Questions for PBKs

Dear arjun Bhai

In Murli 22-1-03, Shiva says "Maya gaflat karati hai. Maya ankhon mein dhool daal deti hai."[meaning: ''Maya confuses you. Maya puts dust in the eyes''.]
In Murli 9-9-02, Shiva says "Maya-ravan ne buddhi ko taala lagaa diya hai." [meaning: ''Maya-ravan has locked the intellect'']. The above two Murlis clearly say that mayavi Krishna has confused the PBKs and has put dust in their eyes(ie third eye) and has locked the intellect of PBKs, so that they cannot identify the nirakari stage of Ram as ShivBaba.

In Murli 7-12-04, Shiva says, "Maya ki parikasta bahut kadi hai. Maya budhi ekdum pher deti hai. sab hain Maya ke murid. ShivBaba ke murid thode hai. Tum ShivBaba ke murid bante ho toh Maya sahan nahin kar sakti, issliye bahut sambhal karni chahiye." [meaning: The definition of Maya is very deep. Maya turns the intellect totally. All are under the influence of Maya. Very few are under ShivBaba's influence. When you become ShivBaba's child, then Maya cannot bear it, that is why you have to be very careful."]

Who is this Maya who is very difficult to define and all PBKs are under her influence during the shooting period of copper-iron age and who turns away the intellect away from Ramshivbaba and who cannot bear any soul who takes the name of Ramshivbaba. In the above Murlis, Shiva is clearly speaking to 108 rudramala souls and warning them about mayavi Krishna and how it turns the intellect away from Ramshivbaba and to be very careful about this Godly form of Maya.

shivsena.

All are under the influence of Maya. Very few are under ShivBaba's influence.

From the above quote it is very clear that at the same time there is the influence of Maya and of ShivBaba. If you say who is Maya, you souls also say who is ShivBaba at the same time. You cannot say Maya influences us now and ShivBaba will influence us in future. No. See the quote. If you say who is and where is Maya now, you should say who and where is ShivBaba now.

From the above quote it is very clear that at the same time there is the influence of Maya and of ShivBaba. If you say who is Maya, you souls also say who is ShivBaba at the same time. You cannot say Maya influences us now and ShivBaba will influence us in future. No. See the quote. If you say who is and where is Maya now, you should say who and where is ShivBaba now.

Valid point to be noted by shivsena Bhai.

From the above quote it is very clear that at the same time there is the influence of Maya and of ShivBaba. If you say who is Maya, you souls also say who is ShivBaba at the same time. You cannot say Maya influences us now and ShivBaba will influence us in future. No. See the quote. If you say who is and where is Maya now, you should say who and where is ShivBaba now.

Those who have not identified Maya are under the influence of Maya and those who have identified Ramshivbaba as their Father teacher Satguru through the study of Murlis, have escaped the clutches of Maya and are under the influence of Ramshivbaba and are revealing Ramshivbaba to others.

This Murli point will be applicable right to the end of shooting periond and also when Ramshivbaba will be revealed to 108 and Maya will be revealed to 16000. When Shiva is speaking the Murlis he is emerging the souls and then describing them. So he sees the end-stage purusharth and result of 16000 souls as being under the influence of Maya and sees 108 souls(mayajeet) as those who have escaped the mayavi trap of Krishna and are under the influence of Ramshivbaba.

shivsena.

Dear arjun Bhai,

In Murli 17-11-93. Shiva says "Maya ghost ka dhanda hi hai parampita paramatma se vimukh karna" [meaning: ''Maya ghost's business is to lead you astray from parampita paramatma"]
Who is this Ghost which Shiva is describing and who is leading away from parampita paramatma???
In the above Murli, Shiva is clearly describing Krishna's soul as ghost who is shunting between mt abu and Virendra Dev Dixit and is playing the role of Maya in Virendra Dev Dixit and creating confusion and leading the PBKs away from Ramshivbaba(parampita paramatma) and playing the role of mother who is guiding the 108 souls to become nirakari like Father Ram.

In Murli 4-10-02, Shiva says, " Bap sarva-shaktivan hai toh Maya bhi sarva-shaktivan hai; Aadhaa Kalpa Maya ka rajya chalta hai". [ meaning "Father is all-powerful and Maya is also all-powerful. Maya rules for half a Kalpa"]
Who is this Maya who is ruling for half a Kalpa in this behad ka drama (during the shooting period of copper-iron age).
It is very obvious that Krishna's mayavi role is ruling the PBK world and in the end Rambap's part in nirakari stage will also be played through the same body and Maya ka rajya and ram-rajya will both be equal in this behad ka drama.

shivsena.

Dear Brother shivsena,

But influence is practical. If it were a matter of only recognition and knowing or discriminating who is who in one body, then in the same way we knew from the past God will come when there is defamation of religion and this will be sufficient. If it were this case you would also agree that it would be a matter of what one sees, where one focuses its attention, so it would still be possible to see ShivBaba in the same body.

But you then describe Maya and its games a lot, but regarding the practical influence of ShivBaba you stay silent and you expect it will come in future. Then why not Maya come in future too? At the end as you say we’ll see who is Maya who is ShivBaba…You can also play a lot of philosophy and twist points, but practically in what way does your opinion differs to the rest of the PBKs. You may say with your mouth that in future the soul of Ram will reach 100% incorporeal stage and become living ShivBaba and you will be there amongst the first 108, but do we have the guarantee.

What we see practically now is that you avoid this personality and deny whatever is said through him as knowledge. By doing this you yourself put yourself in the hands of Maya, because where there is no Father there is Maya. If you don’t say where is the Father now you make yourself belong to Maya or if you say to people that the personality we consider the Father is Maya himself you take them in the hands of Maya, by playing yourself the role of Maya as in the quote you have quoted that Maya leads others away from teh Father. If it were the role of Maya (through Virendra Dev Dixit) as you say then in what way does this role take us away from the Ramshivbaba?

You may give many points on Maya, but please in your research don’t miss also these point for which it is difficult to tally that Krishna is Maya. If it were so, then when the soul of Krishna rules the Golden Age it would be the kingdom of Maya. Why it is said that Maya, Ravan comes after Copper Age. It is because such souls come who has not been in the heaven and starts influencing the deities. The soul of Krisha could become influenced more or less, but if it were Maya himself and it was his kingdom after Copper Age for half teh Kalpa we would still have only one religion after Copper Age, after the soul of Krishna belongs to the deity religion. There would not be duality.

Then also say – do you believe Shankar is Ram, because you say that Ram is the purifier, but there is a quote that says that Krishna, Brahma, Vishnu , Shankar cannot have this title. And if Shankar is not Ram then who is Shankar? Please, give an explanation on who is Shankar?

Omshanti.
Today, at the local mini-Madhubans a discussion CD recorded at Calcutta was being played. In that discussion, a PBK asked ShivBaba (in Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) as to who was 'aadi shakti mahamaya'? Baba replied that Maya is the root/base-like soul of Islam religion within our Brahmin family and that after Dadi Prakashmani left her body, in one of the trance messages it has been mentioned that Maya has joined hands with nature (prakriti). So, the combination of Maya (root-like soul of Islam) and prakriti (living-nature) is mahamaya. PBKs know that it is Jagdamba (of the PBKs and not Om Radhey Mama of BKs) who plays the role of Prakriti (mother nature).
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Dear arjun Bhai.

It is said in Murlis, that whatever happens in Sangamyug is remembered in lokik bhakti-marg as festivals and rituals.
Today is april 1st and it is known as fool's day all over the world;
I would like to know your views about why a fool's day is celebrated all over the world in a calender year and why is it april 1st ??(what has happened in Sangamyug in practical to have a rememberence of it in bhakti-marg)

OK awaiting your reply.
shivsena.

Today is april 1st and it is known as fool's day all over the world. I would like to know your views about why a fool's day is celebrated all over the world in a calender year and why is it april 1st ?? (What has happened in Sangamyug in practical to have a rememberence of it in Bhakti-marg)

You may say that it is a memorial of all BKs and PBKs being fooled by mayavi Krishna's soul .

By the way, I too got fooled by my colleague's pranks in my office yesterday.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

You may say that it is a memorial of all BKs and PBKs being fooled by mayavi Krishna's soul. By the way, I too got fooled by my colleague's pranks in my office yesterday.

Dear arjun Bhai.
You are right - subtle Brahma (Krishna) has been fooling the BKs and PBKs both. For last 40 years, Krishna has been fooling the BKs into believing that Shiv+Brahma, ie BapDada, are coming in Gulzar Dadi every year and since 40 years, the BKs are living under a illusion that God ShivBaba is with them. Similarly, for last 20 years (from 1988), Krishna has been narrating the ambiguous Advanced Knowledge (which does not co-relate with Murlis of Shiva) and has been fooling the PBKs into believing that God ShivBaba is giving Advanced Knowledge. The fact that Krishna is fooling the BKs is known very well to the PBKs, but they themselves are ignorant about the fact, that they are also being fooled by mayavi Krishna.

This is why Krishna is known as "Chaliya" in bhakti-marg, ie. one who cheats and deceives people, by telling them white lies-safed jhoot (meaning that on face value things appear to be the truth but in fact they are nothing but lies); and this fact will only be known to 108 souls, who will see through the game which Krishna is playing (by churning and researching on the Murlis and Vanis) and in the end when 108 souls gherao mayavi Krishna, then he will not be able to answer their queries and will try to evade them by giving silly ambigious answers and so Krishna gets another title in bhakti-marg as "Ran-chod-das"(meaning one who runs away from the battle field.)

I am again quoting the Murli points in which Shiva has clearly forseen Krishna's mayavi part and said,

In Murli 15-2-01, it is said that "Maya ne tumko fool(murkh) banaa diya hai; april fool kahete hain naa!"(meaning ''Maya makes a fool out of you; like you say april fool".)
In Murli 22-9-05, it is said that "Maya bilkul andhaa banaa deti hai".(meaning "Maya makes you totally blind")

Also it has been said in Murlis "Akalmand se akalmand dekhna hai toh yahan dekho, aur bewakoof se bewakoof dekhna hai toh yahan dekho" (meaning that you can see the most intellectual souls and the most foolish souls here in the BK and PBK family itself.). Why cannot the PBKs just see sense in this logic: when they know 100% that subtle Brahma has been fooling the BKs for 40 years through Gulzar Dadi, then why cannot He be fooling the PBKs also through Virendra Dev Dixit. (''sthapana ke anth tak ek Brahma ka hi part hai'')

shivsena.

Krishna is not Maya. In the Murli it is said in Golden Age, Silver Age Maya becomes servant and Krishna becomes king.

One question shivsena, do you think that this "Krishna soul" of yours is fooling BKs and PBKs deliberately, maliciously, divinely or just because it is ... for want of better words ... stupid or unenlightened itself?

The idea of a "Trickster God" is alien to the West. It is common in India, as you state, and also appears in the native religions of Africa, the Americas ... in fact, pretty much in all animist religions. In the West, we tend towards the idea of a single god that is just, fair and above vagarities "humanness". God does not "test" us by misleading us. In a sense, the nearest we have are the fallen "angels of light" who can "quote scriptures as well as a priest" but are attempting to lead humanity astray.

I will be honest with you, I find either the logical extensions you make or the need to have to fit within "The Knowledge" too much. I agree with the others that there it appears to me there is no where in The Knowledge that it says what you extrapolate ... BUT ... I think you are underlining something important and that is why I stick with you exploring this.

So, back to my question ... what is the motivation by which the BKs and PBKs being "fooled" or "tricked" (because, indeed, I do think they are)? You appear to be saying that it is a test, is it a designed test?

Krishna is not Maya.

Dear Brother andrey:
First let me say that I do not track Murlis by date or clarifications by VCD*#.

It has been said in atleast a couple of VCD* that ShivBaba is washerman (dhobi). Dhobi has a donkey (gadha). The donkey shown on the head of the 10 headed Ravan (aka known as Maya Ravan) is Brahma (aka Krishna). So the ten heads or Maya Ravan (5 of vices and 5 of the elements) are controlled by Brahma (Krishna). So if the controller/ruler of the vices is Brahma's soul, when is this part enacted?

[In one of the vartalap (discussion) VCD* held in Mumbai, one Brother asked Baba that if we have to listen to Shankar and follow Brahma, why should we follow a donkey?].

Om Shanti - Cal

Dear cal Bhai.

What you have written is very true.
I do not think any PBK has any logical answer to your observation.
I just want to add one more observation: In lokik world, it has been said that ''waqt aane par gadhe ko bhi bap banana padta hai''. (so during the shooting period we all PBKs have made Him Bap and he seems to be enjoying the show as per drama)

shivsena.

One question shivsena, do you think that this "Krishna soul" of yours is fooling BKs and PBKs deliberately, maliciously, divinely or just because it is ... for want of better words ... stupid or unenlightened itself?

Dear ex-l.
I have said repeatedly that that Krishna has been ordained as per drama to play the part of maya-ravan to seperate out the 3 groups(9 lac, 16000, and 108); there is no other soul(neither Ram nor Shiv) who can play this part; it has been said in Murlis that ''Ravan ko apna part bajana hai aur Ram ko apna part bajana hai, dosh kissi ka bhi nahin hai" (Ravan has to play his part and Ram has to play his part, one cannot blame anybody); it is just a question of recognising ''who is who'' ; those who do not recognise the parts played, will have only to blame themselves for it in the end.

The idea of a "Trickster God" is alien to the West. It is common in India, as you state, and also appears in the native religions of Africa, the Americas ... in fact, pretty much in all animist religions. In the West, we tend towards the idea of a single god that is just, fair and above vagarities "humanness". God does not "test" us by misleading us. In a sense, the nearest we have are the fallen "angels of light" who can "quote scriptures as well as a priest" but are attempting to lead humanity astray.

Yes--God cannot and does not test anybody; He is there only to give inheritance to those who recognise HIM in his practical form. It is priests, pandits and maulas and gurus in various religion who lead humanity astray and the shooting of this in done in Sangamyug by no.1 deh-dhari guru Krishna.

I will be honest with you, I find either the logical extensions you make or the need to have to fit within "The Knowledge" too much. I agree with the others that there it appears to me there is no where in The Knowledge that it says what you extrapolate ... BUT ... I think you are underlining something important and that is why I stick with you exploring this.

I am only trying to understand the state of things existing in the BK and PBK family at present and trying to unravel the mystery in the Murlis and sharing my thoughts with my Brothers on this forum.

So, back to my question ... what is the motivation by which the BKs and PBKs being "fooled" or "tricked" (because, indeed, I do think they are)? You appear to be saying that it is a test, is it a designed test?

Yes - a test designed by drama and Krishna(as Godly form of Maya) has been given the part to take the test.
shivsena.