Are all BKs awful people???

for ex-BKs, exiting BKs, Friends & Family of BKs and newcomers to the forum.
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Karlaleto

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Are all BKs awful people???

Post26 Apr 2015

Hi I am new to this whole website, I only joined out of curiosity and I have a few questions.

A friend of mine calls herself a Brahama Kumari, we're not very close but I know for a fact that she's been going for meditation since she was 5 with her parents. She's pretty popular in our school (a member of the student body and the president of the drama and music society ...) but she doesn't seem as harmful as you describe them to be?? Both her parents and herself go to the brahama Kumaris place every day in the morning before school and, for some strage reason, she doesn't eat anything that she doesn't bring from home but she's always been really nice and doesn't try to convert anybody into their religion or anything. Even her parents are pretty normal from what I know of them (I've been to their house a couple of times) so I am really confused now??

Should I tell people that the place she goes to is not good?? Most of our school knows her, what if she's evil or something all along??
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Pink Panther

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post26 Apr 2015

As I understand this site, no-one here is attacking or criticising the followers as such (although the leadership is by its being the leadership, open to criticism). BKs are neither better nor worse than any other people.

Organised religions and cults have a strong dynamic, a tendency, to exploit and manipulate their followers for the benefit of sustaining and growing the religion/cult rather than the follower. They also need to differentiate themselves from the other belief systems, so they cloak their defining dogmas in universally accepted values - peace, brotherhood etc

Cover-up of corruption and abuses, non-disclosure of financial reality, the powerful within the group manipulating the less powerful (and so on) goes on in practically all organisations. The BKs are not different. It's human nature. But the organisation creates an environment for institutionalising such exploitations.

Because we here have the experience of having been BKs or know people who are, our focus here is on the BKs rather than other religions or cults, even though we may refer to others as examples or parallels.

My personal focus is on the teachings themselves, which may seem benign on one level but when examined, contain the instruments of entrapment, dependency, conformity and secrecy based on appeal to ”spiritual ego” rather than freedom, independence, individualisation and full transparency.
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ex-l

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post26 Apr 2015

Karlaleto wrote:Are all BKs awful people???

I don't know ... what do you call a group of people who believe they are going to "give courage" to "the scientist" to unleash the nuclear arsenal so that all of "impure" humanity will be annihilated ... a humanity they consider to be untouchables and "demons"? Who believe 7 billion must and will die terribly so they alone can inherit the Earth?

And that, BTW, is why she won't eat any food the rest of you cook ... because you're too impure and your impure vibrations will pollute her if she eats any food you cook.

It's hard to blame a kid who has been brought up in a cult. She's more of a victim. I suspect if you scratch below the surface, you'll find the mom is a little whacky/nutty and it was her who dragged the family into the cult.

What should you do?

Yes, you should warn others about what the BKs' teachings really are and challenge her if she comes out with the usual goody two shoes facade ... blah, blah, blah United Nation etc. The Brahma Kumaris are an end of the world cult who share similar dynamics with every other end of the world cult, ie exploiting followers' fear of impending doom and promising them gold, riches and servants in a Heaven on Earth which has always just about to come ... but never does.

Worst case scenario, they will suck her up to become an unpaid virgin servant for life.

By now you should have read what the BKs' beliefs are ... all of space, time and history fitting into 5,000 year, repeating identically in a cycle, dinosaurs existing 2,500 years ago, God possessing a little old Indian lady and speaking through her etc. It gets pretty whacky.

Don't let her dupe the school or other with sweet talk.

No, all BKs are not awful people ... they are practising being "perfect" for their 'heaven on earth soon to come' so they come across as "nice". But they can be a bit controlling and manipulative of the truth if challenged. Are they worse than any other religion? Well, they certainly do less good for others than most.

I guess for you, it's a good chance to learn about 'cult dynamics' ... how religious cults work, how individuals within how religious cults behave etc.
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Mr Green

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post26 Apr 2015

The BKs are full of lovely, quite well educated people. But most are also quite needy people. The people running it are not very nice in my opinion
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Free Speech

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post26 Apr 2015

ex-l wrote:Worst case scenario, they will suck her up to become an unpaid virgin servant for life.

Are all brahmakumaris (teachers) virgin? :shock:
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Pink Panther

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post27 Apr 2015

Free Speech wrote:Are all brahmakumaris (teachers) virgin? :shock:

No. Dadi Janki for one had a child (whom she abandoned, left with someone else to care for, and it later died apparently). The ”sex is evil, body conscious, worst thing any person could do” not only curses each BK’s parents but also means that a hypocritical glorification of virginity has to take place. This false moralising on this basic human instinct for sex and relationship (and the spiritual evaluation of what people eat - another basic instinct - as satto or tamo etc) gives power and control.

In direct opposition to the BK values and goals are the concept of a pluralistic, secular, democratic society celebrating personal liberties, freedom of expression, personal responsibility, the rule of law, redistribution of wealth to minimise inequality, basing education on historical facts, mathematics and the sciences, and the other things social democracies value.

BKs value and work to create a world based on established hierarchy and monarchy, not democracy.

They give regard those who practice their morality and see others' moral values and ethics as inferior (lokik). They give regard to those who surrender their personal liberties to serve the organisation, who give over personal responsibility and authority to the BK hierarchy and take instructions from them. They give most regard to those who also give over their wealth. They disregard those who question and they will defame critics and whistleblowers, only responding responsibly when forced to..

They believe in their own caste system, i.e. they have, with a word (and in their own minds) usurped the caste born Brahmin to make themselves ”true Brahmin. They call democracy ”the blind leading the blind”.

They use the law only when it serves them otherwise they too will cheat, bribe and circumvent it when it suits them, even encourage petty theft if it is for ”service” (I heard this myself from a most senior ‘Brother’).

They will ignore even much of their own professed values including ”equality under god” to give favour to the rich or famous while treating dedicated BKs from poor backgrounds badly. (If you are rich and become a BK and follow all the codes, you will be given good positions and placements with senior BKs etc and have influence. Same if you are rich and not a BK. A poor, working class lifelong dedicated Indian BK however ... is taken full advantage of and treated menially.

Science is mistaken, the scriptures are more reliable references for knowledge - but not always. But if a BK child can use secular education to rise in society to become ”serviceable ” i.e. able to make contacts in society for PR purposes, they are encouraged o do so.

Finances are not publicly disclosed. They claim to be a "religion” to gain charity status in some countries, but not a religion when they publicise themselves. They claim to be an educational institution, a ”university" no less, but don't come close to fulfilling the legal requirements to be called that. They don’t even have a library, except for their own publications which they sell.

You’d expect a ”spiritual University” which is supposed to teach the true history and geography of the world (as they claim) to have a library with copies of Plato’s dialogues, the Dhammapadda & Vajracchedikā Prajñāpāramitā Sūtra, Patanjali’s Yoga sutras, a history of Western philosophy, the Koran and Hadith, the Tao Te Ching and Analects of Confucius. Not one non-BK book. But most BKs, including most of the teachers, have never heard of these, let alone teach them "comparatively” or as alternate views of the world.

What they understand is based on what their founder knew, a bit of Gita, a bit of Koran, a bit of Guru Grantha, some Jainism i.e. a parochial view from 1930s Sindh. The rest of the world is irrelevant.

Instead, they beleive that Lekhraj is not only Prajapati (later Prajapita) Brahma but in his 'next life’ becomes also both Krisna AND Narayan, AND KIng Vikramajit in his 22nd incarnation etc - the fairy tales the delusions of grandeur are transmitted to needy followers who ”sense" they are more special than the rest of humanity.

Is this awful? Maybe not, but it ain’t right.
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khemkaran

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post27 Apr 2015

BKWSU is good for give Godly Messenger in this cosmos. No doubt, There learn to way to connect with God Directly. When people connect with God the feel new experience of Godly feelings. that's not awful and they give knowledge of God which God give through Brahma Baba (Dada Lekhraj). This old world change into New world, How? that's knowledge.
After sometimes they believe 100% in BKWSU. After sometime they get in trouble with BKWSU teachers if new member get more progress then teachers (female) in Spirtuality. There are not 100% true, pure knowledge of world. There are knowledge mix by teachers in Godly knowledge.

So beware of mix knowledge of BKWSU teachers (female).

For your Guidance of Godly knowledge visit: https://bkknowledgefull.wordpress.com/

:D :D :D
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ex-l

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post27 Apr 2015

khemkaran wrote:So beware of mix knowledge of BKWSU teachers (female).

So what happened to you ... a bad center-in-charge ... persecuted by some Dadi?
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Free Speech

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post27 Apr 2015

khemkaran wrote:No doubt, There learn to way to connect with God Directly.

Whew ... even after so much hard work these people here put up, it seems few ex-BKs still do not realise that there is no God in BKWSU & just a belief exists. Khemkaran, you need to let go this belief also. Recently, I read about a very optimistic ex-BK here - who overcame BKism beliefs & false imagery of 'God' through his own hard efforts. Could you try?
So beware of mix knowledge of BKWSU teachers (female).

Most of them are female. Is there a separate male BKWSU organisation too???
For your Guidance of Godly knowledge visit: https://bkknowledgefull.wordpress.com/

For God sake, don't recruit others to BKWSU indirectly? Everyone here knows the yuktis, i think so, and this is one of them- a new one.

Earlier BKism said, "All BKs are good." Then it changed to - "not all followers are good, some may go in a wrong direction but all teachers are pure." After some cases got exposed by media which were related to teachers, they again manipulated and said, "some teachers are also bad & not following Godly rules and regulations." And now the new division is being created such as good male BKs and bad female BKs. Who is good and who is bad, no one knows. So, its better to be completely away from BKWSU.
Pink Panther wrote:No. Dadi Janki for one had a child (whom she abandoned, left with someone else to care for, and it later died apparently). The ”sex is evil, body conscious, worst thing any person could do”

If it was so evil, why Janki did it? Did she kill the child or just dead for her? It is like running away from responsibility. It seems that she was interested in sex but not at all interested in its by-product.

Karlaeto, you can understand what goes on in her mind by understanding the nuances of BKism. It is a cult. Is she a victim, forced into bKism? Can not say it as BKism has its own way to deal with kids of followers & youth.

What BKWSU has been trying for decades is to create its good image so that they get respect & money everywhere. In my opinion, BKWSU runs only for - respect, money and sex (done behind closed doors)? How is it possible on Earth that someone who wants money & respect at all cost (for which she can even talk of destroying the world), will not have inner beast panting for some hardcore action?
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Pink Panther

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post28 Apr 2015

From what I know, Janki was in an arranged marriage at a very young age, maybe 14 years old. She is a tiny person and so it is likely that, along with physical and emotional immaturity, there would have been physical limits to the possibility of enjoying sex.

I would not be surprised if it was a kind of surrender to rape in marriage. The BKs offered a comfortable shelter from the patriarchy for many young women.
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khemkaran

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post28 Apr 2015

Whew ... even after so much hard work these people here put up, it seems few ex-BKs still do not realise that there is no God in BKWSU & just a belief exists. Khemkaran, you need to let go this belief also. Recently, I read about a very optimistic ex-BK here - who overcame BKism beliefs & false imagery of 'God' through his own hard efforts. Could you try?

I mean every person is connected with God without the BKWSU. Good & bad people are everywhere, so you need to choose. You are right, God is not bound with the BKWSU. God is bound with love, truthfulness, purity and Godly servant souls, not evil souls.
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ex-l

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post28 Apr 2015

Pink Panther wrote:The BKs offered a comfortable shelter from the patriarchy for many young women.

And they still do.

Not just patriarchy but arranged marriages within rigid caste and dowry systems..

There's also a mother/daughter and familial power balance issues here, where mothers - perhaps forced into marriage themselves - seek live through their "pure" BK daughters or use them as for leverage against their husbands and in-laws/
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khemkaran

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post29 Apr 2015

So what happened to you ... a bad center-in-charge ... persecuted by some Dadi?

There is no justice in the BKWSU. My experience is good & bad with BKWSU teachers. BKWSU teachers have ego problem with BK males. They not want that any BK male get more progress then them.

They treat BK males as a Donkey or Tree of money. There are no hearing of BK males. :shock:
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Free Speech

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post29 Apr 2015

khemkaran wrote:Godly servant souls

Very funny term that BKs often use. If he is God, why does he need servants? [plz don't tell - to spread knowledge or he cannot do it without mediums ... blah blah blah ...]. If you are someone's servant, you would be kicked out when your master gets upset. I think that is case for many ex-BKs. In that case, it is better to live your life as a master than to be someone's servant. Where there is hierarchy till end, there is no existence of God.
Godly servant souls, not evil souls.

Then, what is value of quote that God loves all equally? BK god has so many preferences & conditions that no one can fulfill. Only Dadis enjoy it all. He enter one of them from top & she starts doing hisss.... fussss.... whispers.
She treat BK male as a Donkey or Tree of money.

Ha ha ha ... I will show this thread to pakka BK John ... may be he realizes after reading it. I think khemaran, you have experienced 60-70% reality of BKWSU. Only philosophical part is left where you are still stuck but I think you will overcome that also.

I find all BKs I met very awful because when you start discussing the belief & question about it, they turn too egotistic and, yes, this is definitely present in all BKs. I don't like those who talk by putting up a facade. Most BKs do that only, they try to be nice to you so that they can deceive & recruit you in BKWSU. The question we are discussing is no different than asking, "Are all deceivers awful people?"
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ex-l

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Re: Are all BKs awful people???

Post29 Apr 2015

khemkaran wrote:They treat BK males as a Donkey or Tree of money. There are no hearing of BK males. :shock:

That's a fair comment. If you are not rich and powerful (money tree), they want you to be free to be their unpaid servants.

I think "awfulness" is relative.

If you are a thief or a conman and admit it, you are awful enough.

If you claim to be "god's instruments" and the most superior of all humanity - and then act like the BKs ... you a 1,000 times worse.

Therefore, BKs might be polite and quiet in public ... but their organisations intentions and activities - especially the self-serving and self-promoting activities of their leaders - make them pretty awful, really.

Trust me, if there is a god or gods, they really don't give a damn about sucking up to the rich and famous like the BKs.
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