How to remember ShivBaba

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anamik

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How to remember ShivBaba

Post14 Jan 2007

Dear Sweet Souls,
To remember ShivBaba we need correct knowledge. ShivBaba has said, "Apne ko Aatma samajh Bap ko Yaad karo". Meaning, understanding yourselves as Soul remember The Godfather. It means, as a first step, I have to understand that I am soul. Next, with that understanding I, the soul, should remember The Godfather.

First step: To understand that I am not this body, but an immortal soul, ShivBaba has said to concentrate our mind in a minutest point of light situated in the forehead between the two eyebrows. Feel yourself as that minutest point of light. We have to practice this all the times as much as possible whenever we are awake i.e., while walking, talking, eating, etc., Also we have to think others as a minutest point of light, a soul like ourselves acting through their body.

Next step: In the first step we are feeling ourselves as soul, not as body. Now as a soul we are to remember ShivBaba, The Godfather.

Until now The Godfather has not revealed Himself through the final Mukarrar (destined) Rath (body). Please remember that ShivBaba has not come to this world to fool us. Whenever He wants to reveal His final Mukarrar (destined) Rath (body), He will do it directly and publicly. ShivBaba has said in Sakar Murlis that He does not inspire or instigate or murmur in somebody's ears. Maya -Ravan does these kinds of things, not The Godfather ShivBaba. So please, do not believe anyone who cannot take the responsibility of being a Mukarrar Rath (destined body) or those who do not directly accept that ShivBaba uses their body as Mukarrar Rath.

Some people try to fool others by indirectly talking about themselves and indirectly portraying themselves as ShivBaba. But will never directly say or accept that ShivBaba does service of the children through them. Please beware about such people. The excuse they give for this is as follows: They say that in Murlis ShivBaba has called those people who accept themselves as ShivBaba's Rath by the name 'Hiranyakashyap' (an asura like Ravan). But this reasoning is totally wrong. Nowhere in the Murli has ShivBaba said so. ShivBaba has called Hiranyaksahyap as those people who call themselves as Shiv. Not those who accept themselves as Rath of ShivBaba. On the other hand, I have read in Murli that ShivBaba does service even through children, but few humbly accept that it was not themselves but ShivBaba who did service. Whereas there are those who portray themselves in front in pride.

So dear souls Dada Lekhraj, who humbly accepted himself as Rath of ShivBaba, was not Hiranyakashyap. But those people are Hiranyakashyaps who do not have confidence in themselves as being Rath of ShivBaba, but indirectly portray themselves as ShivBaba. So beware of such people.

So finally, it is not possible till now to remember ShivBaba in His fianl Mukarrar Rath(Destined Body) because it is still not revealed and declared. It is just enough to remember Him as Supreme and Benevolent of All, with Love in our Heart for Him. Our Love reaches Him.

Please spread this meassage.

Yours,
Anamik.
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Mr Green

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Post14 Jan 2007

No problem.
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john

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Post24 Jan 2007

Revised Sakar Murli 30/03/04
"Om Shanti. The Father sits here and explains to you souls. He remembers the soul and also the body. The soul without a body cannot be remembered" ...

... "You ask: How can we remember Baba? Should we remember ShivaBaba in the body of Brahma or in the supreme abode? Many have this question. Baba says: It is the soul that you have to remember. However, you would also definitely remember the body."

So there it is in Black and white, ShivaBaba should be remembered through the body. Anyone with any Murli points that contradict this?
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amaranthine

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Post25 Jan 2007

Excellent find john. You obviously have access to some Murlis and have used that information in a very positive way - to help readers with their meditation. If this continues to happen here, a sufficient evidence base will be built up that supports the 'liberation' of the Sakar Murlis.
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abrajuder

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Post16 Feb 2007

In my experience, remembering ShivBaba as a point of light has given pretty different results than remembering him as Dada Lekraj. I feel Dada Lekraj as an individual soul and I feel anyone could remember ShivBaba directly after accepting/learning/remembering his body.

I believe ShivBaba fits in our mind, initialy as we choose to remember him, and the longer we enjoy his presence, the richer the experience will be, because he will show himself at the same pace we are ready to enjoy and accept him.

Om Shanti

Abrajuder
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arjun

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Post16 Feb 2007

Dear abrajuder,

Omshanti and welcome to the forum. Hope to read more of your posts.

Regards,
On Godly service,
Arjun
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bansy

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Post16 Feb 2007

abrajuder wrote: believe ShivBaba fits in our mind, initialy as we choose to remember him

Dear abrajuder,
Om Shanti. Welcome to the forum. Could you elaborate on how we initially choose to remember ShivBaba ?
Regards
Bansy
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abrahma kumar

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Post16 Feb 2007

remembering ShivBaba as a point of light has given pretty different results than remembering him as Dada Lekraj.

As a Godly student with the BKWSU I do not
recognise the concept of remembering ShivaBaba as Dada Lekhraj neither do I practice this. Yes I have heard it explained in the Murli that the body of Dada Lekhraj is the Chariot for Shiv Baba but I never translated that into "remember Shiva as Dada Lekhraj". I do not think that i was ever taught to do that. Am I missing something or is it just a languge thing?

Is there any benefit in remembering ShivaBaba as a Dada Lekraj?

Thank you.
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ex-l

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Post16 Feb 2007

John wrote:Revised Sakar Murli 30/03/04
"Om Shanti. The Father sits here and explains to you souls. He remembers the soul and also the body. The soul without a body cannot be remembered" ...

... "You ask: How can we remember Baba? Should we remember ShivaBaba in the body of Brahma or in the supreme abode? Many have this question. Baba says: It is the soul that you have to remember. However, you would also definitely remember the body."

So there it is in Black and white, ShivaBaba should be remembered through the body.

Hardly ... it says "would" not "should".

As in, e.g. " ... you 'should' remember the seed-like soul but you 'would' remember the body because you are human and body-conscious." But who can tell as it is badly written English, 'like wot God speaks, init?' and perhaps loosely translated in the first place. And, just as easily, it could support the PBKs position of how can God therefore be remembered if there is no bodily medium? No mention of the virtue of remembering deceased or Avyakt mediums.

I do agree though that it underlines again the need for the Murlis in their original, translated and revised forms to be made public so that others can study and examine such issues and changes as the currently translators/revision team/distributors cannot be trusted.
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abrahma kumar

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Post16 Feb 2007

It is the soul that you have to remember. However, you would also definitely remember the body."

Boy, what a minefield. Would it be stretching things too far to say that the the first sentence is God's Shrimat and the second part depicts the Father acknowledging the we children will nonetheless get focussed on rememberance of the Chariot through which the Murli is spoken? In which case it is an order followed by an acknowledgement of our numberwise status (but not condoning/promoting the fall from the highest practice) So all in all could be an acknowledgement by God that we children do allow thenselves to be distracted from 'real remembrance' by remembering the body, however Shrimat is
It is the soul that you have to remember.

Apologies if that doesn't make sense or soulds like BKWSU apologetics ;) but yes the original transaltion MIGHT de-mistify things ;) and then again ...
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john

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Post16 Feb 2007

A good portion of the Sakar Murli 30/03/04 is dedicated to the description of rememberance through the body. I shall quote the first part and anyone wishing to discuss, interprete it can do.

Revised Sakar Murli dated 30/03/04 published by BKs

Om Shanti. The Father sits here and explains to you souls. He remembers the soul and also the body. The soul without a body cannot be remembered. It is understood that this soul is good, this soul is extrovert, this soul wants to tour around the world, and has forgotten that world. First, the name and form of the soul comes in front of you. The soul of So-and-so is remembered. The soul of So-and-so does good service. First, the body would be remembered because the body is big. Then, the soul, which is subtle and extremely tiny would be remembered. The big body cannot be praised. It is only the soul that is praised. This one’s soul does good service. The soul of So-and-so is better than that one. The body is remembered first of all. The Father has to remember many souls. He doesn’t remember the name of the body, but just the form comes in front of Him. By saying, “the soul of So-and-so”, the body is definitely remembered. For instance, you understand that Shiv Baba enters the body of this Dada. You know that Baba enters his body. The body would definitely be remembered.

You ask: How can we remember Baba? Should we remember Shiv Baba in the body of Brahma or in the supreme abode? Many have this question. Baba says: It is the soul that you have to remember. However, you would definitely also remember the body. First is the body and then the soul. Baba is sitting in this one’s body, and so you would definitely remember the body. The soul with such-and-such a body has this virtue. Baba also continues to see who remembers Him, who has many virtues and which flowers have fragrance. Everyone loves flowers. When they make bouquets, they use king-flowers, queen-flowers, leaves etc. The Father’s vision would go towards the flowers. He would say: The soul of So-and-so is very good. He does a lot of service. He remains soul conscious and remembers the Father. He runs wherever he sees service. Even then, when you wake up early in the morning and sit in remembrance, whom would you be remembering? Would you be remembering Shiv Baba in the supreme abode or in Madhuban? You would be remembering Baba, would you not?

Shiv Baba is in this one because the Father has now come down. He has come down to speak the Murli. He doesn’t have anything to do in His own home. What would he do when He goes there? He only enters this body, and so definitely the body would be remembered first and then the soul. The soul that is in such-and-such a body is a very special and good child. He doesn’t think of anything except service. That soul is very sweet. Baba simply sits here and continues to watch everyone. Such-and-such a child is very good. She remembers Baba a lot. The daughters who are in bondage are beaten so much because of vice. They must be remembering Baba with so much love. When they remember Baba a lot, then because of that happiness, they even have tears of love, and sometimes, those tears even fall.

What other business does Baba have? He just remembers everyone. He remembers many daughters. The soul of So-and-so has no power. He doesn’t remember the Father. He doesn’t give happiness to anyone. That soul is not even benefiting the self. The Father would continue to watch this. To remember that soul means to give him sakes. The connection of the soul remains with God. A day will come when children will stay in Yoga a great deal. When this one remembers someone, that one will instantly have a vision. The soul is just a tiny point. Even if someone were to have a vision, they would not be able to understand and so they would even then just remember the body. The soul is tiny, but when it remembers Baba, it continues to become pure.

There are a variety of flowers in the garden. Baba also sees that this one is a very good fragrant flower, and this one isn’t like that as much. So, the status would also be low. Those who become Baba’s helpers claim a high status. And that too, those who continue to remember the Father. They are transferred from being Brahmins into deities. All of this is spoken about only at the Confluence Age, as to whether someone is a deity flower or a devilish flower. All are flowers, but there is a lot of variety. Baba also continues to remember children. A teacher would remember his students. This one is not studying so much. He would understand this in his heart. This One is the Father and also the Teacher. He is the Father anyway. He then plays the role of being a Teacher much longer. A teacher has to teach every day.

You claim that status with the power of this study. In the morning all of you Brothers sit in remembrance of the Father. That is the subject of remembrance. Then the Murli conducted and that is a subject of the study. The main thing is Yoga and the study. It is also called Gyan and vigyan. This is the Gyan-Vigyan Bhawan where the Father comes and teaches you. You receive The Knowledge of the whole world through Gyan. Vigyan means you stay in Yoga through which you become pure.
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abrahma kumar

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Post16 Feb 2007

Cheers John, I will read and see how my original offering shapes up. I can guess that God's will be right though. ;)

Thanks
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abrajuder

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Post16 Feb 2007

Could you elaborate on how we initially choose to remember ShivBaba?

Om Shanti Bansy,

It is my belief that according to your specific reality you have a "form" you accept for ShivBaba. For instance, I accepted ShivBaba as a point of light. And during my meditations I visualize this point of light and I start feeling all I can of it. How it felt? how it was? Then this "static image of a point of light" starts to give me "something more".

But the starting point was believing ShivBaba could fit in this image ... I think He does the rest ... What if at this point you still do not feel the point of light is OK? Then I think you have to find how you actually accept ShivBaba to be ... Could it be Christ? Budda? How you accept it to be?

This for me is our initial decision about how each one of us has accepted to remember ShivBaba. I think that He is able to fit in the initial image we choose and show us what we have to learn from it. Then we start to learn even new aspects about our own religion. Aspects that are contained in the symbols we have learnt so far.

Om Shanti

Abrajuder.
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bansy

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Post16 Feb 2007

Thanks for the reply abrajuder. I do like the image of a point of light.

The next question is where is ShivBaba, because it is one of connection to the Supreme Soul. This is one of the major topics under discussion, and often pops up in various threads in other subforums. How do you remember ShivBaba during meditation, is He in Paramdham, is He sitting in front, is He beside you, is He within a lucky Chariot, etc? (this query is not just directed to you, but to forum members in general).
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truth

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For tips to Remember - Why we should not refer Avyakt Vani

Post02 Mar 2007

During Avyakt Vani (live), BapDada himself gives commentary or points to do drill.

So we can follow that because that is 100% truth.

Latest and Live with proof.

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