Drishti experiences?

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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post20 Apr 2015

The simple answer is, the centres-in-charge mostly all live off donations, and the leadership affords their palaces and delusion of grandeur from them ... and they learned from 1950, 1976, 1986 that prediction don't happen - but are good for business - and developed an armoury of get out clauses that are passed down the pyramid of command.

Destruction is always just around the corner. I remember Jayanti Kirpalani telling us "two to three years" back in the 1980s ... and she was meant to be "One of the (top) 108" souls in the world, her advice "Shrimat" and equal to God's!

Such conceited self-delusion.

However, I wanted to add for 'Free Speech' that some BKs and newcomers do have very strong and inexplicable experiences, especially in the beginning (... they wear off) . I know I did, but not as strong as others, even those I was teaching. They included all the usual "religious" experiences; visions of light/s or heaven, bodilessness, floating feelings etc.

But what's the point of them if all they lead to is delusion, a lack of honesty and ethics, and a life of chasing tired old politicians and VIPs?
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Pink Panther

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post21 Apr 2015

Friend,

Your topic has covered a lot of ground, and to bring this discussion back to topic - yes, many people have these feelings and experiences but not only BKs. The spiritual literature for millenia is filled with warnings about not being fooled by charismatics (wolves in sheep’s clothing) or drawn to psychic or meta-visual phemomena or believing it is from others you will receive enlightenment. Nothing is "out there” .

I used to meditate in front of posters that went from floor to ceiling that had beautiful paintings of krisna and Narayan etc saying this was Brahma (Lekhraj) in his next life - and the prediction of 1976 was clearly printed on them - all prepared while he ”(Lekhraj) was alive and considered One with God, and the Father of Humanity (the literal translation of Prajapita). jayanti’s ”explanation” is disingenuous to point of being a lie, a political spokesman pretending their leader was ”taken out of context”.

Let’s get this straight. We have a devout Hindu chap who knows a few things - a hotchpotch of scriptural references and populist understandings of the world of his day. He had a few gurus, learnt a few tricks. He has profound experiences - not the first person in history to have that, make effort in certain ways and you will get the fruit of those ways.

He thinks he is God and the world will end soon, (also not the first nor last person in history to think that) and uses his charisma, shares his techniques & musings to give experiences to novices ( I include myself as an inexperienced novice when I encountered BKs, that’s my excuse) and he used his wealth to attract and support followers, to create a world they could inhabit and reinforce for each other. Not the first dude in history to do that either.

This group sees repeated failures of the actualisation of his predictions but continues to adapt. It runs out of money so he sends proselytisers out to teach, gain converts and gain donations to send back to the main community. This becomes the business model that proves successful and which causes the adjustments of all the original teachings and structures until today, we have a multinational ”not-for-prophet” with assets likely worth billions. Not bad for a local scripture study group made up of family, cousins and some friends from a small trading port on the edges of empire.

But no business model, religion or tradition, no matter how "off the planet’ , irrational, exploitative or superstitious, would survive without something that serves people. The BK meditation technique is not unique but it has been shaped and adapted and badged as BK, and cleverly adapted to suit the times and the ’'market".

Like a company that uses sweatshop labour to make cheap copies of Levi jeans, the BKs have an imitation product people want that seems like what they are looking for and seems to be low cost. But like the clothing company, the BKs do not want their sources questioned nor their history, their ledgers, their exploitation of others , the internal abuses, exposed to public knowledge.
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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post21 Apr 2015

To be clear, the Murlis state over and over again that Brahma Baba is not God and that we claim our inheritance by remembering (having Yoga with) God, who is a point of light just like all souls. I know that for many years they thought Brahma Baba was God but the way you wrote it shows that that's still the idea.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post21 Apr 2015

Your understanding shows how you are still not an”insider” with the BKs. A good thing.

The Murlis state over and over that Brahma is the ‘Chariot' of God - God is the driver, that is, god enters him and speaks directly. i.e. depending on language, you could say he is ”possessed” by God, or ”channels” God.

There are explicit paragraphs where ”God” is speaking in the first person and referring to Brahma (Lekhraj) in the third person e.g. ”I have entered this one...” .

These Murlis from the time before Lekhraj’s death are called ”Sakar” Murlis. These ones in particular have been heavily edited over the years by the [url]Ministry of Truth[/url]. They are less PR friendly so newbies are directed toward the less controversial ”Avyakt Murli” which are more ”New Age” and ”motherhood statement” type monologues.

I remember classes where Dadi janki would be asked ”how do you know when it was God speaking or Brahma speaking?” Sometimes she would answer directly, saying something like ”There would be a glow in his eyes” or ”he would turn around and say ”do you realise who is now with you’” etc. Other times she would say ”I always considered anything Baba said as being God speaking, this is how I was able to make high jumps” (advances in spiritual attainment).

The idea that it is God speaking is explicitly there when BKs speak of "BapDada". The Murlis after Lekhraj died are called ”Avyakt” Murlis and they are spoken by BapDada. This is the name given to the supposed ”combined” entity that is God Shiva and Avyakt (bodiless) Brahma. That is, both are there speaking. Why?

The logic comes after 1955, when the idea is no longer that Lekhraj is God Brahma but there is a separate entity that is using him, called Shiva (but not THAT Shiva> This logic says that God does not possess ”language” to relate knowledge to humans on how to ”have Yoga’ with him, so must take over a human who has that ability, and the human should be the highest of humans, the son of God (no not THAT son of God ) well, you can guess who that is!

But that human medium, the number one son formerly known as God Brahma, dies before all the predictions come to fruition, what then?
Avyakt BapDada !!!
(even sounds like a trumpet fanfare!)
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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post21 Apr 2015

Friend wrote:... the way you wrote it shows that that's still the idea.

Not sure who you are addressing, but sometimes I wonder/ed when the likes of Janki Kirpalani says "Meera Baba/my Baba", which want she meant.

Given it was she who instituted the big trance lights and pictures of Lekhraj Kirpalani (against the Shrimat of the Murli), and know what we know now - that there was no God Shiva in the cult until sometime after 1955 - I tend to think it is Lekhraj Kirpalani. They also do mental gymnastics over how remembering Lekhraj Kirpalani automatically 'bounces' thoughts to their Shiva.

For over 20 years - right through their Beggary and renunciate periods - they were living with their god in person ... Prajapati God Brahma.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post22 Apr 2015

I think Friend has the understanding of BK Gyan that he does because Denise has a less ”devotional”, more metaphorically cosmic view of BK theology. I know at one point she and Dadi Janki had ‘differences” on the way things should be done.

OK, for some philosophies you could say that one’s individual take on it makes it what it is. But BKism is the opposite. Any relativism or personal take that differs from the dogma merely marks you down in status both currently and, according to their belief, for the status in the ”Golden Age” to come and for eternity. Those who ”make the right efforts” are recognised by the fact they ”understand" and follow the BK orthodoxy in all ways.

That’s the thing, in the West BKism has been whitewashed to suit the marketplace, but what BKism is should be understood by the predominant portion of the BKWSU 99% of which is in India, You have felt "the elephant’s tail" and assumed an elephant is like a piece of leathery rope.

You can’t understand the Roman Catholic church on the basis of the views of St Francis, nor can you assume you understand Islam by what an extremist mullah rants. Denise shows a better aspect of BKism not because of BKism but because of who she is and literally, has been able to get away with because of her status as the second westerner to become a BK. Janki would have put anyone more junior in their place a long time ago.

Friend, you are here to get the bigger picture. Your experience and understanding is not invalid, but it is also neither accurate nor representative.
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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post22 Apr 2015

How do Denise and Big Mohini get on? It was hinted there were tensions there.

What disappoints me is no such "mature or senior BKs ever talk openly, maturely and publicly about the problems and evolution of BK life and world. None of them ... perhaps only Robin Ramsay has started recently (just about).

And none of them have come on here or approached us seriously, nor given us credit where due.

Would "God" really be so superficial and all about facade? Mine would not.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post23 Apr 2015

ex-l wrote:Would "God" really be so superficial and all about facade? Mine would not.

Well, as God is whatever any believer believes, then sure, someone else's God can be superficial and facile while yours is not (to you at least).

Don’t you know God moves in mysterious ways and everything that happens is God’s plan, your faith is being tested (or whatever other rationalisation you want to excuse the incongruous ...).
"Yeah we're playing those mind games together
Projecting our images
in space and in time"

- John Lennon, Mind Games
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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post23 Apr 2015

Pink Panther wrote:Well, as God is whatever any believer believes..

Really? I thought there was a pantheon of 16,108 gods (or 330 million with added extra inflation) each with their own objective existence and reality ... are they extinct now? :shock: And whatever happened to the Titan, did they sellout and join the corporation too?

Can you be sure there's no one else but we jumped up monkeys?
Don’t you know God moves in mysterious ways and everything that happens is God’s plan, your faith is being tested ...

You're right ... one's rational mind is being tested and and one who believes "everything that happens is God’s plan" and a test of faith has failed.

And no amount of giving or taking Drishti will change that.

Anyone interested in understanding giving or taking Drishti ought to set up an experiment where no BK do exactly the same with no faith element.

Many of the same effects that BKs invest faith in as "signs", eg halos, changing, lightness, "energy" exchange also happen to them.

BKs are taught and practise visualising "light" or "power" coming down from their Shiva, through them, and then at students/VIPs/geographical regions. This they believe is their great "charity", not doing anything, and one day at the End of the World, they will be shining down such great power and light ... even, literally, "from helicopters" above massed hordes in one account! ... they will help humans die and leave this world (to let them have it).

This is the long term aim of the practise ... to become unconscious channel for their god spirit and dead elders to work through.

Well, that and making babies in the Golden Age!!!
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Mr Green

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post24 Apr 2015

A very large posterior.
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Harleymachine

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post02 May 2015

OK then!! Someones taking my thread seriously! "quantum" I don't take lightly the threat of "sorting" me out "via here" and have contacted my own people to find out more about your VERY unwanted attention on what is really just light conversation about my experiences. I have got a lot from reading things here on this forum and from the get go have said I am new and just did not understand this new world I'd stepped into. I think it is a healthy thing to look at the big picture and there is NO! deceptiveness in my relationship with any BK's or ex BK's. In fact, I have been learning a lot and have move on from a lot of the thought patterns in some of my old posts. The sad thing is quantum you seem to want to hold me to ransom over them ... nice NOT! What is your story?
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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post03 May 2015

This thread has been taken seriously by everyone - it is three pages long now and many people have given time and thought to it. You have not given considered responses to many of the points made so maybe it is you who has not taken it as seriously ?
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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post03 May 2015

Templewoodalister wrote:there is NO! deceptiveness in my relationship with any BK's or ex BK's.

I would not worry. There is every chance Quantum won't even come back here. They were a recent and infrequent poster. Yes, the BK world as a whole has its cranky edges - the worse of which are absolutely not here - but we allow folks a little 'free' expression as a counter to the highly controlled BK world and are forgiving.

I thought Quantum was over harsh and over reacting but, please appreciate, folks come out of the BKWSU with very real pains, sore or damage. It's a sort of spiritual Posttraumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) that certain cultic terms or tones can trigger them off. This is a very real thing that has been recognised by therapists working in the area.

And the deeper the commitment and involvement ... the deeper the value of real spiritually ... the deeper it lies.

I would say I find this to be true even in my own case. I find it hard to censor myself especially when, for example, some BK comes on creepy sweet and deliberately confusing their god spirit with the/an absolute god. You could see it as us pushing away from those BK elements or programming that lies within us ... an expression of internal struggle.

One thing that would suggest to me that you are more influenced by BK contact than a complete newcomer/outsider is your use of "BK's" for the plural of BNK ... which is "BKs".

That a real BKism. They do it all the time in their mediafeed and keep doing even when you point it out to them. They're real ****wits.

Never trust a god who's [sister in charge] adherents cannot apostrophise.
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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post04 May 2015

Thank you for sharing, I do take what others have said on this thread seriously. I was pointing to one person only in my previous post. To say I was being deceiving, based on my previous post subjects, got my back up a bit. I guess, as mentioned before, quantum may be damaged and carrying some bags of hurts upon their shoulders ... please forgive me.

I am aware that we all bring our own experiences into every subject discussed on here. I will bring maybe a lighter side, some might call it a "worldly approach" (which "quantum" did not like too much) but I still try to always remember my aim, which is to have a connection/relationship with God. As dagy as I might come across I am not trying to impress anyone here and pump up my ego.

I stumbled onto this site thinking it was a support page for new BK's lol but I am thankful for it too. I am interested to see what others have got to say about their experiences good or bad. God gave us a free will and I respect others but I will do my own thing. I feel extremely empowered by what I have learnt with the BK's, which is my experience so far. I have had some challenges too but I strongly believe in honesty and Gods love ... darkness cannot hide where there is light. Bring it on! It's only when you hide behind others in the darkness of their own thoughts perceptions that you'll become dis empowered and I will not hand myself over to the so called power they think they have.

Experiences or our interpretation of them as we all know is always about us, but sometimes I stop and I'll ask myself what do others see ... say re: "Dristi" The idea behind it sounds amazing but I am coming from a place of honesty. I wasn't seeing anything ... I am not going to say I was to please anyone else (respectfully so) and I am not saying it's not real. I love the idea of it and who knows just like Zoolander's, lol, "magnum" look. I'll see when I least expect it and it will blow my socks off!! Til that day I am just going to keep on keeping on.

I have learnt a lot by this thread so again thank you for sharing.
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ex-l

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Re: Drishti experiences?

Post04 May 2015

But the BKs are dealing with "God" but their own god spirit.

Quantum considered that their intuition led them to believe you were more of a BK than you suggested. I can see why, g "Thank you for sharing" has become a real BKism these days. The distinction of who is and is not a BK has become - deliberately - more blurred these days. How influenced by them do you think you are?

By "worldly, do you mean "lokik"?

Do you think their god spirit really is the god of all religions?
Templewoodalister wrote:... a support page for new BK's

BKs ... BKs ... BKs.

BK's means 'belonging to BK'.

I watched the Zoolander movie. Hmmn ... cannot quite go as far as "thanks" but it made me smile now and again.
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