreme Soul, the soul is wife. So I am wife of ShivaBaba. Because I love him very much. Every soul is wife of God; Every soul prays God at least in difficult situations. Supreme Soul is more powerful than any soul. But practically there is no relation because of ignorance of God. But now- a BK treats God as his first or real lover and hence it is second marriage. Hence a soul is both male and female.

*To the extent I give divorce to the first marriage (forget body or sacrifice body-consciousness), I get more love from my second second marriage (God). To the extent the first relation is forgotten, the second relation gets the real value.

3)Now I am saying about third marriage which you had asked. I am ready to marry. The girl who wishes to marry me should

a)Love God more than me.

b)Even if I die, she should not become unhappy, because even if she dies, I will not cry. [Baba has said- “Even if mother or wife dies, one should eat halva(sweet)”. Just see the teachings of Murli. I will always try to be happy in my life in any condition].
c)She should have minimum health and should observe celibacy. She should have stopped non- veg food from past one year and should not desire of that in future, etc, etc. you know all these.
d)She will get a house and some cash from me. Rest of my property may go to BK institution. But if she proves to be equal to me, then I may give everything to her and pass away happily.

e)If you find such a girl and wishes to marry, you can please give my details to her.

[Some more thing:- Even if somebody do not wish, but if you need proof for pure house hold path, I am ready to stay with anybody for a convenient duration, anywhere in the world. You may have to bear the expenses].

4) Now- such a girl will be a male(highly powerful)! So- what is the need of marriage for her? So- BKs will marry just to glorify Baba in front of the world. This will happen when BKs develop and green signal is given by Baba. That day also may come if it is in Drama. But it may be of not much use to discuss at this moment. Because without being ready to get into the bus or having no interest to get into the bus, it is waste to ask departure time of the bus.

5)ShivaBaba has said both negative and positive points in Murli about marriage-
* “A (BK) Kumar or Kumari should never think of getting married”.
*In the present time, getting married is like wasting life”
“Be always independent(single) and do not get into bondage”
**”If some (BKs) get gadharv vivah (marriage) and show (purity to the world), Baba’s name will be glorified”

Even stronger points supporting marriage in BK institution are said in Murli. Since I had not kept the details, I do not have them(Murli with date), and if I put in my own words, it may not be accurate.

6)Now- even if some BKs(Kumars and Kumaris) are ready(having purity level more than threshold, say), why don’t they marry?

7)When a Father has to walk with his child(or a person with his younger Brother who is a child), he walks with reduced speed. It does not imply that he cannot walk faster. He reduces his pace to keep the other comfortable. Similarly-- some BKs even though they are powerful, they do/need not exhibit. *Not only that if some BKs marry, then by seeing them other weak BKs also may marry and may cause dis-service.

8)A soldier to prove himself need not kill a person. But he should be ready. When command is given, he should be capable of shooting. Similarly, proof for household path does not mean to show a couple, but even an individual having purity is enough. But you (or the person who raised question) ARE ALSO CORRECT. Obviously new things may appear in drama. We have to wait and see.

9)God has not shown himself to the world. He is still behind the stage. If he comes into the stage, then drama ends. God shows himself at the end of the Kalpa. Similarly, final proof of pure house-hold path! So time will be given to all the souls of the world till required level of purity is reached in BKs.

10)Steps of purity
1)Celibacy,
2)Sacrifice of Non- veg food and all bad habits
3)taking bath after going to lavoratory and wash the clothes used during that time before next usage.
4)Sacrifice of onion, garlic & food prepared by those who do not observe the above qualities.
5)getting victory over five vices.
6)Having no mixture (body-consciousness) is the real purity
[Somebody commented me in this forum that purity is not just celibacy. Hence the above is mentioned. Without first step, other steps have no much value or not possible to approach. Hence sometimes, purity and celibacy are used synonymously]. Baba also said- “There are two pure religions- deity(in heaven) and Sanyas(in hell)”

Dear pbkindiana soul,

You are correct and I tried to explain to my capacity in this thread.

Dear bluesky soul,

Thank You for your suggestions.

Dear Arjun Soul,

1) Richness of Somanath temple is clearly written in history.

*Muhammad of Gazhni looted Somanath temple 17 times.

*The total amount of treasures in the all Kings in that area is not even 5% of the amount of gold deposited in the wells of Somnath temple. [The Somnath temple was built in the beginning of Copper Age. But period of those Kings was not exactly mentioned in the book I have read].

2) I am not feeling proud of keeping BrahmaBaba’s photo in BK centres. I am just analyzing. *Once I was watching a cricket match between India and Australia. The Australian player hit a six. I just said Wah- excellent. But my friends present there were not happy. They wanted only one thing:- Just India should win. But I am not so. My aim is- if there is something special in anything, give respect to it. So- when I see BB’s photo everywhere is centres, I really think, BB is the next soul to God. Otherwise how can he get such a publicity in this whole of Sangamyug and even in hell as Gita kaa bhagavaan? Hence I appreciated.

3) In some Murlis it is said not to keep Brahma’s photos in Murlis. But in one Murli Baba has said-“There is need of Brahma’s photo. Otherwise How can I do sakshaatkaar? By sakshaatkaar of point, what is the use? I will do the saakshaatkaar of Brahma to direct them”(If you have give me the date, else when I get, I will give you) So from service point of view, BB’s photo is really important. I have another Murli here.

* aage chal bahuton ko saakshaatkaar hoga, direction milegaa. tumhaaraa trimoorty bhee akhbaar meim padtaa hai, bharhmakumariyon kaa naam bhee padtaa hai. To Brahma KAA HEE saakshaatkar hogaa ki inke paas jaane se tumko yah Vaikunth kaa PRINCE ban-ne kaa gyaan milegaa”- revised Sakar Murli 4-8-99.

* The approximate meaning of the above is “In future many will get visions and directions. Trimoorty and name BK gets published in news papers. So Brahma’s vision will happen (to them) that- VISIT THESE(BKs) AND YOU WILL GET KNOWLEDGE OF BECOMING PRINCE OF HEAVEN”.

* Now just think without displaying Brahma’s photos in BK centres and service how can people know that Brahma’s picture is related to BK institution? So for service it is needed.

4) arjun wrote:Is there any proof in the Murlis to say that Brahma Baba's soul will be in the royal family till the end of the Silver Age ... Is it good if a son takes credit for his Father's hard work?

I am not saying that it is correct if son take the credit of Father. But that is what happens in world. The first (or best) son gets the highest property from his Father. Father will be pleased to give everything to his most eligible child. *God is the creator of heaven. But he does not rule at all! He gives it to children. So he gives his highest name to the most eligible child. From this [when BB (Krishna) gets the status of Gita kaa Bhagavaan from Copper Age], it really makes me to give more respect to him and feel that BB is the real Prajapita and not any other even though there are many arguments going on.

[God is abhokta. So- he does not take any credit at all! Even today, we all are debating about God! When God gets credit(world realizes God), Drama ends! HOW EGOLESS IS Baba!]

5) Baba says, you get baadashaahi (Kingdom) for 21 births. Baba has also said, by the end of Tretayug, the number of prince-princess in royal family would be 16108. By this- I came to the conclusion that the first 8 souls will be in royal family from beginning. As population increases, the members of royal family also increases and it will become 108 (say at the beginning of tretaayug), and then 16108 at the end.

6) Your quote- “... One Father, that is all, none else. He alone is the true paatshaah, the one who narrates the truth. So, you should not remember any picture. You should not even remember this picture of Shiv because Shiv is not like this ...”

I interpret the meaning of, “You should not even remember this picture of Shiv” as;

a) Do not consider Shiv as so big as drawn in the picture.
b) Do not consider Shiv as a physical being,
c) Do not consider Shiv to be yellowish, red or any other color of this physical world.

* In Murli there are many points:- soul is white, soul is red, soul is like star, soul is like point, I am like star, I am egg form, I am not egg, I am star etc etc. I think Baba tries to make us realize what a soul is. *Like for small children, we try to explain the shape of earth like a ball, then we say, it is like orange, then we say more appropriately.

* Baba says, Paramdham is full of red(or perhaps Golden color) light and in all BK centres, red light is put for meditation. But we know that light we put is a type of electromagnetic radiation. *I think Paramdham would be darkness for human eyes, because human eye can see just the things made form five elements of nature and Paramdham is totally different than these five elements. *Then what is the significance of this red light? It is just to have the feeling of Paramdham. Because we cannot think what we have not seen, touched or felt by physical organs.

* So what I think is- you remember Shiv in any way. But HAVE KNOWLEDGE THAT Shiva IS NOT AT ALL PHYSICAL thing. As the concentration increases, you will be able to think smaller size of point and then attain karmaateet stage.

* When we draw picture of an electron on a paper, we draw to a larger scale. But we would be conscious that even though in the paper, the size is 1 cm (say), the electron is actually much smaller than that. We do not get influenced by the picture. Initially, picture is needed. Later it is not needed. So that is what Baba means do not think of picture means do not get stuck to anything that is corporeal!

* But in front of Baba, there will be both new and old children. So Baba has to say something again and again. So these contradicting (less and more weightage) points will appear now and then and many BKs get confused what to accept and how to accept.

Dear ex-l soul,

But please also allow me to remind mbbhat, that for the first 20 years Lekhraj Kirpalani and the early Brahma Kumaris did think and call himself Prajapati God Brahma, the Gita Inventor ... and there was no mention of Shiva until after 1950 according to the publish documents we have here. Your response please

The documents may say like that. But- think on the following incidents and possibilities.

1a) The Present Indian President Mrs. Pratibha Patil had visited Mount Abu just before two or three months before becoming President(may be two years before). Avyakt- BapDada(Gulzar Dadi) met and talked to her and said that- “In future, your responsibility is going to increase. You should do Godly service….” [You can check and get this Murli]

1b) After she became President, she revealed this and said that “I had guessed this before since the soul of Brahma had informed me that my responsibility is going to increase”(the exact sentence may not be correct here. Excuse me for that). The next day many news papers criticised and it appeared in front pages as – “Indian President believes in ghost of late Brahma, the founder of BKWSU ... “

Now what may be the possibilities? Either BK Sisters who have guided her to Avyakt Bap-Dada would have told her that- (a)“it is soul of Brahma that has entered in and is speaking through Gulzar Dadi’s body” OR (b)“Both ShivBaba and Brahma are speaking through Gulzar Dadi’s body” OR you guess. Even if the second(b) in the above is true, could the President had understood what is Shiva? So- Shiva, THE MOST BELOVED GOD Father IS ABSENT IN ALL THE MOST IMPORTANT PLACES! {how egoless God is!} [Just imagine what a common man would understand or think about president, BK institution by this incident].

I was present in Madhuban on that day. There were so many security forces. They also were really surprised what this lady minister or governor(perhaps) doing here that too in the late evening. Pratibha Patil was governor or some politician before becoming President. But since, now, getting seat in front is not possible, I did not get interest to sit in the Diamond Hall and so came outside and sat near “Everhealthy hospital (the BK clinic) listened to Murli through speakers. After the general Murli, I left the place. In the next morning only I came to know that Avyakt bap-Dada had spoken to Pratibha Patil}.

2) I have met a BK teacher just 4 years back and at that time her age would be around 25 . She told me that she was in knowledge from her childhood and she just thought of BrahmaBaba whenever the word Baba was being uttered by BKs. She also said that By seeing the photo of BB, she was becoming satisfied. She came to know that it is ShivaBaba, the point that is speaking very late.

3) I have heard a Dadi speaking in a class to us that “when Baba used to chant “Om dhwani”, we all were forgetting everything” (that means there was total peace or some super sensuous feeling;). So- initially in the Yagya, ShivaBaba did not give knowledge at all. He was just relaxing these children like taming (I hope the word is correct) the elephant. He was preparing these children to be able to receive knowledge.

4) Initially visions of SriKrishna was happening to many of those who see Dada Lekhraj. So they were attracted to Lekhraj. They had not at all understood the point form of ShivaBaba. So- what knowledge these initial children would have received or understood?

Hence these children would had considered Dada Lekhraj himself as everything and would had written his name in their experience in books or while being interviewed by others. Later when they realized that it was actually Shiva and not Brahma they might have wished not to throw those books as the experience was very sweet and would had preserved those books . Even after realizing that the name of Brahma is not correct; It is Shiva, they would had not corrected since the book was personal or just for their own members. Also correcting is not so easy task as it will make the book ugly. Writing a new book is also unnecessary. Not only that- when new things have come into mind, old gets no value. A student throws the rough work done by him. Only the essence of a study sits in intellect!

So ShivaBaba’s first aim might be make them comfortable in purity. If initially direct knowledge would have given- they could never understand, and might have felt negative. So- by trance, visions, etc, ShivaBaba might have nourished them slowly. So- practical Murli might not had started in the beginning. So, it may also be possible that Murli started in 1946 afterwards, and it would have been 60 yrs to Lekhraj. When a research paper is presented by a university student, it is corrected many times by the student and the professor until perfection is reached. Including Dada Lekhraj, all were students! *So I think it is really foolishness to stick to the old documents(which were actually written by ordinary women) if you really want to do research. You will never progress.

Now, the next question. Why do these Dadis hide these documents? Today- it is difficult to speak truth. Because very few people believe truth. Even if they show these original documents and speak the truth, all the new BKs may not believe it. Suppose let us believe that they will believe. But then image of Dadis would get reduced in front of the newcomers [They will think Oh- These Dadis realized God only after 10 or 20 years!].

Some of these Dadis might have developed ego by that time would have interested to disclose them. Many Dadis do not know English and would have got confused what to do and what not to do. Even the honest Dadis might had thought that it would be better not to disclose, otherwise, students(BKs) would get doubt for no reason and may leave Gyan.

Once a small error happens, Maya gets place. To hide one lie, you need to speak 1000 lies. So like this, at present there are lots of doubts against Seniors of BK institution. The biggest problem is nobody wants to lose their image(status). And those who ask doubts also ask with ego. Both have ego. One is not ready(or capable, bold) to speak truth, and the other is not ready(capable, calm) to accept the truth. The listeners have no patience. Many of them jump into immediate conclusions.

5) Just see an incident: These women (Dadis) had no clear idea of future. [Baba had said once- that there will cinema theatre in every home. At that time, nobody (these Dadis) had understood this. Just see- now, there is TV, DVD player in every home!].

*Once tears fell from a senior teacher (or perhaps dadi- I do not remember exactly and I was just 15 or 19 age at that time) who was reading revised Sakar Murli in Madhuban. I was there. The Murli point was “gali gali mein centre banega= there will be centre in every street”. She said- “I had laughed when Baba had spoken this in Sakar. At that time there were only three or four centres in just India. It appeared to me as joke. But now- Baba’s flag is present in every city. Now I feel guilty of laughing at Baba’s words”. [Hence I feel that Murli is not a creation of human beings].

6) Initially ShivaBaba was teaching children that ‘I am linga(stone like). *I have read in a revised Sakar Murli which meant very similar to this- “Initially I used to speak I am ling like. But I am not linga. I am star-like, a point. You cannot say/ask- why did not you tell this before. It is in Drama”. JUST SEE!- God himself is contradicting his own statements! When some points in Murli itself are like this, how much importance can we give to the documents written and said by fully human beings.

7) Once I was a sevadhari explaining in an exhibition in a BK service camp. The visitors who came asked me- Why don’t you(BKs) believe in God? I wondered and said we really believe in God. Then he asked why do you say Rama, Krishna are not Gods? Then I explained him God is bodyless, etc etc. *Just see- when BKs say- deities are not God, some people interpret it as BKs do not believe in God or they spread news that BKs do not believe God.

8) Now, the documents which are available in this forum discloses something about what Mama said to others in an interview, and something more. I could not find time to into every detail. *Now the question here is who has written them? If it is written by Mama, was she knowing English? If it is translated, then how much mis- interpretation would have been there. Even if Mama knows English or translation was perfect, the point number 3 mentioned above still can be a hindrance in realizing truth.

9) Just see- even today- there is a lot of controversy in how God is to be remembered! Not even a single King (RajaYogi) in either BK or PBK family is visible clearly. Then how would it be in the beginning?

10) BKs try to hide these documents. Ex- BKs just want to dis-prove BK philosophy. Both have no real courage and patience. Then how to proceed? All is drama. It is the super power which can’t be succeeded! Even though many things are revealed by ShivaBaba, it will be understood only to those souls who wish to become pure and be ready to surrender to Shiv-baba.

*Just see- Murli is real property of Shiv-Baba. But if the children do not give real value to Shiva(try honestly to become pure), or try to mis-use it God would have done something to keep it secret. Can God be so fool? So- Murli is like an open secret. Eventhough we read it many times, still some remain secret. *Baba has said in Murli- To the extent you remember me, your intellect opens. This implies that just mechanical reading of Murli or word meaning of Murli will not open the intellect. Then what is the use of Murli?

*That is why Murli is magic. If a single point can give great happiness to someone, bundles of Murlis may not be useful to another!

11) According to me there is nothing greater than Murli. So- I give importance to the REPEATING POINTS in Murli. Obviously they should be given the highest priority. If that is not done, then all the things are false. Because according to BK (or PBK) philosophy, Murli is the highest.

12) Since God (and soul) is invisible, but body-conscious humans know, imagine or can understand only those things that could be sensed by organs, how can even God teach human beings easily? What a great task God has to accomplish! Let me see how much best I can play in this drama. Then what else can I do? Baba has already said- ‘I will not give you the key of divine vision. It is for my use’. So thinking about future without proper present action would be not correct. *I am just one actor in these 600 crore souls. Still I have ego. Oh Baba, please help me in destroying my ego.

ALL THE BEST FOR ALL.
[All these are my own imaginations. Comments or questions are always invited even if I do not succeed in responding or answering properly. I think it is better to post a new topic on this].

Dear Paulkershaw soul,

I am sorry that I have not fully understood what you meant in this thread to me because I am a little bit weak in English. But I am replying according to my guess.

*There is no need to agree that BB is No. 1. We have to just think ShivaBaba. If you agree BB as no. 01, it does not matter. You see- in an organization, you should agree to the head (Boss). Then you have no problems or confusion. If you give right respect to him, automatically you will pay right respect to others. If you have full connection with him, he will give you direction automatically (ShivBaba will open your intellect)

*But what I think is as you proceed towards goal, you will see better who are in front of you. So you will realize that BB is really number 01. All BKs have that faith. Those who come across knowledge of PBKs get some doubt. It is like this, “If somebody tells or instructs you do not remember monkey, then you will think about monkey more and more. It does not imply that you really love or interested in monkey. Similarly, when some Murli points are shown, BKs get confused. But have faith in ShivaBaba and churn the sweet memories of Golden Age.

So Baba says,

*alph ko Yaad karne se be baadashaahi tumhaari (If you remember the Father, the property is yours) and
* beej ko jaan-ne se saaraa vruksh ko jaan jaayenge (If you understand the seed, you understand the whole tree).

Dear Global Soul ... I am ready to marry. The girl who wishes to marry me should

a) Love God more than me.
b) Even if I die, she should not become unhappy, because even if she dies, I will not cry. [Baba has said, “even if mother or wife dies, one should eat halva (sweet)”. Just see the teachings of Murli. I will always try to be happy in my life in any condition].
c) She should have minimum health and should observe celibacy. She should have stopped non-veg food from past one year and should not desire of that in future, etc, etc. you know all these.
d) She will get a house and some cash from me. Rest of my property may go to BK institution. But if she proves to be equal to me, then I may give everything to her and pass away happily.
e) If you find such a girl and wishes to marry, you can please give my details to her.

mbbhat, your comments above made me laugh so much.Now, you want from one member of this forum or from all of us to find you a girl to marry. Such an order is posted for the first time in this forum. What details of yours do we have, except you don't listen to any signals and continue to send your salmons one following each other. Poor girl.What a life would she expect, listening to your continuous monologues day and night.

On top of this, you offer us to make a spectacular show again, as you offered once to another member in another tread. And this time you add we should pay for the expenses.You are making me laugh so much.You could have so good chances in the showbiz and make people happy, why wasting your time with endless preaching and making people angry?