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Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 01 Sep 2016
by Pink Panther
And of course for women, as we have discussed elsewhere, there is the seduction of the ”dream lover” - the ideal lover (Krisna) or Father (Baba) - who you can ”be with” whenever you want and ”leaves you alone" alone when you choose otherwise, unlike actual relationships which place demands on you at times other than your choosing.

This manipulation of "sanskaras" (thought formations/formulators, sometimes known as ‘archetypes’) also includes the associated resonances with things like loyalty, group identity, guilt, ambition, ego-assertion (I exist, I am special, I am worthwhile, I am immortal!).

Interestingly, people all around us do it (play on our tendencies) in other ways - parents, family, work colleagues, friends, romantic partners and spouses.

Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 20 Sep 2016
by harishpatarla

I watched episode related to this in "Happiness Unlimited" and it is, of course, enlightening. I had a question though. Can the soul be born as well?

We talk about a soul leaving a body and taking up another, but can a soul born. If not how do you explain the increase in human population?

Om Shanti.

Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 21 Sep 2016
by Pink Panther

First, one must ask a question about what is meant by ”soul”. ‘Soul’ is, after all, a jargon word used as a shorthand explanation for things intangible.

It is difficult when you grow up in a culture where everyone accepts certain beliefs, like atman or karma, as being obvious & true just because of tradition, to be able to question those beliefs. Just as in the past people accepted the world was flat or the sky was a dome above our heads. We receive concepts that seem to make sense and without hard reasons to the contrary we accept them and live by them, in agreement with everyone. It is the agreement that makes it true.

"Soul" is a word like "god" or "spirit” that will mean different things to different people especially if they come from different traditions. I assume you are referring to the Vedic/Vedantic idea of atman? It must be looked at critically, to see what it is founded on.

We also often lack the training or intellectual rigour to see that what we accept as an obvious truth is accepted without questioning too closely by us because it acts as a link to a whole other set of beliefs that we have, and we instinctively know that to deconstruct it is to put ourselves outside what is accepted and acceptable.

Not only do we want to belong to and be accepted by our community and peers, we also want to stay acceptable to ourselves, to the ego's need for continuity of identity and re-affirmation of our past beliefs and actions (only the most humble admit they were wrong easily).

We have a whole set of beliefs where each part depends on the other to create cohesion, and to remove any lynchpin might mean ”the centre cannot hold” (as the poet Yeats so eloquently described the process) - it may mean the end of a world, i.e. our world view, becomes inevitable. Who I think I am and have been until now, something which each of us has invested years of psychological effort into, could be called into question.

Everyone romanticises the ”spiritual warrior” or ”the seeker” or ”the journey” but few undertake it in a way that is any challenge at all, few travel far from where they set out, usually only exchanging one set of clothes for another which is not too dissimilar. Most commonly this is done through accepting what confirms for us what we already believe and ignoring those aspects which challenge us.

”I” want to live forever. ”I” am special, unique. ”I” feel things which I believe are profound. ”I” cannot resolve my feelings with any ”logic”. Like Yeats’s great poem, like the great myths. art gives us a "logic” - a way that articulates our feelings, desires & sensations and inspires identity. Religion is like art. To take it as fact, or science, is a big mis-take.

That is, my advice to you is, treat the word ‘soul' as a poetic metaphor, and you will feel peace as you encounter the many versions others will insist are ’The Truth". You'll not become trapped in a belief system that demands all kinds of unprovables to be accepted (which must affect us psychologically. If we believe without knowing, but say, "Oh I don’t believe, I know” we fool no-one more than ourselves).

Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 21 Sep 2016
by ex-l
harishpatarla wrote:Can the soul be born as well?

Hi Harish,

I suppose you mean that like, "can a soul be created?".

As in 'from nothing', or from out of the womb of a great cosmic soul mother !?!

There are many creation myths but they are all unprovable. I think Pink has given you a nice answer but, to that, I'd add that the thing to do is not believe in any of the myths but understand how they are used by gurus or group leaders to create their tribes ... tribes which will follow and support them materially.

At best, it might just be an author selling books to curious minds; at worst it might be a cult like the Brahma Kumaris exploiting 100,000s of people for their money, property and free labour.

Each tribe has its own creation myth (most of which contradict other tribes' creation myths). The purpose of them is not to know the truth ... because it is really an unknowable, unprovable truth ... but to create in group identity. To bring together and solidify a group of individuals, to create a shared mental frame work ... so that they can be led, and often - but not always - exploited.

Even driven into Imperial wars and conflict with other tribes, as we see in the world today.

On the basis of his experience, Pink advises you to accept it as a "poetic metaphor". I agree with and like that.

On the basis of my experience, and I was once too curious too and it led me to be exploited by the Brahma Kumaris, I would say 'accept that somethings in life are just unknowable and unprovable' ... and don't concern yourself too much with them.

Give your attention to the 'here and now'. To what is knowable, and provable, and replicatable ... creative, beneficial, inspirational ... whatever your interest or gifts are. If you need to know one day, the gods will open your eyes to the truth. If you eyes are not open to it at present, then accept you don't need it and concentrate on working within what see at present.

Unfortunately, it is my experience that these kind of ideas are just "bubble gum for the mind". That is to say, like bubble gum, they may occupy your mind "chewing up and down on them" ... but, ultimately, they are not nourishing and practical. They are empty. They are futile arguments between different gurus, cults and religions who will never budge or agree with each other. They are just tools of domination and control ("I think for you, you follow me"), not helpful and liberating.

The Brahma Kumaris will give you their answer (they do have one) ... make you addicted to them and their answers ... tie you up in their knot ... and then take your time, money, property and energy.

Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 21 Sep 2016
by ex-l
BTW, what is your interest in the Brahma Kumaris?

Re: Reincarnation & ‘sanskaras' or genetic memory?

PostPosted: 14 Aug 2018
by Pink Panther
Another study showing how memories can be carried across generations through RNA, and in this case, even transferred between different co-existing animals.

Of course, this is not ”conclusive” - not many things are. One of the wonderful things about science is that it is always ready to be tested further. Progress is measured by proving itself wrong!

Whether reincarnation, the collective unconscious or shamanic ”corporate” memory (!), the akashic record, whatever - I think that in 50-100 years we are going to be playing in a totally different ball park in our understanding.

Genetics and epigenetics have really only hit their stride in the last two decades. Through these and other related sciences,we are only at the start of discovering explanations for at least some of the previously inexplicable phenomena to do with memory that have had many theories proposed.

This is the third experiment in this same area that I know of. The video in the link mentions the latest one and a previous one, rats in the maze. The third one is the opening post of this topic - where rats were taught to dislike and avoid cherries across the generations. ... wMDMwMDE4/