Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

for ex-BKs, exiting BKs, Friends & Family of BKs and newcomers to the forum.
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onvalianthorwatch

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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post21 Nov 2016

Meanwhile back at the ranch:

BUILDING BRIDGES

For over thirty years, the Brahma Kumaris have been helping to bring people of different faiths and cultures together, believing that a deeper understanding between faiths, based on acceptance and respect, will contribute to a culture of peace and non-violence in our world community. In many countries, Brahma Kumaris representatives serve on committees of local interfaith organisations, host local activities, and play an active part on religious education advisory committees. For example, in Dunedin, New Zealand, BKs for the past 13 years have coordinated an annual Interfaith Week of Prayer for World Peace which includes a public service as well as a service at the University. In Adelaide, Australia, BKs regularly participate in the Multifaith Association of South Australia. On the other side of the globe, in Uruguay, BKs participate in Forum Interreligious as well as in the Space of Inter-religious Dialogue at UNESCO’s Montevideo Centre.


... And now let's witness Dadi Janki covertly invoking the spirit by all other names except the one that Mr.Lekhraj professed to be in contact with.

MESSAGE BY Dadi JANKI
CO-ADMINISTRATIVE HEAD
Brahma Kumaris WORLD SPIRITUAL UNIVERSITY
AT THE OPENING OF THE MILLENNIUM WORLD PEACE SUMMIT OF RELIGIOUS AND
SPIRITUAL LEADERS
NEW YORK, 28TH AUGUST, 2000
Om Shanti, a greeting of peace.
Let us spend a moment in deep silence, in the remembrance of the loving Supreme Soul. I feel that the
loving Supreme Soul, who is called out to as Allah, God and in many other ways, is in each one’s heart.
Seeing this invocation to God at the United Nations today, I feel that our loving Mother and Father, yours
and mine, the Remover of Sorrow and Bestower of Happiness, is listening to the voice of everyone’s heart.
When we bring our hands together and say ‘Namaste’, it is a sign of remembering God. With humility and a
true heart, all of us religious and spiritual leaders, can go beyond caste and colour and use the Power of Truth
to destroy sorrow and peacelessness in the world. Our loving Supreme Father has this hope for us that if we
humans adopt the Power of Truth, it would not be difficult to create a peaceful world. Being in the
atmosphere of this gathering today, I do not think I have been able to forget the Supreme Father for even a
second – He is here, He is watching and He is listening to the voice of everyone’s heart. O Lord, with your
power, the power of you, Almighty Father, we will personally make this promise to spread peace in the world
with tolerance and non-violence. Even though I am speaking in Hindi, I know you understand my feelings.
After you hear the brief translation in English, I would like all of us to be together in complete silence, in the
remembrance of our Supreme Father, so that the silence emerging from within our hearts in this gathering,
reaches the entire world.


regards

onthor
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onvalianthorwatch

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Onvalianthorwatch: Into a Matryoshka dolls house.

Post21 Nov 2016

Been reading here and there around the forums today and was struck by a few contributions querying whether we ever really get rid of the world view that we had once lived as followers. Thinking about this today I find that for the first time I consciously experience that I am no longer an ex-BK.

Yes, I am fully aware of and can readily recall the times, the teachings & tenets, the places, the BK environment, the events I participated in, the people I met blah, blah, blah BUT the BK & ex-BK filters through which I formerly processed these experience and recollections seem to be diminishing in my personal self awareness.

I wonder, is this a sign of some sort of personal closure? Am i really undergoing a personal paradigm shift in which my time as a BK is being subsumed within a much larger me being/manifesting who I am? If so, is there really anything of value that I can contribute here? In fact, given the personal nature of each of our journey's through life, is it sane to imagine that there can be anything other than 'crossed-swords' or misunderstanding heaped upon misunderstanding?

Was my joining this website the preliminary act in a (future but now realised) fare thee well to the paraphernalia of the Confluence Age? And if so, how does my provocative and public denial of Shiv Baba figure in this unfolding drama?

Was the whimsical declaration "on valiant thor watch" some sort of signal of a descent into a very singular unreality?

And if so, what next?
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Onvalianthorwatch: Into a Matryoshka doll's house.

Post21 Nov 2016

This so funny.

So after making the above post & in full accordance with the personal - often tried & tested - methods from my Godly Student days I found myself intrigued by the fact that I 'chose' to use the image of a "dolls house" and the "Matryoshka doll" as the title of that nonsense above.

Why on earth would a nutter do so, I wondered, for besides being truly senseless and of no great import it all seemed sort of random. So guess what? I went to try see if I could find a version of today's Sakar Murli just in case there was
any imagery of this nature mentioned ... if you know what I mean after all God speaks doesn't he.

Well I also think that God co-operates because I did ineed find the Murli online (A TOTAL IMPOSSIBILITY IN DAYS GONE BY) and just as was done by hundreds of Godly Students I settled down to read it. And lo & behold this is what I discovered within it (you will have to find the entire Murli for yourself if you are so inclined:
Question: What are the three types of childhood? Which childhood should you never forget?
Answer: One is the childhood you have when you take birth to your physical parents, the second childhood is when you become a disciple of a guru and the third childhood is when you leave your physical parents and belong to the spiritual Parent. Spiritual childhood means to be an adopted child of God. To become a child of God means to die alive. Never forget this spiritual childhood. If you do forget it, you will have to cry a great deal. To cry means to be hurt by Maya.
Song: Do not forget the days of your childhood

Having equipped myself with a magical 'reasoning' shoehorn I decided to take it upon myself to extrapolate that my use of the Matryoshka doll's house image was nothing less that a touching from the great I AM because it is undeniably that a fact that dolls & doll's houses are inextricable connected with CHILDHOOD! Surely you agree, don't you? :|

So there you have it, even though I am no longer a BK, the spook can still waft touchings in the direction of my intellect and wallah I am able to catch them! Not only that, I am also able to recognise when I am the beneficiary (?) of this sort of divine guidance and also humble/alert/obedient/industrious/inventive (and don't forget insane) enough to use my personally verified & certified methodology (in service) to check if my insanity was anywhere recorded TODAY within the annals of BK history.

The answer as you yourself read is YES. You do not need any more proofs do ya? Good. But just in case you do I woud recommend that you develop your own Churning Power.

That'll be all for now

Yours truly and insanely ... over & out from a Matryoshka dolls house somewhere in the Subtle Regions

onthor

hahahahahahahahahaha
PS: Don't take it all too seriously
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Onvalianthorwatch: Not an ex-BK, just being Human

Post21 Nov 2016

Yes that's right finally the realisation is dawning that I am emerging from regarding myself as an ex-BK, and instead am just being human.

regards

onthor
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onthor

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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post22 Nov 2016

And this is the 70th post by the onthor glove-puppet welcoming in a brand New Age (again) all in the one lifetime; a bit like being 'reborn', a phenomena that all BKs will be familiar with. Onvalianthorwatch has ascended to a post in the Subtle Region having reached 69!


regards

onthor
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Re: Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post22 Nov 2016

You say you are beyond ex-BK then you go into raves about the ”I am” and look to Murlis for some kind of negative confirmation, and you think you need to deny something which does not exist.

Listen, The healthiest part of the doughnut is what makes it a doughnut. The rest is stodge.
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ex-l

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Re: Onvalianthorwatch: Not an ex-BK, just being Human

Post22 Nov 2016

onvalianthorwatch wrote:Yes that's right finally the realisation is dawning that I am emerging from regarding myself as an ex-BK, and instead am just being human.

I suppose there is a subtle issue to be raised here (and I use that word in the non-BK manner), that is to say, the foundation or creation of an indentity of being an "ex-BK" ... marked for life, as it was.

It'd be interesting to know how many folk 'just move on' versus how many linger licking their wounds. And then there are the "demi-BKs" who remain friendly and drop in and out of BKism or their local centres.

I suppose it depends on how much time, energy and money/career/life you gave away to the Kirpalani Klan.

Being an "ex-cultie" does not look great on the old CV. There are few people ... except for perhaps Brian Bacon, Mike George and the 'Relax Kids' woman ... who have turned it into something useful. May be a few others who at least left, like Brian, with an attractive, intelligent sexual partner.

"Ex-cultie" does come across as a kind of victimhood and so probably is best left behind ... once you have processed it through. Again, even in the real world, only a very few have turned their cultie period into anything useful, e.g. the odd author/cult-counsellor. I'd like to think a few more turned it into something like therapistry.

How good or bad do you consider you BK period ... equivalent to a bad sports injury ... losing a family member ... being mugged ... being raped ... a 'bad upbringing' or being abused as a child? Could you make a comparison?

There are some people who consider their BK period as a positive thing, e.g. I know of one guy who flip-flopped in and out and then he was "out" fell to pieces going to excess in sexual relationships and (mild) substance abuse. He found himself a comfortable slot just on the outside but still existing on a friendly basis and taking support from them. I also remember one women who was most certainly "out", as in she had a partner and enjoyed a full relationship, but used to go back to the BK centres to "top up" when she felt she needed it.

I could not understand that.

For me, I am reminded of those castes in India whose position in society is as "hereditary beggars" and who even handicap their children, e.g. breaking their legs or mutilating them, to increase their earning potential.

I think that is kind of what the BKs do to young people. They break their natural instincts and "set their bones" in a way that they cannot enjoy a natural, contemporary life and exploit their natural potential - part of which are damaging their two way connection to their families, community, contemporaries.

But, truth be, if you can get as far as being an ex-ex-BK, or even an ex-ex-ex-BK, or even a no relationship to BKism whatsoever, then I applaud and congratulated you.

How much beer/drugs/therapy did it take? :shock:
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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post22 Nov 2016

Pink Panther, I have a sense of humour that others (if they care and I don't see why they should) can take a little time to tune into it, however, even if I am the only one laughing it's all good.

Now, if anyone can read the post you refer to the way I wrote it they would see that there is no contradiction. I was playing a 'game' Pink - and, in my opinion, it is all a game and we are all indeed actors on a stage. However, it seems like one of the differences is that some of the players recognise the game and the clues that it throws up while others remain personally clueless. As the late Robert Nesta Marley sang, "... I & I no expect to be justified by the laws of men, by the laws of men, whole juries shall find me guilty but truth, truth shall prove my innocency" (I translate that as personal truth).

Back to the post.

Pink Panther, as I wrote in post that followed-up Onvalianthorwatch: Into a Matryoshka dolls house, it wasn't till after I looked back at the title I chose for what I'd written that I wondered why I had chosen the images I did (it is called reflection). And so as a human who has full authority over my past experience of the Godly student life, (experiences that will forever be part of what I have lived once upon a time) I know that there are NO ACCIDENTS IN THIS LIFE.

So I went looking to see if there was any possibility that the mighty Shiv Baba could have somehow spoken any words bringing his congregation's (yes, I did playfully place myself in the midst of the gathering) attention to their childhood days. Pink Panther to me that is logical NOR does it contradict my earlier query about whether I had inadvertently stumbled upon a new dimension to being an ex-BK. I was simply checking to see if the tools in my toolkit (acquired during my BK days) still work!

I see it as a game PinkPanther, just a game ... but a wonderful game if you are awake to it. So I do not need anyone to see what i see or concur with what I write or think or imagine. And the personal icing on the cake was that I wrote all of that nonsense as a personal reflection upon whether or not it could be possible for the exiting BK process to have many subtle layers to it.

To spell it out: I can be bolder. I can look at the BKs with a difference that originates from my present state of consciousness. I can look back on the basis of my new awareness (and perception of my existence) I can challenge Shiv Baba, Dadi Janki, Brahma Baba, and, in fact, whoever BK dares to challenge me on any topic to do with my life experience I will accept. Why? Because I do so on the basis of my reality and no-one else's.

Even a lunatic has a personal take on 'reality'. It might be deemed an unsubstantiated take but it is a take that belongs to that particular person and so it is valid ... for them if for none other.

Peace onthor
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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post22 Nov 2016

This is for BKs. I know that there are many, many Godly students who experience a very dry life when it comes to the Murli. Extremely dry. So devoid of energy is their experience that they sit in class and go through the motions of writing in their notebooks. Point after point noted down but barely a fraction of a phrase imbibed much less experienced as the very stuff of their own exaltation'.

I know this because I have sat amidst them and heard their laments and lack of self-respect. I have studied together with them in large and small gatherings and I have been awe struck at the differences in intellect that each possesses numberwise according to fortune; and I accept that I too am numberwise for I accpet it as a matter of fact.

We all cannot be number one .. unless one is a category rather than an individual distinction.

No, onthor, was not a lame, feeling sorry for myself student, Hell no! I loved the Murli and through that love I learnt many personal secrets. I chose to feel that the spook or God Shiva or whatever you want to call it spoke to me directly.

Yes, I sat in class and took the whippings. The lessons spoken in public while the truth and depth was known in private by means of contratsing the stage with the destination. But yet still I never really felt enfeebled or unworthy ... OK, OK OK just a bit but not enough to prevent me from being present. So yes, I was very alert about everything that I experienced as a BK. Perhaps I had a special boon from the divine because I needed to be raised from such a depth of 'sin and degradation' don't even ask (hahahahah).

So if I want to play a game and go see if the spook said anything in the Murli that might be shoehorned into anything i chose to make it fit into that is my right. And I do not see it as a contradiction.

Phew, ex-l did ask for me to share a bit if uselessness about how it was for onthor as a B. But the season has changed and so I wonder what next will I see in this great game of life. Bring it on for I will do my best to learn, numberwise according to my fortune. Fortune the nature of which even I don't know because it seems to be an ever unfolding thing about which it has been said, "seek and ye shall find".

Peace

onthor
ex-l wrote:I suppose there is a subtle issue to be raised here ...

I hear you ex-l.
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How ”ex” is any ex-BK?

Post23 Nov 2016

Onthor, I was not being critical, was suggesting another way to look. I am adding to your comments, not arguing or debating with you. It’s ”and” not ”but”. Adding a different perspective rather than agreeing or disagreeing

Just as it's the hole in the doughnut that makes it a doughnut, so too an art teacher generally goes through exercises with students - to outline the negative space around the objects rather than trying to draw the objects.

Composing a shot in photography is often about what is excluded from the frame, in space and in time (e.g. so when you see a tabloid headline of a ”violent demonstration" with one photo of protestors & police maybe one with truncheon raised, you know that, almost by definition, this was an isolated incident, in every sense of the word. Tempers may have flared for one second by one protestor at one policeman. The thousands of others there over many hours didn’t do anything ‘newsworthy’ - a.k.a. a (pun intended) beat-up!

In Christian mysticism, there is what’s called the ”via negativa” finding ”truth" by means of elimination - light defined by darkness, truth is whats not false etc. In Vedantic yogic practice, it's the whole ”neti neti” approach that gets you beyond the traps of mundane ”is-ness". In Buddhism, it's anitya/anicca (impermanece fo all things) and in mahayana its corollary ”sunyata” (empty of independent being, all apparent things are co-dependent).

What the BKs are really about is what’s not said, what’s out of frame.
ex-l wrote:It’d be interesting to know how many folk 'just move on' versus how many linger licking their wounds. And then there are the "demi-BKs" who remain friendly and drop in and out of BKism or their local centres.

As has been discussed on forum, often how ”ex” a BK someone is depends on how ”in” they were and what they did when they decided to ”ex” it.

Those who were involved with deep intellectual commitment will tend to go through battles to make an intellectual realignment. Those who were involved for love, friendship or community who find that outside the BKs will easily slide over. Those who don’t finds that outside BKs or not satisfactorily, will keep returning, as per ex-l’s examples.

Posts on site have compared the 7 stages of grieving to the stages of dying as a BK. It's not a bad checklist or touchstone as to how much BK-ism was your life and how much it meant to you, and whether it still has some life or has truly died.

Some of these are more prominent than others for different people, and the order may vary slightly, after all, we are not talking about the actual death of a loved one, it's a phase of life continuing (except for those who feel so trapped by the ”old skin” they are impelled to suicide).

For me, #1 lasted a long while and I still considered myself a ”fringe” BK, I went through 2-5 quickly because I actively engaged in #6 - working through, reconstructing a new paradigm. I think this is where many leaving then backslide, as the BK paradigm is already ‘understood’ and can be compromised (reconstructed, equivocated) enough to stay unchallenged so the person is only kind of BK, kind of ex-BK. The retort is ”don't label me” .
THE SEVEN STAGES OF GRIEF
    1. SHOCK & DENIAL
    2. PAIN & GUILT
    3. ANGER & BARGAINING
    4. DEPRESSION, REFLECTION, LONELINESS
    5. THE UPWARD TURN
    6. RECONSTRUCTION & WORKING THROUGH
    7. ACCEPTANCE & HOPE
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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post23 Nov 2016

onthor did not wrote:... Hi Pinkpanther, I have also read some of your other contributions and so have gained a bit more of an insight into your experience and the motivations for your 'caring'.

Thank you for your various feedback on my posts elsewhere.

hi ex-l I do not consciously attribute my present 'stage' (another BK implanted/hijacked word) to any of those...but am still thinking about it.
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Re: How ”ex” is any ex-BK?

Post23 Nov 2016

THE SEVEN STAGES OF GRIEF
    1. SHOCK & DENIAL
    2. PAIN & GUILT
    3. ANGER & BARGAINING
    4. DEPRESSION, REFLECTION, LONELINESS
    5. THE UPWARD TURN
    6. RECONSTRUCTION & WORKING THROUGH
    7. ACCEPTANCE & HOPE

Where does tedium (absolute boredom) and revulsion fit it ... the upward turn?

I suppose the Kirpalani Klan would pitch "tedium" as peaceless (only to be cured by MORE Yoga!) and "revulsion" as extreme body consciousness ... evidence of the souls unsuitability for The Spiritual Path™ (the BKs considering they have the final monopoly on spiritual development).

The BKs come up with the most awful brain farts for our dissent and rejection, e.g. everything from we being "demons" to "merely 'playing our role accurately each Kalpa'". I suppose that puts them in "1. Shock and Denial".

Onthor, do you have any new found ambitions to conquer the world ... or are you leaving that to Dadi Janki, Donald Trump and the Illuminati?
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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post23 Nov 2016

Hahahahaha ex-l rocks da ramparts :) ... As far as this platform is concerned I am on a self imposed restraint order insofar as UN/BK conjecture is concerned for I don't think that many BK's or even ex-BK's are ready for deep questions of that august body just yet :D and I don't want to be slung off the site.

BTW I have now come around to full acceptance of the Admin revision of this topic title because with "Onvalianthorwatch" as the first word I might be able to get away with all manner of off-topicality under the guise of it pertaining to the new order of my life post BK.

So, watch this space you never know what might turn up. But anyway, you all can ask your own questions and do your own research on why the BKs (and their ilk) courting the UN (it works in the other drection as well) might be of some consequence to one's choice of worship-worthy deity.

However, I think I already linked to some UNformation which might cause one to ask whether the NWO Religion might well be a glorious kind of worldwide non-religious movement. While I don't know what the BK's will think of that, I do seem to recall it said in the Murli that in the Golden Age there is a perfect Religio-Political system so maybe they will be abe to shoehorn BKism into that system also.

Ah well I can hear strains of the Fatback Band singing 'Is this the Future' in my head ... hey Brother can you spare a dime, I do not wanna end up doing time... (and sometime later on) You can cancel the future!

regards

onthor
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ex-l

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Re: Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post23 Nov 2016

onthor wrote:I don't think that many BK's or even ex-BK's are ready for deep questions of that august body just yet :D and I don't want to be slung off the site.


The true sign that you have finally erased any BK indoctrination is that you stop referring to the BKs and BK's.

There is an old story about a silent guru and a seeker seeking god and enlightenment, who kept bothers the guru for answers. This was in the old days (it's an old joke) when one had to write letters, stamp them, and post them.

Perhaps, for our purposes, the guru is still sitting on the top of some Himalayan mountain complaining about poor connectivity and slow download.

Anyway, the seeker kept writing and writing about how he best find god until eventually he got an answer back from the guru.

It read ... "Start by stick your stamps on straight and in the corner".

Now, that may or may not be funny, but think about it ... there's a deep and inner meaning I think is still as apt to us today as it is to the BK, in whatever we are doing. What do you think that is?

Forget about the New World Order ... start by sticking your apostrophes ... and not "apostrophe's" ... in the right place.

Trust me, it's another awful habit the BK's™ ingrained into you. They appear to have confused forming possiveness with forming attachments ... and demonstrate their own, and their own ignorance of the ways of the world.
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Onvalianthorwatch - BKs, the UN and the New World Order

Post23 Nov 2016

OK ex-l I consider myself suitably apostrophyzed (i do love randomly mangling the language. I guess it is the rebel in me exercising full possiveness ). Anyway my excuse is that since leaving I've not yet had any remedial therapy for that ailment and so I remain one of the uneducated mothers that Baba talks about in the Murli. See no apostrophyzation that time, although my PinkPanther pal might be waggling a warning finger at me as I once again reference the holy daily word.

ex-l you will have to unpack that because it went right over my head. If it was about the stamp I could hazard a guess and opine that some of us don't choose which of their OCD afflictions to display in public. But that would be a blind guess.

I do hope that am not letting the website down on account of my not being serious and scholarly about my BK related matters all of the time.
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