Some comments and advice

for ex-BKs, exiting BKs, Friends & Family of BKs and newcomers to the forum.
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kamaferro

spiritual seeker

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Some comments and advice

Post11 Aug 2009

I have attended few times talks looking good, all FOC. Reading your website leaves me full of doubts, it looks like a cult, believing in spirits and so on. Could anyone who was or is an active member explain the real truth? Honestly, I don't want to follow something like this if really true. I am a searching soul for the right spiritual path so we have to be careful. Thanks for help

Ferro
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Mr Green

ex-BK

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post11 Aug 2009

Everything you need to know about them is on this site, start with the history.

They are a cult, steer clear.
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rayoflight

beyond BK

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post11 Aug 2009

You can find similar teachings without having to join a cult. All the spiritual information existed before this organisation called it its own and then changed it and adapted it to suit its agenda.

Trust your own instincts. If your intellect is unsure, follow your gut. If your gut doesn't respond, ask questions. If nobody answers your questions properly, that will be the answer. Because the truth is, nobody knows and if they say they do, it is a sign that you are in a cult.

Do some reading on this forum and follow some of the other websites that are also very informative. Best of luck :D.
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ex-l

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post12 Aug 2009

kamaferro wrote:... it looks like a cult, believing in spirits and so on. Could anyone who was or is an active member explain the real truth.

And they really are heavily involved in spirit mediumship or spirit worship ... which they do not make clear or advertising until you are well enculted into their groups.

I used to study Yoga, traditional Hatha Yoga exercises. I wanted to study "Raja Yoga" because, it is said, Hatha Yoga is only a preparation, or one of the "8 arms" of path of Raja Yoga. I was suckered in by the Brahma Kumaris, partly because they advertise their practise as "Raja Yoga" ... which it is not. It is something entirely different and new. This misuse of traditional Hindu and religious terms is something that is VERY common through out their cult.

When the Brahma Kumaris talk about "God", they mean a spirit which they believed possessed their millionaire businessman founder and started to speak through him. Since the death of their founder, the Brahma Kumaris claim that BOTH the God spirit AND the businessman is channeled by their mediums. Their mediums around the world also claim to channel other spirits such as their dead leaders and Hindu gods like "Krishna".

Of course, this spirit claims to the the God of all religions and the path of the Brahma Kumaris is to surrender EVERYTHING to this spirit ... your mind, your body, your WEALTH (naturally) and all of your free time. Their teaches consist of more and more encouragements to give all to their spirit ... for whom (naturally) they will bank the money and register the property in their name.

They probably have not told you that they say this God predicts the End of the World is about to come too, have they?

Well ... it is a good way to make your surrender more and keep you making efforts because you think the world is about to be destroyed soon, killing over 6,000,000,000 humans being so that they can inherit a "purified" heaven on earth.

What they don't tell you is that he predicted this "Destruction" in WWII, 1950, 1976, mid-1980s ... the leaders claimed around Year 2000 and continue to teach their followers "in 2 to 3 years". They have been doing so from the 1930s.

And then they have removed or re-written all their failures and hidden them from newcomers like yourself.

These are hard facts. You can take any of them, ask your BK teachers and then come back to us and let us know what they say. The evidence is all on this site. We can even tell you in advance what they will say and how they will answer, e.g. "Baba (the spirit) has never given a precise date for 'Destruction' (the end of the world)".

Getting involved in easy. It is like getting sucked into taking drugs. For the first 3 or 6 months it feels great, you will get "high", all your family and friends will wonder what has happened to you. Then the high stops but you are hooked. You keep make more "efforts" to try and regain it. You won't. But by that time they have got you and the combination of the self-hypnosis and the repetitive teachings will be starting to re-shape your mind and behavior ... Get it out of your mind is tough.

Most of all, they get you to switch off your emotions and feelings, and "detach" from your body ... from simple, innocent pleasures like touch, nature, other humans including your family and friends. They, or the spirits behind them, want to own you 100%.

The problem that most of us here who were serious about a "spiritual path" have them is that it is impossible to know what is really going on with them because they have told so many lies, covered up so much truth of their own histories and religion and changed so many elements. In fact, that is the only thing you can be sure of them.

I was particularly upset with them because I was very, very sincere about following "the spiritual path". I had no idea they was so dishonest - and basic - until years after leaving them. I left because I got sick of their worship of, and chasing after VIPs and their lack of real care for society. "Service of humanity" for them is evangelizing their cult beliefs like some secret service.

Like many of us here, I tried discussing change and reform from within but they are not really interested in, or capable of doing so ... in my opinion. In short, I find the leaders around who they flock, like their "Dadi Janki", narrow-minded, bigoted and full of themselves. Her "divine art", in particular, is pulling money out of Hindu followers.

They really do believe that they are the only true religion, all others are partial copies of theirs, and that their leaders are "one of the 8" top souls in the world or twice as "spiritual" as Christ or Buddha.

kamaferro

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post12 Aug 2009

Thanks for sharing. I am shocked to read all those things and I see so many people attracted by their "interesting" course and talks. I am really disappointed, I cannot believe all this, I thought they were pure, also so special, in not charging for meals and courses.

May the Universe guides us towards the right path. I am searching the right, true, honest spiritual guru/master, hopefully one day this dream will be fulfilled

Love and light
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rayoflight

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post12 Aug 2009

kamaferro wrote:May the Universe guide us towards the right path. I am searching the right, true, honest spiritual guru/master, hopefully one day this dream will be fulfilled

Dear kamaferro,

Don't be too disappointed. Instead, be thankful that you avoided a wrong turn. For that is worth celebrating :D.
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alladin

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importing illnesses

Post12 Aug 2009

Hi, Ferro. Welcome to this Forum.

ex-l said it all in a plain, essenceful way, and no one can deny any of that!!

When I came across the BKWSO, I was practising Tai Chi, (BTW, we have all been discouraged from practising sports or following a healthy vegetarian diet-typical BK food is overcooked, oily and full of white sugar, and it is a sin to refuse it) and other forms of meditation and was also, like you, praying God to help me find a true, spiritual path. Maybe their spooks hears this kind of calls and captures us ... ;).

I thought that this was it, and in fact, as the BK repeat, that I was SOO lucky, one of the few long lost and now found (by God) children. Many things seemed to resonate, and some did not make sense at all. The vicious, cynical, narrow minded behavior of members senior to me became apparent, over time, and not acceptable by my moral standards, neither in tune with my vision of life, priorities,relationships, etc ...

These elevated human beings, which claim to be angels on Earth, are actually devoted to proselytism, career minded, caste obsessed, sex-phobic, ambitious, and worship money, name and fame, facilities and quantity rather than quality, just like most people nowadays!! Since they are obviously dysfunctional (please, I recommend some posts about the delusion of grandeur, really comic!!), they will contaminate with their dis-eases, those who come in contact and follow them.

The BKs create an unhealthy environment. Sincerely, I do not want to acquire pathologies which I do not have, hang-ups, manias, because pragmatically speaking, I have enough to deal with, and do not need to import racism, or sex segregation, hierarchic systems and unquestionable dogmas, or any anachronistic, medieval stuff in my life!! They claim to be creating a New Age by imposing very antiquate ideas and methods on disciples, instilling fear and guilt in them, ALL THE TIME, AT EVERY STEP. I wish I could suggest some particular path for anyone to follow, but maybe it doesn't exist.

The BKs will say that once you found them, you found God and do not need to search any further. Naive not to realize that any sect or religion claims the same thing :D The world is full of gurus, books, courses ... One thing for sure, none of those should replace our Higher Self, suppress it or deny it, nor at any point, a "spiritual teaching" should turn into brainwashing.

You will find endless reading material on this Forum. Apart from general statements, I think that reading personal experiences of various posters, will be particularly helpful , as if you were chatting with some friends, spiritually oriented people, that bumped into a sect, were turned by it into zombies (no offense meant to other Forum members!!), extricated themselves from it and escaped, and decided to share here their experiences.

Love and peace
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ex-l

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Re: importing illnesses

Post13 Aug 2009

alladin wrote:I was also, like you, praying God to help me find a true, spiritual path. Maybe their spooks hears this kind of calls and captures us ... ;)

I can imagine that I might be ridiculed for writing this but it needs to be explored ...

I think there is something in this which, in another post, is why I called the Brahma Kumaris leader Dadi Janki as a "spiritual trickster", and would call their spirit guides, "trickster spirits". In mythology the trickster deity breaks the rules of the gods or nature, sometimes maliciously, but with ultimately positive effects. Often, the rule-breaking takes the form of tricks or thievery. Tricksters can be cunning or foolish or both; they are said to be often funny.

I, too, had exactly the same sentiments as you both. I was sincerely setting off to "seek the master" having heard so much about it in books, which ultimately I discovered to be largely religious fairy stories (hagiographies).

Perhaps the lesson is 'not to look outside the self' because that is when the trickster comes into our life. The positive way of looking at it is that when we do so, we let the trickster into our lives as a "test". But, in truth, I do not believe so. I believe the trickster is just a waste of time. The only thing to learn is "not to be tricked by tricksters" and, perhaps, not to become one.

    Are we willing to be seduced by all they offer us ... power ... money and what it can buy ... the power over others? Do we want to learn how to deceive others?

    Are we truly sincere spiritual seekers or even just sincere, ordinary human beings?
It was some other valuable member of this forum who once quoted the parents of a Brahma Kumaris follower as saying, "all they did was taught our son to lie" and I think there is a great truth to that. Lie very sincerely and convincingly.

That not one of them can bring their unholy ghost down to earth, in their spirit mediums, to ask it and receive an answer about all the failed predictions, the inconsistencies and anomalies ... says it all for me really.

They would rather play at being the Emperors and Empresses of the World instead, and having one of their 'respected' leaders pretending than Krishna coming into her body, dancing and playing through her. That, my friend, is about as much as you get when you become a BK.

Surely, you can have a lot of interesting emotional and mystic experiences, if you are lucky a vision or two, but what does it all mean at the end of the day?

I am sorry ... but at the end of the day I wasted years of my life over something their leaders knew was faked up in the first place but hid from us, and they have been hiding stuff for decades. That is not divine or enlightened.

kamaferro

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post15 Aug 2009

I contacted the founder of a BK centre in Italy who I have met during a course, he wants to discuss this further and explain all the rubbish written by all defaming sites. I accepted and will let you know. In the meantime I forward what he wrote to me:
does not surprise me because we are familiar with the situation. Let's talk about it with great pleasure, I can only share my experience and why certain things that are written are painful, it's a bit like extracting from an interview some words and use them at will completely distorting the meaning of them.

I was a spiritual researcher for most of my life, I am not saying that I have arrived but I have never been so close to something that responds to all my questions and help me change continuously, for 15 years, the better. If you want to learn our view and discuss further I will be happy to do it.
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rayoflight

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

kamaferro,

The person whom you have quoted is entitled to his experience and opinion, as any of us are here.

It is true, it is painful to read things that come out into the open especially on a public forum, but after nothing else has worked, it is the only way to remove the puss from the wound.

If the organization did not behave like a mafia, where no one sees, hears or speaks the truth unless it is agreed upon by your highness's the pukka Seniors et al, this forum would not have been created. Avoiding the truth, whether it be about situations or feelings is not a mature nor spiritual way to behave. At some point everyone has to face the music.

None of us would be writing here if we hadn't been sorely hurt. People don't write because they have nothing better to do with their lives. It is indeed VERY painful to wake up and realize that the loving-kindness we initially encounter is a farce. Yes, at first they are loving and kind, but with a very clear agenda in mind. We don't just come in looking for a guru to teach us about love and peace, but also about respect, which they have absolutely none of mainly because they are a hierarchy and respect is only given at the top of the pyramid. What people in India call "karma" we in the West call exploitation.

Yes, painful, because with Brahmins you never know when someone is sincere with you or just toying with you so you can serve the Brahma Kumaris. It is very, very painful when you come in with an open mind and open heart only to later find out you are being manipulated to recruit. Who in their right mind (especially spiritual) comes in to recruit? We come in to find answers to deep and sensitive questions.

It is our right to question the sincerity regardless of how painful it is to look behind the mask. Actions speak louder than words, so after a while you just have to look at the actions to know who you're dealing with. They teach about love but only skim the surface.

We are here to speak our truth, our experience and mainly to dissect the organization with a fine toothed comb to better understand why people are depressed, angry, sick and hurt and why some are led to suicide. Calling it karma is a cop-out. It would be great to see some BK's step up to the podium and show some guts instead of running away like scared chickens. Because it's really sad to know that some people throw away 15 years of their lives to try to figure out how to be spiritual.

By the way, there is nothing taken out of context here. When a group of people from different parts of the world most of whom have never met, come to the same conclusion, what context is there to explain? It's a cookie cutter cult and everybody is a sheep. That's the ugly truth no matter how hard one tries to turn it around and switch the blame.

The only reason we are writing is because we cannot stand to watch more lovely, sweet, kind and spiritual people searching for answers, being used and falling through the cracks. Honestly, we would ALL just like to get on with our lives and put the Brahma Kumaris behind us but we are waiting for the fat lady to sing.
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ex-l

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

kamaferro wrote:explain all the rubbish written by all defaming sites. I accepted and will let you know.

"All the rubbish" is prejudicial and fighting talk ... what about discussion and explaining all the facts the "defaming sites" have exposed?

Please feel free to report exactly what they say. Please do not feel inhibited to criticize us.

I would, however, suggest meeting on neutral ground. They will want to bring you to the center and feed you food in order to have you "influenced" by the vibrations. Whether you believe in them, or that you will be, it does not matter. I am just reporting their methodology.

Then during the conversation, BKs are taught, and tend to mentally retreat into their meditative state to and "send you Baba's vibrations" ("give you dristhi" in BK speak). Again, attempting to do the same time as above. Practising long period of withdrawal gives them a good advantage in conversations, slowing them down, speaking slowly and not reacting strongly. I do not know if the Italian BKs are like this ... BK-ism and ristretto do not hand in hand to my mind!

BKs have their own particular use of language that is difficult to understand, e.g. "defamation" from "defaming Baba" is a clear one.

Their published history is faked. They know we know it is fake. Why do they keep publishing it? They entirely covered up that for the first 20 years they believed Lekhraj Kripalani (Brahma Baba) was God and there was no God Shiva mentioned in their religion at all. My interests are specifically academic ... why was this hidden ... how, when and by whom was the God Shiva theory introduced post-1950. Its obscure ... very likely your local center-in-charge does not know any of this.

So why the false claims about Dadi Janki being the most stable mind in the world for 20 years ... what of all the suicides ... why the cover up and no charges made of their sex offenders ... what about the financial abuses?

To raise those might be counter-productive but to question why they keep their scriptures (the Murlis channeled messages) hidden and even disallow adherents from having copies is strange. They believe is God speaking person by possessing the body of Lekhraj Kirpalani or their current mediums ... why hide them from humanity?
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Mr Green

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

Unfortunately, it sounds like they've almost got you.....I think you're at the dangerous point of wanting to be a BK.

All the best.
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rayoflight

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

ex-l wrote:"All the rubbish" is prejudicial and fighting talk ... what about discussion and explaining all the facts the "defaming sites" have exposed? Please feel free to report exactly what they say. Please do not feel inhibited to criticize us.

Yes, precisely. A defensive response is given when someone is either in denial or put on the spot without being prepared to answer coherently. This is mainly because as is mentioned on this forum several times, they don't have answers.

Mr Green wrote:Unfortunately, it sounds like they've almost got you.....I think you're at the dangerous point of wanting to be a BK.

You are lucky to have the opportunity to read some true stories on this forum and make an intelligent decision before you decide to become a BK. Before this forum existed, those who were in your position had nowhere to turn to, to question the ethics of this organization. Consider yourself lucky. But keep in mind, that after one has invested 15+ years of their life, money, time, mind, heart and soul into something, they are not going to tell you, a newby, the truth. It would take a lot of courage and self-respect to admit that we've made a mistake, and to throw away all the investment, in order to start anew.

starchild

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

I would advise you to keep in touch with the forum and, as ex-l says, feel free to criticize.

The meditation is very seductive. You will have read how many on the forum write about how wonderful the experience is, in the beginning. Ask this person, whether he/she experience has all been wonderful, or whether they have gone through hellish head trips as well. Within the organization this is expected, they call it storms of Maya. They may not admit it to someone they are trying to recruit. Or they may tell you that as the meditation is purifying the soul the dirt (of past sins) comes up to the surface, and this causes these 'upheavals'. It can be an horrific confusing experience.

Discussions on the forum have, now and then, touched on where the initial experience comes from. I think much more exploration on this subject is needed. We need the answer to that.

Personally, I think between the meditation technique, concentrating only on the third eye chakra (which is mainly considered to be very unbalanced), mixed with the concentrated atmosphere of the centre, group meditation tuning into the group consciousness, brings one in touch with their own inner spirituality very quickly. Far too quickly, in fact. It has the effect, in my opinion, not unlike that of using LSD or Peyote; to open the doors of perception, very, very dangerous. A kind of Pandoras box syndrome.

There is an article in another part of this site, I think it is 'drugs and the paranormal' a post from Jannisder about Patanjali, (hope I have that right).
... he had reminded the practicants time and time again that the acquisition of the higher faculty of knowledge should be directed properly for rising to the higher stages of contemplation. Otherwise they might lead to a downfall ...

The BKs do not remind or warn the participants of any of the dangers.

When you have that downfall, the BKs will not want to know. They have no concern and no care programs in place for those who experience difficulties.

What I am going to say now may seem rather far fetched but I believe it to be true.

That light and peacefulness that is experienced in the beginning, I believe, is the persons own spiritual light. I believe that when it is surfaced, the BKs tune into it in a vampire-like fashion to feed the power of the organization. The individual is courted during this time, until they are left empty. The wonderful feelings are finished and I have never met anyone who went through the BK experience who did not come down with a bump. The choice then is either to leave, and to put the pieces back together (which can take years, decades even), or to stay and feed from the organization.

And what is done spiritually is also reflected in the physical aspects. You will be expected to work for the organization and give financially.

As for the defamation, 15 years since I left and I still have pangs of fear and guilt for speaking my experience on this forum. The indoctrination is very intense. Anything that you do not agree with is thrown back to you as being your problem, your lack of understanding, bad vision (that is, your bad way of seeing things), or your unfortunate bad karma. A no win situation.

You will hear many things that are the truth, and meet very good sincere people, but I think for your own safety, you should keep in touch with this forum. Sometimes a post may sound bitter, but I think it is clear that the people posting here are good, intelligent people who have been hurt. The BKs explanation will be that we are souls who did not make the grade, could not reach the highest ideals and that if we can not make it, we become more degraded than we were before and defame the BKs. This serves them on many levels.

I think you should take with you to the discussion with the BKs questions that concern you, from the forum.

Stay in touch, stay in balance, stay safe.

In love and light.

jann

friends or family of a BK

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Re: Some comments and advice

Post16 Aug 2009

The Italian friend already gave you an answer.
it's a bit like extracting from an interview some words and use them at will completely distorting the meaning of them.

Meaning, "we 'normal' ... the stone intellect, the shudras, the lowest of the lowest ... people, do not understand anything".

They feel superior in every matter. That is what they were told and that is how they act. Yes, act. To them its all a game, is it not?

A warm welcome to your friend's interpretation though.
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