Stand back for a moment

This is obviously a load of dangerous bull. Devote your whole life to this drivel. What a very BAD joke.

I agree it can be quite dangerous, when "Gyan" is used in the wrong way. Though what exactly is Gyan is under discussion.

For some, maybe the BK life is the only life they can have and afford, so it cannot be a joke to them. There are some good parts in BK life so the way is to find what is really right for oneself and move on. There are some BKs who do sincere and honest work and try hard to improve themselves. There is nothing wrong with that, even if part of it is living in a fairy tale. No one can prove anything, even our own existence. Faith is like that.

The only thing this forum is trying to do is uncover some of the things that seem to be generally hidden, but it is for each forum member, and any folks from close or far afield, to make their own judgement as to how much the BK and the Gyan helps them in their life or not. And how much of a fairy tale life they wish to have.

Some people can think this forum is criticism, but others will see this as an opportunity to expand and open themselves. I don't think the BKWSU set out to be an organisation with bad intentions. It may have helped many who have benefited even in a small way, and I am sure it is with this belief that many people join the BKWSU. I still feel many people believe this to be the case, whether they are still BKs or left, but it has gotten out of hand and not kept up to date. Its become larger and varied so attention to detail has been compromised. There is still time. There always is.

When someone gains, then someone else somewhere has lost. The key is how to make everyone gain.

Stand back, right back, is probably what you and anyone engaged in the BKWSU needs to do.

It is fine to talk about self-development, but if you wake up to discover that are doing "self-development" on a Titanic guided by a captain that think they do not need lifeboats or worry about icebergs ... it puts you in a rather different position than doing it on dry land. Ultimately the context and overall guidance matters.

You might see this forum polarized into "pros" in denial and "antis" with an axe to grind but how many come forward to recount how easily they took whatever they gained in Gyan and transformed or applied it outside of Gyan. I am not sure that whatever we get inside does and I cannot trust or recommend a leadership that is not open, honest and feels accountable for their actions.

God Shiva tells them they are not ... that is a little dangerous.

OK, so let's make a list of the benefits from once being a BK ... or the other way around, what did you gain from your experience??? Peace??? A place in a lokik world??? (Honestly, not using BK marketing as they do now. In my time, it was SO AGAINST Shrimat to mix money and BK life!!!) ... What else??? Anyone left Gyan feeling extremely self-confident to face the world??? Were you treated with love and respect with your ideas??? And the list goes on and on ... .

What would the answer be from the little abused Indian girl from the rural village who the BKs offered a free and cheap way to get some self-esteem, and who by the way does not have any internet access?

I have a vague idea of the general answers from the forum, but there are is a wider audience than just those who can afford an online service but who cannot speak out.

So "stand back" from outside one of those slums, even better still, go into one of those slums. You don't even have to go so far, just look down your own street and around the station. Metaphorically speaking.

Its a difficult call Bansy because, sadly, I do not believe that what the BKs offer is without strings attached. If you were dying of thirsty, would you care if it was the devil himself that offered you water? She would be thrilled to see someone new, a book, a pencil.

As much as I can understand her taking any avenue out of the route of an unhappy arranged marriage her parents have lined up for her, and as powerful and attractive as the Sisters in white might appear; I would not want to surrender her into that set up without all of what we are proposing and discussion being made available. Exit strategy, accountability and protection, truth, some sort of resolution with science and the practical world, etc.

I see it on a par with the Christian missionaries in Africa, did they bring all good? Were they only interfering for their own sake's? As part of the standing back process, how many people think that the service programmes are entirely altruistic and how many people think that they are just sugar-coatings and baited-traps? And let's remember, our little girl is not going to be able to surrender unless her family can afford to pay her keep, and dowry, over to the BKs.

I am sort of view BK as a huge citadel now. A walled city surrounded by desert. Sure, of course, as you approach it from the wilderness it has advantages and as you enter within the walls one finds security, comfort, may be a place for the self. May be it is only if you penetrate the court at the very heart of it that you come across all the politics and they only pertain within those circles. Just as the Christian monastries obviously brought benefit to civilisation even if Roman was a hotbed of internecine strife.

There are some research papers from India that review the values programme very well and I understand it is to some degree separated from the orthodox "Knowledge" and principles side.

The little abused girl who joins is just walking into a cleaner prison, she still has no future.

Regular food maybe.