Q&A: PBK Murli discussions

Disc.CD No.296, dated 9.02.07 at Lucknow and 17.04.07 at Anantpur

1. Lucknow - 09.02.07

Kisi Bhai nay kaha: Baba say drishti letey samay neend bahut aati hai.
Baba nay jawaab diya: Koi ko Murli suntey samay jyada neend aati hai, koi ko drishti letey samay jyada neend aati hai.
Kisi Bhai nay poocha: Ye bhi hisaab leti hai Baba?
Baba nay jawaab diya: Ye hisaab-kitaab hai.
Bhai nay kaha: Sab hisaab ley rahey hain Baba.
Baba nay jawaab diya: Aur kya?
Bhai nay kaha: Matlab jitnaa scene hai sangam ka sab kalyaankaari hai.
Baba nay jawaab diya: Hai toh sab kalyaankaari. Drama kalyaankaari, nahee toh drama kalyaankaari nahee. Hisaab-kitaab poora ho raha hai, voh halkey nahee ho rahey hain? Halkey ho rahey hain toh kalyaan ho raha hai ya akalyaan ho raha hai?

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Kisi Bhai nay kaha: Baba meri lokik mataji hamesha jab bhi baat, shaadi ke baarey may baatein kartee hain. Toh mai unko gyaan kay point kay through bahut question bol jata hun. Uchh swar may ki - Baba toh aisa boltey hain - pavitra duniya kee sthaapnaa ho rahee hai. Pavitra ban-na hai.
Baba nay poocha: Mataji gyaan may chaltee hain?
Bhai nay jawaab diya: Nahee Baba.
Baba nay kaha: Nahee chaltee hain toh unko gyaan kyon sunaatey ho?
Bhai nay kaha: Voh Baba baar-baar isee cheez ko. Toh ham jab kahtey hain toh unko….
Baba nay kaha: Jo gyaan may nahee chaltey hain voh chalan say change hongey. Voh gyaan sun-nay say change nahee hongey. Gyaan jo suntey hain, gyaan may chaltey hain, unko gyaan kay points sunaaney say kuch parivartan ho saktaa hai.

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2. Anantpur - 17.04.07

Kisi Bhai nay poocha: Baba jo 2036 hotey hain, usmay sabkee aayu samaan hogi?
Baba nay jawaab diya: Sabkee aayu samaan nahee hoti hai kuch na kuch antar rahtaa hai. Jab alag-alag dharmon kee aatmaen hain, alag-alag dharmon ka chilkaa chadhaa hua hai, toh koi toh jaldee chilkaa utar jaayega, koi ka chilkaa sabsey baad may utrega. Lekin chilkaa toh utrega. Aur pakkey beej toh banengey, 84 janma leney vaaley. Jo Radha-Krishna jaisey bachhon ko janma deney vaaley hongey, voh yaheen kanchankaya banaavengey.

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1. Lucknow - 09.02.07

A Brother asked: I feel very sleepy while taking drishti from Baba.
Baba replied: Some feel sleepier while listening to Murli. Some feel sleepier while taking drishti.
A Brother asked: Is this also a karmic account, Baba?
Baba replied: This is a karmic account.
A Brother said: Everyone is clearing his/her karmic account with us Baba.
Baba replied: Oh! Yes.
A Brother said: It means that all the scenes of the Confluence Age are beneficial.
Baba replied: Everything is beneficial. The drama is beneficial; otherwise drama is not beneficial. The karmic account is getting settled, are they not becoming light? They are becoming light. So, is it beneficial or non-beneficial?

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A Brother said – Baba, whenever my lokik mother talks (to me), she talks of (my) marriage. So, I speak to her in a loud voice through points of knowledge that – Baba says like this – Pure world is getting established; we have to become pure.
Baba asked – Does your mother follow the path of knowledge?
The Brother replied – No, Baba.
Baba said – If she does not follow (the path of knowledge), then why do you narrate The Knowledge to her?
The Brother said – Baba, she insists on the same thing again and again; so, when I tell her something.....
Baba said - Those who do not follow the path of knowledge would change by [observing] the behaviour (of those who follow the path of knowledge). They would not change by listening to knowledge. Some change can be brought about by narrating the points of knowledge to those who listen to knowledge and follow the path of knowledge.

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II Anantpur-17.04.07

A Brother asked – Baba, will everybody’s age be the same in 2036?
Baba replied – Everybody’s age would not be equal. There would be some or the other difference. When there are souls belonging to different religions, when they are covered by the peels of different religions, then some peels would get removed sooner and the peels of some would get removed in the last. But the peel would get removed and they would become strong seeds, who take 84 births. Those who would give birth to the children like Radha and Krishna, would make their bodies kanchankaya (i.e. rejuvenate their body) here itself.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire Murli contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Disc.CD No.286, dated 03.04.07 at Jammu

Ref. No.Disc.CD-286-extracts-Part-I

Time: 2.33-11.10

A Brother asked – Baba, one thing on which (I) have faith is that – God is playing His part having come on this Earth. Now, when there is so much light of knowledge, so much brightness, but these so-called BKs, when will their intellect be unlocked?

Baba replied – It has been told that this world is like a tree. In a tree, are the leaves first, are the roots first or are the seeds present first? (Everyone said – first there are seeds) Who would get/be reformed first? Will the leaves get reformed first, will the branches get reformed first, will the stem/trunk get reformed first, will the roots get reformed first or will the seed get reformed first? (Everyone said – the seed) OK. (The Brother said – the seed would get reformed first). Yes. So, the seeds are in the Advance Party and the roots are among the BKs. The roots appear big and the seed is small. When a second tree grows, or when a plant grows, then the seed mixes itself. It is even sung – ‘Dana khaak may milkar guley Gulzar hota hai.’ (The seed mixes itself in the soil to create a garden). Some part of it mixes with the soil and some part of it goes to the plant. That seed gets ready when The Tree grows completely; the flower, and then the fruit emerges from the flower; and when, the fruit becomes ripe, the seed gets detached from the fruit internally. It gets detached from the fruit also. It gets detached from The Tree also. So, has the seed attained this stage now? Until the seeds have attained that stage, pointing fingers at the roots, pointing fingers at the stem, pointing fingers at the branches, pointing fingers at the leaves, pointing fingers at the fruits is useless.

Now you have come to the Advance Party. Now do you consider yourself to be a root or do you consider yourself to be the seed of the world? (The Brother said – Seed) If you are the seed, then are the roots your children, creation or your creators? They are the creation. So, however may be the creation, for example Baba says – Children, whatever you are, however you are, you are mine. So, the entire human world tree belongs to the seed Father only. (A Brother said – They will also come. Where will they go?) They will come first. Later, the people of the world will come. First who would get reformed? First the home would get reformed. Well, whether it is the children at the home follow the mother; whom do the virgins follow more? They follow the mother. And whether they are the children who follow the Father, the virgins do not get inheritance. And the sons get inheritance. So, all the children who have come in the Advance Party, are they sons or daughters of the Father? They are the sons. Whether it is dolls, whether it is virgins, even then it is fitted in the intellect that – we are the children who obtain inheritance from the Father. And are they elder children or are they younger children? (Everyone said – they are elder ones) Hm? (They are the elder ones) Are they elder children? (Someone said – They are younger children) They are younger children. Some say – they are the elder children; some say that – they are the younger children.

The elder children are those who are Suryavanshis (belonging to the Sun Dynasty). What? Those who consider the Sun alone to be their Father. They neither get influenced by the Moon, nor do they get influenced by the Chandravanshis (those belonging to the Moon Dynasty). Neither do they get influenced by Islam, nor by those belonging to the Islamic dynasty. Neither do they get influenced by Christ, nor by the seed of Christ. Neither do they get influenced by the root/base-like soul of Christ, nor by those who follow Christianity. Under whose influence are they forever? They are influenced by one Father Sun. Nobody else can come and convert them. So, they are the elder children.

The elder children are said to be equal to the Father. For example, God forsake, if the Father leaves his body, and if the Father has ten children, 9 children, then what is the duty of the eldest child? It is his duty that he should take care of the other younger children, other Brothers and Sisters, in the same way, and look upon them in the same way as the Father had looked upon them. That is why if it comes in the intellect that – “When will these BK people reform? When would these roots reform?” Then you would get the reply. When would they reform? When we reform, the world would reform. Somewhere or the other there is some shortcoming in our gathering, in our unity. When our unity reaches the mature/complete stage, then nobody would be able to break our unity. And how is unity formed? Through purity. There is some problem in our purity somewhere. The root cause is only one. One must check oneself every moment – Have I, a seed-like soul become detached from this world like tree? This body, these relatives of the body, these things related to the body, these places related to the body, should not be observed even while seeing, should not be heard even while listening. The stage should become like this.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Disc.CD No.286, dated 03.04.07 at Jammu

Ref. No.Disc.CD-286-extracts-Part-II

Time 11.25 to 17.05

A mataji asked Baba – Baba, when Baba lives with the children, then why do they face circumstances?
Baba replied – Baba lives with them. Then, in that case whom do you consider to be Baba? When you said ‘Baba’, then, is your main intention towards the corporeal or is your attention focused on the point of light Supreme Soul who has entered the corporeal one? On whom is your attention focused? When you say that – those with whom Baba lives, then is your attention focused on the soul of Baba or is it focused on the body of Baba? If it is focused on the soul, then the soul would be with you. Can’t it be with you always? The more you remember that Supreme Soul Father, the more you remember the incorporeal within the corporeal, then does He not be with you? Is He not bound to be with you? Then why do you say like this? Hm? (Why do papers, i.e. examinations come? Why do situations and circumstances come?) It is because, where is the attention focused? (A mataji said – Why does Maya catch through the choti (a lock of hair on the crown of the head left after tonsure) It catches (through the choti) because – the one whom we want to keep with us, is slipping from our intellect.

Worshippers of Ram, devotees of Rahim, all of them are blind. Those so-called Brahmakumar-kumaris also forgot that Supreme Soul who is present within Ram and Krishna . What did they remember? They remembered that bodily being. The body is with us. [On the stage, even now when the soul (of BapDada) enters, they sit clinging. He is with us. Arey! Will your circumstances end if that bodily being is with you? Those in whose intellect it is always there that – one ShivBaba alone is our benefactor. And will the body, the body in which He enters in an appointed/permanent form, remain with anyone till the end in corporeal form? Hm? He would not. Even then, one would have to make oneself constant in the Avyakt (unmanifest/subtle) stage through one’s efforts. Those who make such practice would experience that - Baba is always with us in corporeal form. Its picture has also been shown. He is always in our company in corporeal form – which picture has been depicted for this? Did you forget your own picture? Hm? He is always together in corporeal form; there is a special picture depicted for that in the path of worship. (Someone said – Lakshmi-Narayan) No. (Someone said – Ardhnaareeshwar) No. That is (a picture) only of two. (Someone said – Raaslila) ‘Raaslila’. Who said that? Raise your hands. Yes. Look, you have got a good in-charge teacher.

‘Raaslila’. In the Raaslila, every Gop and Gopi (friends of Krishna ) has been shown with whom? They have depicted Krishna because they consider Krishna to be God. Who is with them? ShivBaba. One would always experience Him to be in their company. One would experience even while sleeping that He is with us. One would experience even while being awake that He is with us. What would one experience even while walking, moving, getting up, sitting, or while performing any action? Baba is with us. The stage should become such Avyakt. Then will this question remain – Why do those who live with the Father face problems? (A mataji said – The world gives only sorrows) Although this world gives sorrows, but who is with us? The giver of happiness (sukhdata), the Father is with us, isn’t He? When He is always with us, then there cannot be any name or trace of sorrow. Now Baba also says the same thing. If you are the children of the heavenly God Father, then you should be in heaven; then why are you lying in hell? What does it mean? Hm? What does it mean? It means that the children of the heavenly God Father have not yet become the spiritual children of the spiritual Father. They live in body consciousness.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire Murli contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Disc.CD No.286, dated 03.04.07 at Jammu

Ref. No.Disc.CD-286-extracts-Part-III

Time 17.15 to 19.50
A Brother asked - Baba, Shankar is called a deity and sometimes Shankar is also shown to have a beard in the pictures. But deities do not have beard.
Baba replied - The Shankar, who has been shown in the form of a deity is the perfect stage. What? Shankar is also shown to be wearing a yagyopavit (the sacred thread). What does that prove? (It proves) that [he] is a Brahmin. So, when the Brahmin is in a perfect stage, the Brahmin for whom it has been said - the first Brahmin is the first deity, the first Kshatriya, the first Vaishya and the first Shudra. This is a praise/glory of which time? In the Confluence Age he becomes first Brahmin too; in the Confluence Age he also becomes the first deity, in the Confluence Age he also becomes the first Vaishya, then Shudra too. So, Shankar is depicted to be a bahurupia (one who assumes various forms). Sometimes he appears to be old, sometimes he appears to be lying flat, sleeping in the form of a small child. Sometimes he appears to be Pinaaki (an epithet of Shiva which means weilder of Pinaak, a mighty bow). (Sometimes) he has been depicted to be fighting a war with bow and arrows in his hands. Various kinds of acts (charitra) have been depicted. For example, we children achieve different kinds of stages; like wise the Father of the human world also achieves different stages. The reel of 63 births of the Father is rotating along with the children even now. The Father would not depart alone. The Father would go taking all the children with him. That is why sometimes he is shown to be old. Just as Brahma is depicted as an old person having a beard and moustache; shown to be vicious, similarly Shankar's form is also shown dark like a snake; having a beard; like Ravan.

Time 20.05 to 21.05
A mataji asked – Baba, a mother is asking – those mothers who follow the path of knowledge, their husbands do not follow. What is the reason for that?
Baba replied – The past births, the 63 births have been taken in the path of worship. So, in the path of worship, when the (soul of the) husband might have performed good tasks, at that time (the souls of) those mothers might have been persons with beards and moustaches and…... would they have been those with a beard and moustache or not? (Mataji said – Yes) They might not have supported them (then). So, will they not clear their karmic accounts? They will. (Mataji asked – Baba, did we also do like this with them?) It means that did you not take half of the births as males? You did take. So, when you were persons with beards and moustaches.....you might have also tortured.

Time 22.20 to 23.20
A mataji asked – Baba, why do they fear Shankar so much? Why do BKs fear Shankar so much?
Baba replied – Why do you not fear Shankar? First this question needs to be answered. Why do you not fear Shankar and why do they fear Shankar so much? (A Brother said – We do not fear because we have come to know as to what is Shankar?) No. You have supported the soul of Ram, the soul of Krishna for 63 births. That is why, those who live with them for many births, why would they fear? And those who became opponents, and after becoming opponents, they attacked, they became foreigners, they became Muslims, they became Christians, and attacked. So, they became enemies, didn’t they? So, the one who is an enemy would fear seeing the powerful one in front, will he not?

Time 33.10 to 35.25
A Brother asked - Baba, for example, in 1976, on one side revelation of the Father had taken place. On the other side, Indira Gandhi had imposed emergency in the outside world and alongside Jaiprakash Narayan had started Satyagraha movement. So, how did such circumstances emerge?
Baba replied - One is the limited world and another is the unlimited world. Whatever you said was about the limited world. Similarly, even the agitation in the unlimited world of Brahmins had begun from Gujarat in 1976. The Janata Party (founded by Jaiprakash Narain) had also begun from Gujarat itself. It was not 'agyaantaa party' (party of ignorance), but 'jaanta party' (the knowledgeful party). Who was its chief? Jaiprakash Narayan and who was his special supporter? It was Krishnamurari Desai. Wasn’t he? (A Brother said - Yes) Morarji Desai. Who is called Murari? Krishna. So, the souls of both Ram and Krishna play a part together from 1976. The agitation starts from Gujarat. And that agitation spreads in entire India. More stress is laid on Delhi. Within a year Janata Party won all the seats in entire (the whole) Delhi. What did even the Advance Party do in 1976? They set up their camp in Delhi and unfurled the flag in Delhi. A complete sanyaas ashram (i.e. a BK center) shook. It did not just shake; it collapsed. That is why it has been said in the Murli - If a sanyaas ashram is completely uprooted, one would become famous. The entire center of Mehrauli collapsed. All the seekers of knowledge (jigyasu) got converted to the Advance Party. The kingdom of Indira Gandhi shook. Even here, there is an Indira Gandhi, whose mind is full of fear.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Disc.CD No.286, dated 03.04.07 at Jammu
Ref. No.Disc.CD-286-extracts-Part-IV,

Time 35.30 to 38.00
A Sister asked – Baba, it is told in the advance (knowledge) that – one must remember Baba while standing and sitting – it is told they tell like this in the course. A Brother used to say – when I get time for about an hour or two, how should I remember? In the basic knowledge it is told – wear this dress sometimes or they speak about the heaven. We always keep remembering the incorporeal within the corporeal. If they get an hour's time, those people sit (in remembrance). So, how should one remember? Many people ask.
Baba replied – Does the one whom someone starts loving, the one whom someone gives his/her heart, does he sit and remember him for one or two hours? The original remembrance does not last only for an hour or two. If one starts loving someone, if one becomes devoted to someone, if one gives his/her heart to someone, then he/she comes in our thoughts continuously. That is called – continuous remembrance. And that continuous remembrance, like the one between the lover and the beloved, is possible only when, the lover (mehboob) is also in corporeal form and the beloved (mehbooba) is also in corporeal form. So, this is a mantra (hymn) of easy remembrance. The so-called Brahmakumar-kumaris consider themselves to be in corporeal form and they consider the Father to be incorporeal. So, how would the love develop? The Father has guaranteed in the Murlis that – I would be with you till the end. We would live together, we would play together, we would eat together, we would go home and the new world together and He would take us along. So, did he say it in corporeal form or is it a matter of the incorporeal one? It is a matter of the corporeal one. So, those who have recognized the incorporeal in corporeal form, it becomes easy for them. For those who have recognized 100 percent, it is 100 percent easy. It is difficult to forget. For them it has been said in the Avyakt Vani now – the children cannot live without the Father, without the company of the corporeal (medium); and the Father cannot live without the children. At least the corporeal versions are definitely required. It is required every moment. Anything else?

Time 38.06 to 40.55
A mataji asked – Baba, do these beads of Rudramala, remain in their religion till the end or do they get converted to other religions?
Baba replied – All the beads of the Rudramala, 2.25 lakh among the 4.5 lakhs, would go and take birth in the other religions. They can leave their bodies and take birth in other religions. But they will not change their religion as long as they are alive. For example, (the soul of) Mahatma Buddha entered Siddharth. Siddharth got converted, but his Father, King Shuddhodhan and his Baba, i.e. Siddharth's grandfather, i.e. Bimbisaar did not get converted throughout his life. It means he did not go to Buddhism. After 4-6 births, when the numerical strength of Buddhism increases a lot, then he went and took birth at that time. The kingship of Buddhism has to be established. Why did he take birth? It is because the child Siddharth in whom the great soul entered and performed the great task, it was not contained in his intellect that - a soul comes from above. It performed this task. It converted the entire Eastern religious land. This matter was not in the intellect of Bimbisaar and Shuddhodhan. What did they understand? (A Brother said - that was done by Siddharth) Yes, they thought that - Siddharth performed the entire task. My child, who is born from my blood, has proved to be so great. He has proved to be so powerful. So, this impression fits in the intellect. The soul became influenced by that child. So, that impression that was created in the intellect, that seed does not get converted in that birth because it is a seed. That attachment shows its effect after two-four births and that soul takes birth among Buddhists in the Buddhist land. (A Brother asked - Does it come back again?) Hm? (A Brother asked - Does it come back again?) It performed its task and then it has to come back

Time 44.35 to 46.24
A Brother asked - Baba, has the Soul World become vacant now?
Baba replied - The population of human beings in the world has been mentioned to be seven hundred, seven hundred and fifty crores (7, 7.5 billion). What is the population at present? It must be Five hundred, six hundred crores (5, 6 billion). It must have reached six hundred and fifty crores (6.5 billion). So, will the number of souls descending from above go on increasing or will it go on decreasing? More and more souls would go on descending. (A Brother asked - Baba, when would they take birth on Earth and thereafter, when would they perform actions?) When would they take birth! When would they perform actions! Present day children aged 3 years also operate computers. So, when a 3 year old child can operate computers, cannot he remember Baba? (Someone said - Now the world has become sharp/clever) Still 30 years are remaining. And Baba says - it is the vaanprastha stage for all of you. What? Now it is everybody's vaanprastha stage. Vaanprastha stage means experienced. There is a trap of life, those who have taken the experience of that entanglement (janjaal) are called - vaanprasthi. The children also have taken the experience of the world. If it is observed - now-a-days parents are not as experienced as the children.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

A Brother asked - Baba, has the Soul World become vacant now? Baba replied - The population of human beings in the world has been mentioned to be seven hundred, seven hundred and fifty crores (7, 7.5 billion). What is the population at present? It must be Five hundred, six hundred crores (5, 6 billion). It must have reached six hundred and fifty crores (6.5 billion). So, will the number of souls descending from above go on increasing or will it go on decreasing? More and more souls would go on descending.

Is it known whether Baba/Virendra Dev Dixit is talking about Sakar Murlis or Murli Clarifications when it is said the figure 7, 7.5 Billion has been mentioned?

Disc.CD No.286, dated 03.04.07 at Jammu

Ref. No.Disc.CD-286-extracts-Part-V

Time 46.22 to 48.20
A mataji asked - Baba, in many areas Baba's message has not [yet] reached. For example, we go ... they ask us. So, after giving message, should we send them to the BKs or should we bring them here? Tell us, should we give them Advance Course or should we send them to the ones in basic [knowledge]?
Baba replied - Tell them the truth. It is not so that - we should narrate the basic knowledge; we should narrate the Advanced Knowledge. Do not narrate the false matters that are there in the basic knowledge. Narrate the true matters that are there in the basic knowledge. Advance means that it is true anyway. Give them the mixed knowledge [incorporating both basic and Advanced Knowledge]. For example - when God comes he creates the new world through Brahma. When he creates the new world, those who listen to The Knowledge from the mouth of Brahma and imbibe it in their lives, and narrate it to others, become mouthborn (mukhvanshavali) Brahmins and those who do not pay attention to the versions that emerge from the mouth (of Brahma), but pay more attention to the soft and smooth, healthy, attractive face; then they become womb-born (kukhvanshavali) Brahmins. The number of womb-born/lap-born progeny is very high and the number of mouth-born progeny is very less. So, two kinds of Brahmins were formed. One kind is the numerous demoniac Brahmins like Ravan, Kumbhakarna, and Meghnad in the world of Brahmins. And one kind is the mouthborn Brahmins who pay more attention to the versions that emerge from the mouth (of Brahma). So, now two parties have been formed. They would understand it.

Time 48.25 to 50.06
A Sister asked - Baba, if someone has to surrender, then they say to surrender when they become sensible by the age of 18 years. Likewise, what is the suitable age for children to go and do bhatti?
Baba replied – When they start becoming wise/sensible. It is not a rule that the one who attains the age of 18 years would only become wise/sensible. There are also 10-12 year old children who are sensible. And the second thing is that – the ashrams that Baba has come and opened, have been opened only for the safety of the virgins and mothers, is not it? If the parents observe/see that – our daughter is nine year old. She has not yet reached the age of 10-11. But the atmosphere of the colony (where they live) is very bad. The vibrations of the relatives who visit (their house) are also very dirty. So, even if the daughter is not wise/sensible, but if they surrender her, then do they commit a sin or do they perform a noble act? (Everyone said – they perform a noble act) Then also, it is a noble act. That is why in the path of worship, when the 9 Durgaas are worshipped, they do not select 18-year-old virgins. They select 9 year old or 10 year old virgins for worship. 9 year old virgin is considered to be very righteous.

Time 51.40 to 53.10
A Sister asked – Baba, a mother says – Baba has said in the Murli that – I shall live with you, I shall eat with you, and I shall play with you. So when it has been told to feed and offer something to drink, then why does Baba say that any matter related to Bhaktimarg is murdabad (damned/down, down)?
Baba replied –Offer food and drinks! Mothers start feeding into the mouth and mothers wish that – Baba should feed us. So, in the Murli Baba has said to the extent that – I shall eat with you. So, you may eat together (i.e. with Baba). I shall eat with you; So, there is no restriction for eating. Well, Baba comes and after the class is over, if every one starts stuffing his mouth with laddu-peda (Indian sweets), and the number is 1000, 2000 or 500. So, will this be Bhaktimarg (path of worship) or gyanmarg (path of knowledge)? As the action we perform, others would follow [the same] observing us. If one does like this, then the other 200, 500 [people] who are sitting would also do like that. Then what would be the condition? So, understanding (samajh) is called knowledge and whatever action is performed under ignorance, without thinking about its consequences is called ignorance. So, one must perform knowledge-ful acts. At that time it used to be OK. There were very few [people]. Now the number is increasing.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Is it known whether Baba/Veerendra Dev Dixit is talking about Sakar Murlis or Murli Clarifications when it is said the figure 7, 7.5 Billion has been mentioned?

I think he is talking about the Sakar Murlis, but I do not know if the proofs of the mention of 7, 7.5 billions is available in the original Sakar Murlis or not. I would request the nimit Sisters to find out and if I get any proof I would certainly post it in this section.

But it may also be possible that the above figures appeared only in the Murli clarifications.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Disc.CD No.331, dated 07.06.07 at Kushinagar

Ref. No.Disc.CD-331-extracts-Part-I

Time: 13.7
Someone asked: Baba, when Krishna would take birth, would the five hundred crore (5 billion) souls exist or not?
Baba replied: (Baba says that) I give the inheritance of heaven by coming in the midst of the hellish world. Had I not given the inheritance of heaven by coming in the midst of a hellish world, even the Christians would not believe in Paradise. They say that there was the kingdom of Lord Krishna. Even the Muslims believe in Jannat. So, from where did that Jannat come into their intellect? They must have understood Jannat at some point of time, isn’t it? So, Jannat, Paradise, Swarg, Vaikunth – this is filled in everyone’s intellect. Even though one may see through these eyes or not. Had everyone seen Indira Gandhi through their eyes? But if she would come in front (of them); if she had come in front (of them), then would they not have recognized her? They would have recognized, wouldn’t they? It is similar.

Time: 14.23
Someone asked: Baba, when Shri Krishna would take birth, will ShivBaba also not be present?
Baba replied: Arey, this is a straightforward matter. Does ShivBaba come to give heaven to the children? Does he come to give the new world? Or does he come to experience heaven himself? He is such a Father, who himself comes in the forest of thorns and gives the garden of flowers to the children and then departs. Those who give happiness are called flowers and those who give sorrows are called thorns.

Time: 15.8
Someone asked: Baba, it is mentioned in the Murli that until the vibrations of 5.5 billion exist, nobody can become pure. Then how would the entire world see the nine lakh souls?
Baba replied: In the beginning of the Yagya, bloodshed took place in 1947 in [between] Hindustan and Pakistan. Rivers of blood had flowed; entire trainloads of people were killed. There was a scene of miserable hell (raurav nark) in entire India and Pakistan. In the midst of that scene, the gathering of 400-500 (Brahmin souls) was living very comfortably and peacefully. How was that? Did any fighting and killing take place there? Did they come to know about the world of sorrows? They did not even come to know. So, all those souls who would go on becoming pure, viceless by making efforts, they would become the bead of vijaymala and would be taken to the new world. They would not remain in the old world. For which Baba has said – This fort-like gathering of Brahmins would become such that not even a single vicious, sinful human being would be able to enter. Even now it has been said – it is being told continuously in the Avyakt Vanis since two-three years. [He] speaks especially to the eight children. It has been told to them – You children have been given the gathering-like gift of the new world. You visit that gathering, don’t you? So, will that gathering be in this world or would it be outside? So who will need to ask? Is it those who would come in the eight or is it those who are outside the eight? Those who would not have made efforts like the eight would ask where is that gathering? As regards the ones who come, it has been said for them – You come and go, don’t you? So, if the gathering of the eight can become like this; their matter is being discussed since two-three years. So, can’t that (gathering) of the 108 get prepared? It can. Can’t that (gathering) of the 16108 get prepared? It can. Can’t that (gathering) of the 9 lakhs get prepared? Oh! the world is of 500-700 crores. It is not a big deal for such a gathering to get prepared in it. When the Pandavs were wandering incognito for so many years and the world did not know. So, will such 9 lakh souls not emerge? Even among them four and a half lakhs would not have their own body at all. How many bodily beings would be there? Four and a half lakhs. So, don’t you understand? Did you? You did.

Time: 19.6
Someone asked: The seven sages (saptarishi) are praised in the scriptures. Are these seven sages the eight deities?
Baba replied: What does rishi mean? Pure. And would the foundation of the mind of the eight souls who would make the best efforts be pure (first) or would the foundation of the bodily organs be pure first? (The foundation of) mind would be pure (first). They are called the beads of the rosary of Rudramala. Shankarji is shown to be wearing a rosary of heads (mundmala). Is the body (torso) shown? Mund maal itself means that their mind is engrossed in The Knowledge. It is engrossed in the new world. It is engrossed in the planning of service.

Time: 19.57
Someone asked: The praise of Sage Kashyap that is there, will it be said to be of ShivBaba?
Baba replied: What does Kaashyap mean? What does tej mean? The ardour (tej) of remembrance. The ardour of the remembrance of the Supreme Soul is filled in him. So, which picture is shown in the world, in the Indian region to be like this that it is always shown to be full of the ardour of remembrance. The picture of Shankarji. So, those who are the eight deities, in the form of angels, those who are the most elevated children of the Father, would they remember the bodily beings belonging to the world? So, would they be incorporeal or corporeal? They would be the ones in the incorporeal stage. As the Father so the children. When the Father comes, He departs after making (us) equal to himself. How many (souls) does He make equal to Himself? He makes eight (souls) equal to Himself. All of them would become the ones in the incorporeal stage. They would be the ones with pure thoughts in their mind. They would not be the ones who cause harm to anyone. When they get revealed then they would become visible. What? If they are not revealed, then they would not even be visible. First the stage should be attained, then they would reveal the Father. That is why it has been said in the Avyakt Vani that only the incorporeal stage would reveal the Father. Has it been said or not? It has been said.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.

Time: 14.23 Someone asked: Baba, when Shri Krishna would take birth, will ShivBaba also not be present?
Baba replied: Arey, this is a straightforward matter. Does ShivBaba come to give heaven to the children? Does he come to give the new world? Or does he come to experience heaven himself? He is such a Father, who himself comes in the forest of thorns and gives the garden of flowers to the children and then departs. Those who give happiness are called flowers and those who give sorrows are called thorns.

This raises an interesting point if I am reading it correctly, it is saying ShivaBaba will not be around when Krishna is born?

Which would mean the period of Shiva's part is less than the 100 years Confluence Age. For example if Krishna is born 18 years before 2036, then Shiva's part will be cut by 18 years.

Is it possible to get a clarification on the length of Shiva's part being less than the 100 years Confluence Age?

Time 48.25 to 50.06
A Sister asked - Baba, if someone has to surrender, then they say to surrender when they become sensible by the age of 18 years. Likewise, what is the suitable age for children to go and do bhatti?
Baba replied – When they start becoming wise/sensible. It is not a rule that the one who attains the age of 18 years would only become wise/sensible. There are also 10-12 year old children who are sensible. And the second thing is that – the ashrams that Baba has come and opened, have been opened only for the safety of the virgins and mothers, is not it? If the parents observe/see that – our daughter is nine year old. She has not yet reached the age of 10-11. But the atmosphere of the colony (where they live) is very bad. The vibrations of the relatives who visit (their house) are also very dirty. So, even if the daughter is not wise/sensible, but if they surrender her, then do they commit a sin or do they perform a noble act? (Everyone said – they perform a noble act) Then also, it is a noble act. That is why in the path of worship, when the 9 Durgaas are worshipped, they do not select 18-year-old virgins. They select 9 year old or 10 year old virgins for worship. 9 year old virgin is considered to be very righteous.

Arjunbhai, Could you ask ShivBaba to clarify the meaning of the age "9". Could this be an age mentioned in some Indian scriptures, if so which or what is the story/legend behind this?

Wouldn't the age of 0 be the best time to surrender ?

Wouldn't the age of 0 be the best time to surrender ?

I think, in this case, surrender means being given over to the Yagya or any kind of spiritual organisation, maybe even parental control. I am not sure though, babies might prove difficult?

Arjunbhai, Could you ask ShivBaba to clarify the meaning of the age "9". Could this be an age mentioned in some Indian scriptures, if so which or what is the story/legend behind this?

Omshanti. I will convey your querry to Baba. As regards the age 'nine' of virgins, I think it is mentioned in some scriptures, (may be those related to the various forms of Durga/shakti).

Wouldn't the age of 0 be the best time to surrender ?

I am confused - is it really '0' that you have written above or was it intended to be '10'? By the way, children cannot surrender their lives to Baba at AIVV. They can live there only if their parents agree to it in writing.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Just popped in.

Yes, I did mean 0 (zero).

Because I take the case of the birth of Krishna as example. The child that is born to be Krishna and understood of this role at 18, would need full protection from the age of 0, as he would not develop worldy karmic accounts. The child would be born in a pure environment, which is also confusing since the purest environment is that when both couples are Brahmins and celibate, so would intercourse have had taken place ? (I have yet to work out into how baby Krishna is conceived although this has being discussed elsewhere in the forum).

Or let's take the case of Jesus, He was according to scriptures (someone correct me with my inaccuracies) born as Jesus and Son of God from birth, hence 3 kings, star, Xmas etc. I do not know at what age Mohammed knew He was the son of God (well I do but I have not fully studied it in depth).

However, I am slightly off course here, but maybe since there are deeper points from this "age" discussion.

Basically, my view is if a baby is brought up from 0 in the purest of environments, then that child need not have attain worldy karmic accounts. A bit like why the Dalai Lama scouts look for their next holy reincarnation in a child somewhere in the world as early as possible.

Thus 0 is the earliest age I can think of. Why 9. Why not 8. or 7, or 6. Why not 10 ? etc. If the couple who gives birth wants the best for their child, would they not surrender their child at birth ? Of course, the couple may bring up the child themselves up to a certain age within their family environment, but if the parents thought what was best, why not surrender the infant straightaway (but the issue of how this child was conceived raises questions already) and maybe even be looked after under direct supervision of ShivBaba. Maybe even the couple need to move in with ShivBaba, though practically this is difficult.

I would have liked to have born into a spiritual ashram from the age of 0. Just imagine not knowing what chocolate, Nikes and PlayStations are as a child nowadays . However, each soul has their own part. Births and deaths of souls in the Confluence Age is a deep subject.

I apologise if the above make random sense. I am in a bit of a rush to leave for a few weeks. It's just food for open thought, it doesn't bother me. I hope Baba can explain the significance of the age of 9.

Thanks for the sharing in the churnings and postings within this thread, feel many other things will eventually be revealed over time at the right moment.

Disc.CD No.365, dated 31.07.07 at Bangalore

Ref. No.Disc.CD-365-extracts-Bangalore

Time: 3.35
Someone asked: Baba, when the ozone layer gets eroded/damaged, then the sunrays fall directly on the Earth. Then, it means that destruction takes place. So, what does it mean in the unlimited sense?
Baba replied: What is called ‘Oj’? What does ‘Oj’ mean? That is the physical sun and the physical ozone layer. But what is the highest thing possessed by the human beings? Through what is even the will power produced? It is produced through oj. Ojvaan (energetic), veeryavaan (vigorous), pratibhavaan (genius/brilliant). From where do all kinds of genius/brilliance come? It comes from Oj (i.e vigour). And even in case of vigour, can only the men retain more vigour or can the women also retain (more vigour)? Men can retain more, but they cannot do it without giving respect to the mothers. Those men who will give respect to the mothers, to all the virgins and the mothers, (thinking) that God is the Father and all these are our mothers, will view/see (them) as mother gurus, even if it is one’s wife. Only those, who will view souls as Brothers will be able to assimilate the vigor. When that ozone, the highest power of the land, in the form of virgins and mothers, which is also connected to the space above the atmosphere; gets eroded, then will the impurity increase or decrease? The heat of impurity will go on increasing. The more the heat of lust increases, the closer will the destruction come. So, ozone is very important, especially when the Father comes. The sun’s direct rays of The Knowledge should not fall on the human beings. Who has been made instrumental in between? The virgins and the mothers have been made instrumental. That is why it has been said – To whom has God given the right to narrate The Knowledge? To the virgins and the mothers. The right has been given just to the virgins. So, should He come in a male body or does He come in a female body? Should He come in a male body? If He comes in a male body, then will a man become instrumental or will a woman become instrumental? Arey, when He comes in a male body, then who will become instrumental to give knowledge? Man himself will become (instrumental). Will one not be compelled to listen to The Knowledge through a man? Does the Father see Jagdamba? ... When the Father comes, then the pot of knowledge ... (someone said – to the mothers), what has been shown in the scriptures? To whom does he give it? It is shown in the hands of Lakshmi.

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Note:- The Hindi and English versions of the extracts of above mentioned Discussion CD are just draft versions. Only when the translation of the entire discussion contained in this VCD* is released, that may be considered as the final version. The words added within brackets in the English version have been added by the Translator to make the meaning more clear. The words in italics are Hindi words.