All other classes except the Murli/Vanis themselves

It is noticeable that the BKWSU has posts on various websites and forums various classes from Dadis and Senior Brothers and Sisters, but are not willing to post a morning Murli/Vani class.

So it seems that the classes from the children are of more importance than that of the Father's. And children who do not have access to Murlis/Vanis have to contend with classes from the other children, rather than from the Father.

Well, we could say that only one can go to listen to a class in the centre, a quiet peaceful and virtuous environment, but if you can connect to God at the centre, on a rock, at work, whilst walking, well you can also connect to God at home.

So can anyone explain why are classes from Dadis and Seniors seem to be given higher priority than Father's classes, i.e. Sakar or Avyakt Murlis ?

So can anyone explain why are classes from Dadis and Seniors seem to be given higher priority than Father's classes, i.e. Sakar or Avyakt Murlis ?

Sometimes Murlis or BKs say that 'the children have to reveal the Father'. In other words, Sakar and Avyakt Babas speak in language intended for his immediate followers, and that they, the followers are responsible for digesting and repackaging that spiritual knowledge for the rest of the world. The BKs and their God being revealed and glorified in front of the entire world is a major theme of Murlis, and the ultimate goal of their service/proselytizing activities.

As you have been close to the BKs, I wouldn't think you'd find it strange that they maintain control over the Murlis, and with that the ability to modify them as needed to serve the interests of the BK family.

Sometimes Murlis or BKs say that 'the children have to reveal the Father'.

So here is the conundrum: In the latest Avayakt BapDada 17/03/07, at the beginning of his speak, the Father says "The enthusiasm of all the children is very good. However, you will only be able to reveal the Father when you all first reveal yourselves as complete and perfect, the same as the Father".

Thus the BKs have to show that they are perfect and complete first. However, who can you ask to confirm that you are perfect and complete if the Father is not yet revealed before you are? And in the Murlis we often are told that no-one is yet complete?

Thus the BKs have to show that they are perfect and complete first. However, who can you ask to confirm that you are perfect and complete if the Father is not yet revealed before you are? And in the Murlis we often are told that no-one is yet complete?

Well, the presumption is you're doing service. Why is not service more successful? Because the world is not all ready for the BK's brand of spirituality? No, because one is not complete. So you need to put some petrol into the Yoga tank. Turn down the service and turn up the furnace.

Obviously Baba has been asking the children to do service anyway to find Original Brahmin Family Members since whenever it was that service began in the 1950's.

What advice would you have Baba give the children?

Agreed on your points about service.

The Murlis are a spiral way of ensuring that those who come into reading the Murli, whether from day 1 or day 1000, are given the same instructions. The target is never ending since only until all the children are complete and perfect will the Father be revealed, whereas it is written that we are all numberwise. So how will the children all be complete and perfect? Thus service will go on.

The issue of whether there is completeness and perfection within this current body, or at leaving the body to join the BK's "Advance Party", is one which PBKs also concern about.

The benefits, however, are that the majority of those who do come into the family and come, stay or leave, would have made some sort of worthwhile efforts as according to their role.

The complete form is already there. It is what we are, naturally.

The first step is to get a glimpse. We may run away at this, then come back later and slowly, poke our heads round the corner for a quick peak just to make sure that what we saw is indeed the case. The more we look, the stronger it becomes, in theory. There can be the feeling that we would be best to keep this "self" on the back burner as it just will not fit in here in this mad world (in other words, they will tear me to shreds for not being action man).
The Father is saying that we need to emerge the complete form in order to reveal the Father.
Courage is therefore needed.

I will be honest and say that, I have carried a degree of fear, feeling that, if I step into that more, "complete" self, everyone will notice somehow. It will stand out. Maybe, and maybe not. I am not that keen on being seen as some weird freak. One is only ever being pushed out, simply for being different.

We may continue to "search" beyond glimpsing the "complete" form, no doubt to avoid facing the true self head on. Souls of the world in general struggle to understand basic things, how on earth are they going to understand this one? They don't need to. They only need the simple experience of "self".

There are times when we must think of our "selves" first, if we want to have something to give to others in the first place.

The reason the Murlis are so closely controlled Bansy is not anything spiritual at all. This is a fact.

I was instructed clearly by my Seniors as to the way to handle people's requests for Murlis, and was told the two reasons why they are controlled.

1. The BKs do not want at any cost the Murlis to be discovered by the media (i.e. newspapers and tv) because of the sensitive material contained within that could easily discredit them as a charitable organisation ... which they clearly are not. In fact, anyone who's been on the inside knows that they are effectively laughing at the tax man.

2. The BKs want numbers. Regular attenders to morning class are the numbers they gauge as pukka BKs, or the 900 000. So to get people to come, rather than read the Murlis in the comfort of their own homes, they control them and manipulate the dates so you have to go to the centre to get the latest. (Bear in mind it is a requirement of attending the aircraft hanger in India to bathe in Gyan every day).

Also within this they believe that individuals who want to read them at home have got Maya and should want to be with the family. They fear that you will misinterpret Gyan, as you are not an instrument, also that you might start your own little group and not need Dadi looking at you.

not anything spiritual at all.

Most of those who leave the BKWSU, and there are probably millions do so (I guess), because there is no link with God. I mean experience, real solid relationship other than blind faith. The Murlis are the closest many of us get to the words of God due to our current environments, but having two souls entering a Chariot is almost unperceivable, who is talking then. Maybe it is the soul of Dadi Gulzar that is shutting up BB (Lekhraj Kirpalani) and Father Shiva. Of course, the BKWSU will say it is Father Shiva doing the talking, in which case what is the point of having BB (Lekhraj Kirpalani) then ? Is it lonely for him in the Subtle Region ?
The PBKs have a different answer.

Thus in essence, it is up to anyone's blind guess who is speaking Murlis.

In fact, I would say anyone who says that they are the Chariot of God has a one step closer reality to being true, I do not even know if the Gita ever says that two souls enter one Chariot at the same time and I would not bother to study it because it sounds absurd. With this blind faith in God, the BKWSU is destined to be shown as fake, and it is a pity that there are those who, geniune and making hard efforts, are simply exploited for their innocence and honesty.

Maybe I am talking about myself too, ansd thus I am here in this forum to put my experience across as I believe that is what truth is, and many millions have also realised the same truth rather than the 800,000 or so current BKs still blindly following a controlled hierachy who would immedately say that those who leave have fallen into Maya whereas they would not consider it is those who are still in the BKWSU that are trapped in Maya.

I am not mad at BKs. I was there too, so I understand how it is for a BK not to understand. I could even accept what folks in the PBK family, or in the Vishnu Party camp etc, say because it could be possible for God to be in any Chariot He choses, but it is totally farcical for two souls to enter a Chariot, it makes Father Shiva look silly to take Brahma Baba (Lekhraj Kirpalani) with him and play tricks inside Dadi Gulzar. And is not it odd that Father Shiva and BB (Lekhraj Kirpalani) have to make sure they go to the meetings on time at specific times of the year?

They must make sure they synchronise their watches exactly. I mean you cannot keep 20,000 thirsty souls waiting if the trip down is delayed say by a magnetic sunstorm. All the equipment in Shantivan will blackout. Apparently I read somewhere that there had been backouts during BapDada meetings.

But of course this is all "drama" right .

Bansy, I like your points about 2 souls. I agree it is farcical. I've never thought about it really ... why would Brahma have to be there at all ...

It is noticeable that the BKWSU has posts on various websites and forums various classes from Dadis and Senior Brothers and Sisters, but are not willing to post a morning Murli/Vani class.

So it seems that the classes from the children are of more importance than that of the Father's. And children who do not have access to Murlis/Vanis have to contend with classes from the other children, rather than from the Father.

Well, we could say that only one can go to listen to a class in the centre, a quiet peaceful and virtuous environment, but if you can connect to God at the centre, on a rock, at work, whilst walking, well you can also connect to God at home.

So can anyone explain why are classes from Dadis and Seniors seem to be given higher priority than Father's classes, i.e. Sakar or Avyakt Murlis ?

Hi bansy, just noticed on of Dadi Janki's classes being distributed in the following opening format:

Dadi Janki – 12 May 2007 – GCH London
Be so clean inside that there is nothing but light

Song: Having found you, we have found the whole world - not just the earth but also the sky.
There is so much intoxication - we are going beyond the sky. Once Baba said just try to see how much distance there is between the sky and the earth. And, even further than that there is the incorporeal world. The Subtle Region and the incorporeal world are closer together. The sky is so big because ...

Do you recognise the style? Will we soon have the essence added on top of the Song?; and then a couple of questions and answers after the essence? So that as if by magic we will attend Dadi Janki Morning Murli class?

Excuse my forthrightness but if at some future time Dadi's class will become known as Murlis (as has been done with Mama's classes) then I want it to be known that I oppose the idea - and i am sure that there are many who feel the same (for differing reasons of course). So to her minnions and foot washers please think again. It is not a clever thing to send these Dadi's classes all over the world dressed up as Murlis.

OS

Do you recognise the style? Will we soon have the essence added on top of the Song. And then a couple of quistions and answers? Say whallah! A Dadi Jabki Murli.

I do not think "evolves" is quite the right word ... and is that Robin Gibbs bhajan because I don't recognize it from anywhere else???

All they have to do is start printing them on toilet paper and they might finally become worth something.

I am speechless ... this from the folks that say they do not have any of the original Murlis because they used to use them for wrapping up toli!