BK member for five years

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Pink Panther

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Re: BK member for five years

Post13 Sep 2013

I appreciated reading your update exbkmember.

You may already know this, but if you don't you may find it helpful.

Bipolar "disorder" has been recently found to be related to schizophrenia in that both correlate to a particular protein in the brain. The conventional recent treatments and therapies can be further influenced for the better by diet and activity. From memory, it's mainly the B group vitamins, a ketogenic (and alkalising) diet and oxygen (physical activity and breath exercises etc) and clearing out chemical and other toxic influences from the inner and outer environment, e.g. if you ever worked in an industry or lived in an area that exposed you to such things (but don't get neurotic about it!!).

I am sure you'll find better and more personally relevant information than what I can relate here from memory, so may I suggest you google and limit your search to the last two or three years (use google's search tools/time/custom range) to read up on it.

Glad to hear you are in a good situation etc. All the best.
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ex-l

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Re: BK member for five years

Post13 Sep 2013

Yes, thank you for coming back, your feedback and update. Personal news like that makes it all worthwhile. I remember you.
exbkmember wrote:It was helpful to me to share my experiences and thoughts on this site. Being BK was such an important part of my life and moving on from it and the grieving process involved in that was not easy

... although I very much would like organisation to be more open and honest.

In a way, your use or experience of the BKs is what a good ashram should be. The important part being something Pink Panther mentioned not too long ago ... that once you feel better, or are through the difficult part of your life; you move on, you are encouraged to move on, you feel fine about moving on. Onwards and upwards.

Although in the BK case, I agree, the full costs of it (personal ones more than financial), are questionable. I believe that the leaders encourage addiction to the cult as they live off the cult and that other followers encourage addiction to justify and support their own addiction. It's seems to work in highly addictive manner, mentally, and entraps some kinds of individuals.
On the financial side, I think I broke even with my BK connection, I did give them loads of money but someone who perhaps realised this and maybe worried about bad Karma helped me out by putting me in touch with someone who saved me lots of money after I left them.

I think you should estimate how much and write a formal letter to the BKWSU asking for it back on the grounds that you were in a vulnerable state and they had exercised 'undue influence' based on false predictions of the End of the World, false representation of their religion and so on. We can help you in what to say.

You don't have to accept it for yourself if you don't want (although you have a perfect right to). If you don't want to, you can always give it to a proper charity. Better a cat and dog home or starving children had it than the BKs.

It might take courage to do so, you might not want to stomach having any contact with them, but it would be interesting to see how they responded.

I think, at the bottomline, it's the only thing the leaders are really interested in and the language they understand best.

Or, if it is a lot, you could get a lawyer to do so. It may seem confrontational to you or it may not be your style but I hope people do. I think its the only way to get them to stop them abusing people. I would not allow possibly superstition beliefs to allow them to escape responsibility.
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exbkmember

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Re: BK member for five years

Post15 Sep 2013

Thank you

I don't think I would ever have become involved with BK had I been well and sound of mind. I still find it difficult to have a decisive opinion on if the BK organisation is overall more beneficial or harmful. I think it varies a lot according to people's personal circumstances and how deeply they get involved.

In my personal case, I was so very unwell and unhappy at the time of coming in contact with BK that I overall benefited from the time I was involved with them. I can however see how someone's life could be destroyed by contact with BK organisation under different circumstances. I got involved with very little to lose and a lot to gain. I was single, in a low paid job, I was not ambitious and for personal reasons. I had no plans to have children. I was socially very isolated and already did not drink or smoke. I very reserved and shy, I dressed very modestly and did not often wear make up or go out. For me, under those circumstances, the BK lifestyle was not a big leap or a big ask. Going to class every day and spending time with other BK members remains the height of my social activity history. I was suicidal prior to joining BK. Being in that starting state is what mostly enabled me to benefit from my BK contact.

For someone who joined with a promising career, a loving partner and a wish to have children I can see they would lose far more than I did. Financially, I gave what I gave willingly at the time and although I had what proved to be unrealistic hopes and expectations of a long term life in BK organisation, I don't feel bitter about it. I was not financially wealthy, I did not give any property because I had none to give. I won't be trying to claim money back as I feel my personal financial Karma with them is already balancing out.

Other people as broken as I was could have turned to drugs etc and been lost in that addiction, I feel fortunate that my misspent youth was with a puritanical cult rather than a drug habit. That's just one way I get my head around it. Things could have been so much worse for me. The BKs most damaging effect on me was disappointment. Had I gone down another road the damage might have been death and I know for some the BK path has lead to death. I came out the other side of BK generally better off than when I went in, although it was not the outcome I hoped for.

I really was very innocent when I joined them, far more innocent than I realised at the time. I genuinely intended to give my life to BK organisation. I was proud to wear my ring and I hoped in time to be invited to join a centre. I had excellent centre in charge potential, they missed a trick by not giving me enough support and holding on to me. Had I been a home owner or someone more high up in society, I suspect I would have been more valued by them. As it was, I was someone who was what they wanted according to teachings but not what they really wanted. It hurt a lot that I was so willing to give all I could of myself and that I was not invited to live with other BK. It was a lonely life and that together with the hypocrisy and pressure to bring others in to organisation is what meant I felt I had to leave.

In my mind, it was a five year marriage that ultimately failed due to a mismatch of needs. I lost hope of my needs for belonging and companionship being met. I objected to the dishonesty in organisation and feeling so uncomfortable being part of that was the final straw for me.

I think the positive thinking courses and some of the outreach stuff is of benefit to people who never get in to it any deeper than that. I object to the drip feeding of information that they know full well will put people off. I object to the re-writing of materials and changing of numbers etc. I object to the hushing up of the many failed predictions. I am very glad that these things are now easily visible in today's modern world. Quick Google search now reveals much of what they wish to keep hidden and I am reassured to know many people have chance to make more informed choices due to that. It's sad that some people do not have that easy access to information.

As time goes on, the BK organisation appears more and more shiny and polished on outside but also they lose the power to hide the truth of what lies beneath that shiny exterior. Relationship wise they are like a smooth talking charmer with a sparkle in the eye who tells you what you want to hear in order to have their way with you. That same charmer could be a bit of harmless fun for someone who knows what they are getting in to or a devastating heart break for someone who is blind sided and trusts too much in false impressions. I survived my interaction with the BK charm and came out wiser for it, some came away better than me and some far worse. For the sake of those who came away worse off than me, I whole heartfelt support the BK organisation being exposed for what they are until they are willing to be honest and upfront about it themselves.

Sites like this are very helpful in showing a different perspective than the sugar coated self-promotion BK do. I think it is also very important and healing for ex-BK members and people damaged by someone they care for being involved with BK. I am now in therapy for many different issues and I have to describe my history to therapists etc. None of them understand what BK are or how my involvement with them affected me. Only other people who have had similar experiences with BK could ever understand. It is very isolating and damaging not to be able to talk about those experiences and feelings and feel understood. Sites like that provide a very useful platform to be able to share and feel understood. I am glad it is available. I am not out there with all guns blazing against BK but I can certainly understand why some people are. I can also understand why other people are very protective of it. I think people deserve the freedom to speak freely about their feelings and views and this site very much allows that.
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Pink Panther

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Re: BK member for five years

Post16 Sep 2013

I feel fortunate that my misspent youth was with a puritanical cult rather than a drug habit.

Indeed! I know someone whose 25 y.o. son has spent the last decade wasting his potential, habituated to drink and drugs, almost unemployable, anti-social a lot of the time. She said "I sometimes wish he'd even join a cult and become fanatical or born again, just to clean up his act and show some enthusiasm for something"! (She made an unintended pun; enthusiasm means 'filled with god" or "god-inspired")
I am now in therapy for many different issues and I have to describe my history to therapists etc. None of them understand what BK are or how my involvement with them affected me. Only other people who have had similar experiences with BK could ever understand.

No single therapist can understand all the different needs of each person that presents. There are, however, therapists who do understand the mentality of those who are attracted to, and indeed even benefited from, involvement with inward looking sub-cultures (cults). There are many similarities in different cults - not just religious ones, but also any group identification (gangs etc) where one finds one's identity through belonging. In the end, a therapist does not impart anything, they facilitate one's own process of recalibrating.

Often the therapist is only an "addendum", the 'add-on, "the 'someone to talk to' that assists the main therapeutic process which is living one's life well and connecting to the world according to values other than the group's. That is, a regular therapist's visit on its own is no substitute for living Life with awareness, reflection, flexibility and compassion (for self and others).
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arvind.giri

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Re: BK member for five years

Post14 Jan 2014

The whole denial of natural human affection was the most painful thing. Due to my undiagnosed and untreated bi-polar I was often extremely distressed in floods of tears and my center head was not even comfortable to do the very human thing of giving me a cuddle.

All BKs are on their journey and may have different understanding of the same point in Murli. As per my understanding, 'natural human affection' is not denied in BK. Rather it is just opposite, BKs are supposed to spread love to all, irrespective of other's nature and background. The meaning of denial of affection is: Don't limit your affection to you near and dear ones but spread it without limit. Again center head may not be correct here, but he/she is also on the journey as you were.

Also I must accept that idea of "Since you have joined BK you are a angel" is not very true but it is again how Baba used to motivate people.

Anyways God is not limited to BKs. Keep practicing what your heart accepts. Don't prohibit any habit only because BKs do it.

You are a beautiful and strong soul ... Wish you a very happy life ahead :).

Om Shanti !!!
Arvind
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ex-l

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Re: BK member for five years

Post14 Jan 2014

arvind.giri wrote:As per my understanding, 'natural human affection' is not denied in BK.

"Natural human affection" means touching, holding, hugging and in BK speak "attachment".

"As per my understanding" means very little ... it may not even be honest. What you might be saying is, "this is how I would like to present BKism. Are you seriously telling us that the BKWSU now allows interpersonal relationship based on like and pleasure, and that ones that aren't for the sake of service?

And that is what the Murlis say now?

Please allow me to ask you one last time, your profile says you are a "exiting BK". That means you are leaving the BKWSU. Is that true? Are you leaving the BKWSU?

How long have you been in The Knowledge?

Thank you.
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ex.brahma

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Re: BK member for five years

Post15 Jan 2014

This forum has witnessed the appearence of newcomers, who try to gain acceptance by claimig that they are "exiting BKs", "questioning BK", or even "ëx BKs" ...

It would not take long before their true faith and face become exposed, no matter how hard they try to hide it ...

Changing masks is one "talent", they learn fron BK cult teachings ...
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arvind.giri

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Re: BK member for five years

Post16 Jan 2014

Please allow me to ask you one last time, your profile says you are a "exiting BK". That means you are leaving the BKWSU. Is that true? Are you leaving the BKWSU?

I must accept that I read the Code of Ethics, Editorial Policy, Forum Guidelines and Site Disclaimer etc after getting repeated questions here. I never read terms and conditions anywhere :) ... By the way, I did not know that it is a closed group for ex BKs and BKs planning to quit. Frankly speaking, so far I am not thinking to quit unless you give me some solid reasons to do so :).

I have a question though, the forum description says
This code sets out Brahma Kumaris Info's purpose which is to:

• support ex-BKs and individuals exiting the BKWSU

then why don't this fact is put straight forward to the people who post here thinking that it is a BK forum. Shouldn't this be clearly told to them that this forum is for ex-BKs and individuals exiting the BKWSU. Wouldn't it be fair for them to see both sides of coin and decide for themselves.
This forum has witnessed the appearence of newcomers, who try to gain acceptance by claimig that they are "exiting BKs", "questioning BK", or even "ëx BKs" ...

It would not take long before their true faith and face become exposed, no matter how hard they try to hide it ...

Changing masks is one "talent", they learn fron BK cult teachings ...

I am a newcomer, was listening to the Gyan over TV and Youtube for quite sometime and have joined BKs few months ago, and I am not here to defend each and every activity of BKWSU. I was only expecting a healthy discussion over Gyan.

Om Shanti !!!
Arvind
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ex-l

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Re: BK member for five years

Post16 Jan 2014

So you are a BK, not an exiting BK ... I wonder why you said you were exiting then? It's a problem when you start off with a dishonest statement, we'll start by wondering if all the next ones you make are also dishonest.

If you consider yourself a BK, how pukka a BK are you? Do you go to morning class and practise Amrit Vela meditation every day? To be honest, unless you are a pukka BK and have been involved in the BKWSU for some time, you should probably be asking questions first rather than giving advice.

If you want to discuss The Knowledge with varying degrees of believers, you might try, bk-pbk.info.

People here will probably start by wondering if you are just in the "Honeymoon Phase" of BKness, when everything appears new and wonderful, and you get a lot of attention from your local center. What do you want to know about BK life and the BKWSU?

You're very late join ... the End of the World has already happened according to the god spirit of the BKs; it was suppose to have happened in WWII, 1950, 1976, 1986, 1986-1996 and Year 2000 according to the BK leaders.

Do they still teach/believe that the Golden Age is going to start in 2036?
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Pink Panther

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

ex-l : You forgot to mention 2012 - not an ”official” date but a date no-one was discouraged from believing, especially by those who are (he who is) supposed to know.

Any potential disaster is played upon as inevitable and an incentive for ”effort”subsequently undermining efforts for things like study, career, long-term planning, learning non-BK things, time for anything else....

You can be an insurance salesman without being a BK but you can’t help but think like an insurance salesman when you do BK service.

Arvind - if you are genuine, edit your member info to be an accurate profile, maybe a bit of an intro needed?

BKs are not ‘discouraged" as such, but any statements made form that point of view need substantiation and not just ”because” or ”faith” . General platitudes like ”why not just be nice to each other” may be not specifically BK, but they are banal unless used creatively in context.

(banal: adjective - so lacking in originality as to be obvious and boring)
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arvind.giri

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

I wonder why you said you were exiting then

My bad ... I don't remember the exact reason why I selected exiting in the profile ... May be I did not read it letter by letter and read it quickly as existing ... Will update the same ... sorry for the confusion ... By the way, you may want to change wording of that option :).

Now I understand why I was asked that question (are you leaving ??) again and again :).
If you consider yourself a BK, how pukka a BK are you? Do you go to morning class and practice Amrit Vela meditation every day?

Yes, I go to morning class daily and try to wake up daily at 3:45 AM.
Do they still teach/believe that the Golden Age is going to start in 2036

No, now we don't. We (at least I) believe that this is going to happen and it will happen soon. With the increasing population and limited resources this looks inevitable. I also checked some predictions from various non-BK people/organization like petrol will end up by 2030, next war will be over water etc etc.

In fact, if you will search 'next war will' in Google, first suggestion google shows is "next war will be over water" :). The point is population is increasing at very fast pace and resources are depleting again at very fast pace. To me, end result seems to be disaster.

Arvind
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ex-l

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

You sound a little non-committed about Amrit Vela ... how many are you doing in a week? How many complete weeks have you ever done?

Re: 2036 ...
arvind.giri wrote:No, now we don't.

Really? Who is "we" ... your center, the whole of the BKWSU?

Is the Confluence Age longer than 100 years now? Have they changed that in the Murlis too?

I am sorry to ask these questions but it's helpful for us to get an idea of where you fit in within the BK system. Depending on how long and how deep you are in, you may not have been told or are be being told everything by your local center-in-charge.

Or you may not be being completely honest with us.

For the record, they went from WWII being the End of the World, to a 40 years Confluence Age (1976), to a 100 year Confluence (50 years for Destruction - 1986, 50 years for Creation) ... but, as far as I know, they still teach Krishna is going to be crowned in 2036 for the start of the Golden Age.

If they have removed or changed it ... their credibility and integrity has fallen to ZERO.

And, yes, we used to think all that End of the World stuff back in the 1970s and 1980s ... and every century going back at least 2,000 years to the time of Christ.
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arvind.giri

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

To me exact date doesn't matter, I still believe in the SatYuga to kalyuga cycle. I personally feel that many things have been told to motivate people to move fast, the date prediction being one of them.

Arvind
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Pink Panther

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

ex-l wrote:...do they still teach Krishna is going to be crowned in 2036 for the start of the Golden Age.

And as he is to be 21 years old at the coronation, that means no Avyakt BapDada after 2016.
Arvind - I personally feel that many things have been told to motivate people to move fast, the date prediction being one of them.

Yes, but one would think that a small thing like ”the end of the world” might affect people’s life plans and direction, if it doesn’t come to fruition.

I mean, how long will you put off saving for your retirement, or having a family, or buying a home, or studying to fulfil your potential in your area of talent, and so on?
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ex-l

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Re: BK member for five years

Post17 Jan 2014

arvind.giri wrote:To me exact date doesn't matter ... I personally feel that many things have been told to motivate people to move fast, the date prediction being one of them.

Yes, that is what you have been told to think ... but I am surprise that someone who has only been in the BKWSU a few months knows that. That is the usual excuse they use for the failed predictions (the other is to blame the followers but we have the evidence it was said in Murlis, or "checked" by their god).

But do you honestly believe God uses tricks to teach and encourage ... and does he have no ethical responsibilities for the rubbish he speak?

Why, for example, did he say the population of the world was 4.5 and then 5 billion?

You will believe what you want, arvind, but we can tell you how many got suckered in to think just like you are thinking and throw away their lives, relationships, career, education etc chasing after some crazy Destruction that never happened ... back in the 1940s, 1970s, 1980s etc.

Which will you choose? To put money in the Brahma Kumaris bank account to buy more properties and feed themselves ... or to put money into your own bank account, property and pension account. How will you plan for your old age?

I ask that because the BK exploit the young and inexperienced. They also target the vulnerable and split up families. Many have thrown away the chance to have their own friendships, relationships and families ... and Destruction never came.

I agree that humanity faces environmental challenges but I disagree that putting your gold into the Brahma Kumari bank accounts will magically come back a million fold a future Golden Age. That's got to be joke, surely?
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