Food for thought for all PBKs

Hey, I can see a new group emerging here

the Shivensa Kumaris?

Do the Murlis say that the BKWSU, or you, have the right to withhold the Murlis?. I hope the effort I am making to discover and share these will encourage you to share your wealth.

Dear ex-l.

I have never held on to any Murli and i have always shared my wealth (unlike the BKs) with anyone who is interested in these gems of knowledge (otherwise i would not be on this forum). I have always sent Murli xerox to my PBK friends in India and abroad and after some time i have asked them on phone about any gems of knowledge which they could find and i received a negative reply and they said that they do not know what to look for and how to look for. That is what i have been emphasizing; that if one does not know what to look for, then they may be well sitting on the treasure (like the BKs who have the whole stock of Murlis) but they do not know how to unlock it. "THE EYE DOES NOT SEE WHAT THE MIND DOES NOT KNOW".

I DO NOT MIND SENDING YOU THE XEROX COPIES OF ORIGINAL Murlis IN Hindi EVEN THOUGH, I DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH YOU WILL BE BENEFITTED. YOU AND JOHN CAN SEND ME YOUR POSTAL ADDRESS AND I WILL SEND SOME ORIGINAL Murli XEROX AND LET US SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN HELP YOURSELF. PLEASE SEND ME YOUR POSTAL ADDRESS AND I WILL SEND THE Murlis TO YOU BY REGISTERED POST.

But i am not going to spend my precious time in scaning the Murlis, translating or typing them and then putting them on the net. Please consider this as a closed chapter and please do not bring about this topic of posting the Murlis on the net in future. I do not mind spending few thousand rupees to send the Murli xerox copies to you by post.

shivsena.

I DO NOT MIND SENDING YOU THE XEROX COPIES OF ORIGINAL Murlis IN Hindi EVEN THOUGH, I DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH YOU WILL BE BENEFITTED; YOU AND JOHN CAN SEND ME YOUR POSTAL ADDRESS AND I WILL SEND SOME ORIGINAL Murli XEROX AND LET US SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN HELP YOURSELF; PLEASE SEND ME YOUR POSTAL ADDRESS AND I WILL SEND THE Murlis TO YOU BY REGISTERED POST.

Sivasena

That is most generous of you and very exciting news. I have been meaning for a while to learn Hindi and this is a perfect motivation to do just that.

Thank you very much and good. OK ... to get to work.

Shivasena, what good will it do us? In truth, not a lot. It will in the first place only give us more of a burden! But what it will do in the long run is open up and start to free and empower the whole family giving them direct access to a more authentic, more original truth so at least they will start to be able to engage in the finer discussions you offer.

Practically, it would be wiser to do two things. Copy them as they are so that there can be several copies in a number of countries all around the world. But also transcribe them to written text that can be copied and pasted onto the internet where it can be printed off and shared with any one. Even loyal BKs ask for this, if we empower them with knowledge, earn their respect and gratitude, then change will come about faster.

Should we be organising this in private? No, let the BKs know.

Practically, it would still be good to have someone in India transcribe them out. This might need to be done in two stages. if the llimits of your generousity is to copy them, and that is good enough, then perhaps we have to get them to someone else to type them up. Translation can come after. I am afraid that if we have to wait on John learning Hindi the Kalpa will be over before the job is finished!

Great news.

Dear arjun Bhai and PBK Brothers.

Here is real food for thought for all PBKs.

In Murlis, it has been said that Bap comes in ''vanaprashta awastha'' (meaning between the age of 60-65). Brahma Baba (Lekhraj Kirpalani) was 60 years of age when Shivbap entered into him to relay direct Murlis from karachi from 1947. When Brahma (Lekhraj Kirpalani) left his body in 1969, then Shiv+Krishna entered into Virendra Dev Dixit. This is the conventional advance teaching all PBKs know. Now my dillemma is that, Shivbap entered in Lekhraj Kirpalani as mother's part at the age of 60, but Shivbap enters Virendra Dev Dixit to play the role of Bap-teacher-satguru, at the age of 27(considering that Virendra Dev Dixit was born in Kampil in 1942). This goes against the Murli point that "main vanaprashta awastha mein aata hun'' (meaning ''I come in the Chariot at the age of 60'' ). So, again, ambiguity is obvious between what is taught in Advanced Knowledge and what Shivbap says in Murlis.

Also it is not at all clear, as to what Shivbap did from 1969 to 1976 in Virendra Dev Dixit, and why was the Advanced Knowledge first revealed only in 1976 (after 7 years) to a small gathering of souls in Delhi (when it has been said in Murlis that "Bap toh aate hi Gyan sunana shuru kar dete hai" -- meaning that "Father comes and starts narrating The Knowledge immediately").

So the query remains, why Shivbap did not start narrating the Advanced Knowledge immediately after entry into Virendra Dev Dixit in 1969 (or is there some other deep meaning of the original statement of Shivbap, which nobody has the eye to see).

Can any PBK please throw some light on this ambiguity?

shivsena.

Omshanti. The Q&A that I have coveyed to Baba for approval with regard to Shivsena Bhai's above views is as follows:

Ques: It has been said in the Murlis that the Father enters in the vanprasth stage. Then how did Father Shiv enter into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969 at the age of 27?
Ans: Father Shiv had entered into the soul of Ram in 1936 in the vanprasth stage. In 1969 it was a subtle matter of a stage beyond Vani (sounds) and not a gross matter of completing an age of 60 years.

Ques:It has been said in the Murlis that ‘Father comes and starts narrating The Knowledge immediately’. So, when the Father entered into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969, then why didn’t he start narrating knowledge immediately instead of 1976?
Ans: Father entered into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969 but was revealed to others only in 1976 and hence He started giving knowledge only from 1976.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

___________________________________________
Note: 1. As per the research of bro. ex-l, the year 1936 as mentioned above is subject to debate.

2. I am posting the draft of Q&A in advance so that other PBKs could know whether the above questions raised by Shivsena Bhai have been conveyed to Baba or not because the approval from Baba may take quite some time. I have also conveyed today some more questions raised by Shivsena Bhai in this thread besides the personal question raised by BK Sparkal in another thread. Since I do not have enough time I would only be conveying a gist of the question and not the entire views. So, the concerned souls are requested not to feel offended. If they feel that I am doing injustice to them by not conveying their questions fully, they are free to convey the same to Baba through email.

Note: 1. As per the research of bro. ex-l, the year 1936 as mentioned above is subject to debate.

Following the upset this has cause Andrey, and perhaps some of our voiceless readers, I should state that all I report is what it says in the BK's own literature. All it shows is that the "official history" does not match with the actual events and either I, nor the majority of others, "know" when the alleged incarnation took place. It could have been 1936 but then that would not explain why there was no mention of Shiva by name until after 1949.

I am seemingly being accused of being anti-BK. This is not my position. I am pro-truth. I think that these events are of such importance that we deserve honesty, accuracy and an explanation of why the history was revised.

If this was politics, or academia, we would not just have the right to facts and corrections but the individuals who were engaged in the revision would face a professional inquiry. If 1% of what we are told in The Knowledge, both beginners or advance, is true; then these events are of such a magnitutude that they eclipse any political or professional scandal that humanity has known.

Why does it matter? Why should one just not relax back into the myth and enjoy the present?

Because at the core of these issues are the questions of the true nature of God and the true nature of those that pose themselves to be the representatives and authority of God. Is that not worth investigating? Where we discover anomalies, we have an immediate responsibility to withdraw erroneous or questionable data until we are sure of our position.

I should probably withdraw from the PBK forum.

I should probably withdraw from the PBK forum.

No need at all. We all are investigating truth and it is possible that the research into the history of Yagya may bring out many more truths which were hitherto unknown to us.
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Why does it matter? Why should one just not relax back into the myth and enjoy the present?
Because at the core of these issues are the questions of the true nature of God and the true nature of those that pose themselves to be the representatives and authority of God. Is that not worth investigating? Where we discover anomalies, we have an immediate responsibility to withdraw erroneous or questionable data until we are sure of our position.

Dear ex-l.

That is very well said; if we are seekers of the absolute truth, then it is our moral duty to point out the discrepancies and anomalies in the events, that have been happening in the Yagya in both basic and Advanced Knowledge ; and one has to be fearless about presenting one's views and face criticism with a pinch of salt.

shivsena.

[quote="shivsena]

That is very well said; if we are seekers of the absolute truth, then it is our moral duty to point out the discrepancies and anomalies in the events, that have been happening in the Yagya in both basic and Advanced Knowledge ; and one has to be fearless about presenting one's views and face criticism with a pinch of salt.
shivsena

I agree and really I think it's simple 'God equals truth'.
Those that seek to hide the truth or block others from finding or revealing the truth are being ungodly.

To sit back and say 'what does it matter it is just drama' , I don't think that is understanding correctly, in Murli it says 'if you do not do action you will not even receive a glass of water'

Ques: It has been said in the Murlis that the Father enters in the vanprasth stage. Then how did Father Shiv enter into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969 at the age of 27?
Ans: Father Shiv had entered into the soul of Ram in 1936 in the vanprasth stage. In 1969 it was a subtle matter of a stage beyond Vani (sounds) and not a gross matter of completing an age of 60 years.

Dear arjun Bhai.
There are many loose ends in the above answer from Baba.

First of all, we do not have the birth date of Sevakram and so we do not know that his age would be 60 when Shivbap first entered him in 1936-37. Also, according to Advanced Knowledge, Shivbap first entered into Gita Mataa and so the question arises was Gita mataa 60 years when Shivbap first entered her??
Also Sevakram was a mortal Chariot and and Virendra Dev Dixit is the mukarar Chariot. So in mortal Chariot Shivbap enters at the age of 60 and in permanent immortal Chariot Shivbap enters at the age of 27. This is the discrepancy i am talking about. Shivbap Murlis (from 1965 to 1969) point out towards the immortal mukarar rath in future and not the past mortal rath of sevakram when the Murlis were not even started and The Knowledge was still unknown.
shivsena

Ques: It has been said in the Murlis that, "Father comes and starts narrating The Knowledge immediately". So, when the Father entered into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969, then why did not he start narrating knowledge immediately instead of 1976?
Ans: Father entered into the body of the soul of Ram in 1969 but was revealed to others only in 1976 and hence He started giving knowledge only from 1976.

Again many loose ends here;

Omnipotent Shivbap enters Virendra Dev Dixit in 1969 and starts giving knowledge from 1976 and immediately after 1976 the whole Advance Party of about 55 souls (who had heard from Shivbap starts disintigrating), i.e. Omnipotent Shivbap (Bap-teacher-satguru), cannot maintain unity of even 55 souls and from then on for 5 years (from 1976 to 1981), Virendra Dev Dixit (ShivBaba, according to PBKs) travels all over India and then comes back to his native Kampil and settles down and only in 1989 the Advanced Knowledge starts in practical, when 9 kanyas from south India surrender. What i want to say is, why did it take 20 years (from 1969 to 1989) for omnipotent Shivbap to establish the Advanced Knowledge (so called truth) and till today, Shivbap (God) has not been able to maintain unity with this so called truth of Advanced Knowledge. Why this is so???? This is what all PBKs would like to know.

shivsena.

First of all, we do not have the birth date of Sevakram and so we do not know that his age would be 60 when Shivbap first entered him in 1936-37. Also, according to Advanced Knowledge, Shivbap first entered into Gita Mataa and so the question arises was Gita mataa 60 years when Shivbap first entered her?

No one has clarified for me who Gita Mata was but; Jamna Shewakram Daryanan of Dasvani Lane was aged 60 and married in 1938. Is she the wife?

Here;Om Mandli Members. I would expect that his wife was a few years younger. But should we be so slavishly stuck on 1936 until Virendra Dev Dixit has looked over this book?

There are many loose ends in the above answer from Baba.

The above reply is not from Baba but has been sent to Baba for approval.

Now let me come to the point: why do you have to do the hard work of reading the Murlis repeatedly several times to search for the gems of knowledge, when I have a long list of the gems (along with the dates of Murlis and queries attached), which I am going to post on this forum in the next few months. You just eat the gems and start churning right away, instead of wasting precious time in reading the Murlis and searching for the gems.

Also it is not at all clear, as to what Shivbap did from 1969 to 1976 in Veerendra Dev Dixit, and why was the Advanced Knowledge first revealed only in 1976 (after 7 years) to a small gathering of souls in Delhi (when it has been said in Murlis that "Bap toh aate hi Gyan sunana shuru kar dete hai" -- meaning that "Father comes and starts narrating The Knowledge immediately").

Omshanti. The phrase from Murlis as quoted by Shivsena Bhai in Hindi and English do not appear to be either actual words of ShivBaba nor are they accompanied with actual dates. Is it these unpolished gems of knowledge that we are supposed to eat instead of wasting precious time in reading Murlis and searching for the gems?

Churning of Murlis for gems of knowledge is indeed a good work but it would be appreciated if the gems are presented in original form along with their dates of production (i.e.narration/revision).

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Churning of Murlis for gems of knowledge is indeed a good work but it would be appreciated if the gems are presented in original form along with their dates of production (i.e.narration/revision).

Dear arjun Bhai.

I am very sorry to say, but you cut a very sorry figure, when you claim that you have you have never heard the Murli point ("bap toh aate hi Gyan sunana shuru kar dete hain") before. I will search for the Murli date and post it on the net. Meanwhile you can ask any PBK whether such a point exists in Murli and and you will see how well read the other PBKs are.

shivsena.