Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

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Mann

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post20 Sep 2017

Correction to the above

Since I am UNABLE to wake up at Amrit Vela any more..
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post20 Sep 2017

Find something else to teach and teach it voluntarily, e.g. your language to immigrants, something with children etc, or join an amateur theatre group to act ... then check to see how much the "high" is just a nature high of being need and appreciated, and how much is really a "cosmic" high of the nature the BKs claim.

Pick a fabric dye and throw all clothes in the washing machine with it. Something bright and chearful! Pink or orange. Go crazy with it. (Personally, I am a kind of blue individual but each to their own).

Do something that *really* breaks the Maryadas so you cannot go back ... and then just rough it out cold turkey.

You need to find something else to replace the hole BKism fills. Something down to earth, "of you", that you are in control off and you reap the reward of. Stop giving yourself over to some numinous other.

I remember you saying that love affairs were off the menu, as far as you are concerned. That is a shame. Well, if you cannot fall in love and make love with another human, try working with animals, or rescuing a puppy from a shelter or something. Something that will love you back without any of the "head stuff" involved with BKism.

(I don't know where you live, some cultures have public orphanages and much need and love back in volunteering there).

Be human. There's plenty of good to do.

Or destroy your BK self in style. Drink a bottle of whiskey on the guddhi and fall off it drunk, or something. Come in rolling drunk and be sick. Trust me, it will work and soon they will be locking the door to keep you out!

Have fun with it.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post21 Sep 2017

Fully agree with ex-l.

Dye them pink.

;-)
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post22 Sep 2017

I have a deep desire to "live normally" again ... whatever that means.

Sadly pathetic, ate garlic bread and felt guilty; tried again months later - freedom.

Cannot explain that small gesture, as sad as that may sound, how freeing it felt.
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post22 Sep 2017

Been there, done that, realised how silly it all was. Ate it and did not feel at all different.
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post23 Sep 2017

Stopping AV and have not been struck dead yet. Actually, I felt more connected to both this world and whatever is out there by sitting by the ocean at 4 am; lack of sleep has such a negative effect on health. How does one feel so guilty and "wrong" by not following the Maryadas ... what complete brainwashing happens to pull one into "obedience"?

As I read these cult books by Steven Hassan, it is mind blowing how this happens. I consider myself a quite stable, professional person, hard worker my whole life, with realistic expectations. How the mind, heart, body falls so deeply into this ...? I still cannot fathom at this time.

A BK friend at the center I belong to just called me to find out where I have been, and why ...
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Pink Panther

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post23 Sep 2017

Actually felt more connected to both this world and whatever is out there by sitting by the ocean at 4 am

In Mt Abu, when everyone else sat together in the big hall for 4 am meditation, which saw hundreds of 'yet to bathe' spend 45 minutes - in "solitude" together! - shifting and shuffling in their seats, fart, slump, yawn and be inflicted with horrid sounds they called "meditation music", I would climb up to the roof, find a place away from the artificial lights and sit breathing in mountain high clear air looking at the amazing night sky ...
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post23 Sep 2017

Maui wrote:How the mind, heart, body falls so deeply into this ...? I still cannot fathom at this time.

I think it's a question no one really knows the answer for yet. Firstly, it's pretty widely establish it actually requires a degree of intelligence to be hooked.

But perhaps it's a part of our child-like self (our inner child who has not yet grown up, not yet properly matured) that is hooked?

This is where I sit with it at present. It was an immature part of myself that still craved "family" and mothering, that infantile experience others have written about recently ... of which asexuality is part.

I certainly agree that BKism encourages infantilisation with all its Mother-Father references, dominant female figures with a certain amount of an idealised "unconditional love", the "warm" of many centres and the "sweet" baby talk language. Is much of the experience not unlike returning to one's nursery, or an idealised nursery? (An "ideal" nursery one never actually had with super 'one to one' attention few other adults would give ... at least for a while).

I certainly agree that surrendering to it stunts one's development, reducing otherwise mature intelligence adults to the child-like states that fit in with the motherly indulgences of the Seniors.

It would be interesting to do a psychological profiling of individuals attracted to and susceptible to BKism. And that might require a less than flattering honesty about the self.
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post23 Sep 2017

Yes, Pink Panther ... I, too, at Gyan Sarover would go high on that hill where no one else seemed to go; or at Pandav Bhavan just outside the hall, again, where others were not. I tended to avoid those crowds.

At first, I thought I just don't like crowds ... hahaha ... can you imagine?? Being in Madhuban and not liking crowds?? ... But I chose to be alone and connect to something higher than me. The night /morning sky was beautiful.

Ex-I, I think it would be fascinating to do that profiling ... even if it is not too flattering. You are right, I think ... the need to belong, the nurturing/love of a mother; so deeply desiring what one may never have experienced. I did a workshop on depression and the inner child and saw immense suffering amongst BKs. You are onto something. For those of us leaving, when one finds out this is not true, just a cover, synthetic love and then we start to reach some kind of awareness and self actualization ... it is/can be devastating.

ex-I, I think I should have addressed both you and Pink Panther separately. Please see above note ... very new at this and not sure how to do this right.
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post23 Sep 2017

ex-I.. I think I should have addressed both you and Pink Panther separately...please see above note...very new at this and not sure how to do this right.
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post24 Sep 2017

Maui wrote:I did a workshop on depression and the inner child and saw immense suffering amongst BKs.

Was this a BK workshop, or a non-BK workshop?
For those of us leaving, when one finds out this is not true, just a cover, synthetic love and then we start to reach some kind of awareness and self actualization ... it is/can be devastating.

I think part of the issues that arise after leaving is that during being a BK we allowed parts of our spiritual self to become extremely weak, like muscles wasting through lack of use.

For example, and this is just a quick sketch done without much thought, self-determination/will, decision making, critical thinking, standing up for one's rights.

The emphasis within BKism is placed upon submission, conforming and accepting ... which turns you into an extremely weak person in a hard world. Within BKism, you are rewarded for fitting in, not causing 'change' (nevermind trouble), not asking questions, not looking too closely.

Despite what they say, it does not prepare you for real life at all because real life ... surviving ... does not reward the BKs' primary values. I would say it turns you into a passive, uncomplaining victim ... and re-learning or re-developing real life skills is hard and difficult, especially when you have no support or guidance, they are not written down and codified, and they are almost opposite to what you were led to believe is "good" within BKism.

To be good within BKism, number you have to be good at being exploited, willing to be exploited, willing even to be duped, not question, accept non-answers and exploited.

That's a self-destructive 'life strategy' in the real world. I am not surprise some ex-BK have killed themselves because they cannot or do not know how to fit it.

I remember feeling like alien, an alien behind a thick glass wall, looking at what felt to be an entirely separate world of which I was not part. There's also a severe unhealthiness, a severely unhuman state of disconnectedness from others that they encourage/d. Never in our history of DNA did we experience such disconnectedness from others - or at least only in the states of the most severe circumstance did we experience it, e.g. after wars/pestilences/crises etc.

It is something else to look at ... like being a networked computer ripped out from all its network wiring and expecting to operate properly on its own. It cannot because its knowledgebase and operational abilities are shared ones. It requires being in a network to work. BKism demands control of all of the network and defines any other network apart from its own as evil/negative/bad/dangerous/not to be trusted.
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post24 Sep 2017

This particular one was for BK's only, however, I've done very many workshops and retreats for both BKs and non-BKs throughout the States.

You've hit another nerve here, ex-I, I remember a few years ago, due to personal issues, I was needed elsewhere and wasn't around any BKs. I felt alone in a world and needing to get back ... it WAS like an alien behind a glass wall ... vey well put. It was quite startling.

Getting back, this stayed up front and center with me as I fell deeply back into, well, all of it again. I am strong in this difficult world, but I felt like I was suddenly missing something ... something life-sustaining to me and couldn't define it. Although I always worked outside of BK, and therefore hugely contributed and they encouraged that, I saw myself now as weak, submissive (SO UNLIKE ME) and conforming to standards I disagreed with but prior to this just complacently accepted.

I even accepted, I am now embarrassed to say, the abuse of a senior. NEVER AGAIN.
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post24 Sep 2017

Maui wrote:I even accepted, I am now embarrassed to say, the abuse of a senior. NEVER AGAIN.

I would say pretty much all of us all did. They turned us around so much we would accept it with a kind of pride at how good we were at "tolerating" or "accommodating".

ANd the other corker, if anything was going sour, it was not that something was right or wrong, or inept or abusive, it was because of magical "bad karma" between us in the past.

We *deserved* the bad, like being sinful in Catholocism, and only "more Yoga" could fix it.

For "more Yoga" you might just replace it was "waiting" for all the effect it had.
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Maui

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post26 Sep 2017

I have connected with a Brother recently who is in Gyan for 24 yrs. We met in Madhuban and visited while in the States.

He knows how much I have gone against the mainstream and caused some issues, although he told me that it appears if "they ignore it, it (you) goes away; if you give it any credence, it grows".

He has sat on the sidelines for a few years deciding if he should leave and always being pulled back. He is an IT specialist and much sought after in the Yagya. He has come into some difficult times, "bad luck", and was told it's his karma, he must have done something like this in the past and needs to be settled. What he's going through is huge and he had reached out for help; not this.

I grew up Catholic and left a long time ago, but I remember always about reconciliation, repentance and redemption. There seems to be none here for him, this has been the final straw and he is leaving BK for good. I have referred him to this site; he is extremely angry but determined to leave over this.

I did not have any of that anger, although as I continue to read this site, more and more awareness is happening for me. I see so many things I have ignored and put up with ... for "God" ... to now be dehumanizing and painful ... I am starting to feel angry and do not' know how to deal with this as yet.
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ex-l

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Re: Experiences of those surrendered, living at the center?

Post26 Sep 2017

I think the "it's your karma" line is very hurtful and damaging.

Actually, in some circumstances, especially combined with the 5,000 year identically repeating cycle of time, I think it is horrendous. And criticism of the idea are not new, they go back as long as traditional brahmanism, and Buddhism, has existed (defining "brahmanism" as the ideology by which as the traditional Hindu caste was sustained). For example, Poorana Kashyapa, a contemporary of the Buddha.

Imagine a rape victim told it was her own fault AND she has to go through it all every 5,000 years.

Listen, NO ONE in the BKWSU has the mystic powers to know the past and even their god spirit has been demonstrated NOT to be able to predict the future.

It's all just about control and keeping up the superiority/appearance of mysticism.
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