Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

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sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

Dr. Emoto's experiment on different crystalline structures of water.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

Pink Panther wrote:It seems you do not believe that the BK organisation’s teachings come from God, as they claim and as is stated in the Murli. Either that or you consider God is wrong and you are right, or God is lying.

I feel both during Sakar Murli and Avyakt Murli Brahma Baba receives messages from ShivBaba and he speaks based on his interpretation, i.e. we never know what words are spoken by ShivBaba and what words are spoken by the Chariot Brahma Baba. Some even say Brahma Baba and Shiv Baba are the same & Shiv Baba is the 'anadi' - eternal stage of brahmababa but let's go with the Murli that Shiv Baba is a different entity from brahmababa.

In each birth we have one astral body tied to our physical body which is similar in image but is made up of light (here memories/sanskars present in the soul due to actions performed in past births are different from the astral body of one birth). Our subconscious mind has all memories of past lives which people access in past life regression therapies but our astral body is about mission in one particular birth and the memories and energies associated with that one birth.

Everyone thinks, even non-bks, that doesn't mean they do not have a subtle body. Most likely they may not access brahmapuri unless they are initiated into BKs, so Brahma Baba's astral body has limited knowledge of Hindu scriptures and folklore and interprets the ShivBaba's messages accordingly. Just because Brahma Baba's interpretation being wrong, that doesn't mean ShivBaba has lied ... Baba says children are born purely without entering into vices, lust is a vice but the biological precess of conception is not a vice if it is done in a soul conscious stage.

I think Brahma Baba misinterpreted 'purity' as no physical contact.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016


Coincidentally, I came across this now. This may answer about Avyakt Brahma Baba

Someone has said that the soul of Brahma Baba might have actually taken birth, like the souls of Mama, Dadis & even I felt, so but the Murli says Brahma Baba's soul stays in Avyakt vatan in Avyakt sharir and will take birth only in the end of confluence as as Krishna.

I even feel ShivBaba soul also has taken birth .. there is no one entity called god - there is universal divine energy and we all receive it.

Our ancestors' astal bodies, or sometimes their thought created bodies like angels and godesses created in bkism, channel to enlighten us. In Sirius dictations also, it is mentioned that souls some of the channeled entities have taken birth and are living their physical lives. In bkism, also prakashmani Dadi is channeled sometimes whereas officially she has taken birth as a boy in India and going to school.

Sandeshi Sisters (trance messengers) see the emerged form of Mama, Dadis in sukshmvatan/Avyakt vatan in the same bodily form that they saw when they were alive, the only difference being they are made up of light not physical five elements. In sirius site, the ascended masters talk about contemporary times, i.e. they analyse the present day situations with their past life perceptions ... even Avyakt BapDada does so.

God never lies ... we all are divine ... but interacts with each other based on our perceptions and the wisdom given to us by others which is, again, based on their perception. No one wants to misguide others ... just that their truth is based on their experiences, perceptions, perspectives, insights and attitudes.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

Sukshie,

Are you conscious that largely all you are doing is repeating exactly how the BKs have indoctrinated you ... but also voicing entirely contradictory feelings, e.g. you claim BKism - which only started after 1955 - is the mother of all other religions, which started 2 or 3,000 years before it ... while at the same time say you don't believe in the 5,000 Year Cycle.

How can the mother be born after the child?

Also, it is a pure BKism to say something like "BKism has a lot of depth which has not been churned yet".

Honestly? BKism is kindergarten school level simple. There's nothing in it but a load of impossible and unlikely narcissistic claims (how great the BKs, how bad non-BKs), contradictions and ambiguities.

You can stare at a grain of sand for 50 years and have all sorts of weird, trippy, trance like experiences - largely because you are denying yourself *other* experiences and in such circumstances the mind goes into overdrive or blurs out. The same works with BKism.

The "Knowledge" is dumb and extreme limited. Removing all the praises, manipulations and repetition, you could pretty much write down all the informative statements in the Murlis in a single essay (and most of the "facts" are unprovable).

It is hypnotically repetitive and, combined with trance state induced by so called BK Raj Yoga, brainwashes us through repetition.

It conditions us within a very small mental world which the BK leaders then utterly control and by limiting and controlling our thoughts, limit and control our lives.

The first thing that jumps out at me about that BK Sister you lived with confirms our theories that in many cases the BK exploit individuals who have had bad family experiences by offer an alternative "family" environment and a false personality which the individual can wear as a mask over their real identity, avoiding any real issues they cannot resolve. In her case, the traumatic death of her Father.

Your account of becoming brainwashed or conditioned by her influence is just a nature human tendency, especially of a younger/subordinate one to an elder/dominant one.

Have you read up about "Stockholm Syndrome" and how it works? The interesting thing is, a lot of good science has been done in these areas to give up reliable insight into how these things work.

Your core "Operating System" ... aspects of your sub-conscious mind ... appears to have been overwritten by the BKs and formed around BKism. You really need to question it, check the code and delete and remove what is not true or congruent with reality and the needs of your current community/environment.

The BKism Operating System really only works in the BK world. BK operators are not given and do not even have a complete picture of the BK Operating System, never mind the real world. It is like you are downgraded from being a personal computer to a simple terminal with limited functions; don't think, don't question, repeat, make chapattis, bow to Dadis etc.

You need to step back and really look at and see BKism as a whole and its place in the world, not get stuck inside its code.

Example, the BK Baba/Murlis teach that procreation in the Golden/Silver Age will take place by the power of the mind (he also said through tears like a peacock ... although peacocks don't procreate through tears). The idea that procreation in the Golden/Silver Age happens through normal procedures entered very recently and you will have read that someone reported even Gulzar hinted that she believed so. Therefore you've sort of adopted that either directly or indirectly.

But does the whole really make sense?

Example; for 900,000 deities to exist at the start of the Golden Age in 2036, 1,800,000 people ... BK followers ... are going to have to have penetrative sex and ejaculate in order to get the female pregnant and then they are going to have to "cook" the foetus for 9 months. You know how to do this.

Furthermore, those 900,000 mothers are going to have to be of child bearing age, say 20 to 30 and fertile.

Are there 900,000 BK Sisters between 20 and 30 ... and is there an equal match of Brothers and Sisters?

No, absolutely not.

Are they all likely to conceive at the first attempt?

No, absolutely not.

Are all the feotuses likely to be born (miscarriages), and born without birth defects?

No, absolutely not ... we have reliable statistics about this.

Are some of those BKs like to be homosexual or impotent.

Yes, absolutely ... we have reliable statistics about this too.

Therefore, at the very least, there's going to have to be some ridiculously *huge* orgies (sex parties) up in Mount Abu for a few years followed by the costs and efforts of child rearing ... which you also know about.

Forget the practical building of the Golden Age with nuclear power sources and flying machines we don't know how to make yet ... does that sound in anyway practical to you?

Or does it all just sound like a fairy story which is made up - and constantly added to - to control people?
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

Pink Panther wrote:It seems you do not believe that the BK organisation’s teachings come from God, as they claim and as is stated in the Murli. Either that or you consider God is wrong and you are right, or God is lying.

Can an Age of Truth be built out of lies?

Sukh, you are an engineer.

OK, you must have emotional needs and require some escapism from ordinary life etc - as we all do - but you should know the basics of scientific method, and the value of professional integrity. The BKs have none - which is even worse in a "spiritual", so claimed "Godly" environment. You should not give up yours. Anyone claiming to be Godly should have even higher standards than non-BK "Shudras".

I'd like to break this down for you to in order to try and re-invigorate your quality of discernment.

Firstly, the late "Dr Emoto" wasn't a doctor. He did not have medical or scientific qualifications. At that point, your alarm bells should start ringing.

His "degree" was from a diploma mill in India, i.e. a bogus operation where you make up and buy an education qualification. He falsely advertised himself ... like the BKs calling themselves a "University". At that point, your alarm bells should start ringing twice.

He registered his name as a trademark in 40 countries. At that point, your alarm bells should fall off the wall and die with exhaustion from ringing. (Real scientists don't trademark their name to sell their products ... who on earth does?).

Emoto and his supporters refused to redo the experiment with proper double-blind conditions, even when offered a million dollars if it prove to be true.

His primarily interest was in selling books, promoting expensive seminars and selling overpriced water. Real science got in the way of that ... we can discuss why in detail if you want.

I am sorry to say this but, in short, he was just another cultist, playing the same game as the BKs, selling "woo" to naive Japanese women (who have this thing about "peace"), and then New Agers. He was made famous, and his career given a boost, by the "What the Bleep do we Know?" movie, which the BKs got all excited about (now he was a VIP!) but his art - as pretty as it was - wasn't science.

For the BKs, it was a case of "birds of a feather flocking together". Two frauds or con artists flattering and supporting each other to dupe the audiences.

A case of confirmation bias.

There was a real professor Emeritus William Tiller (Stanford University) featured in What the Bleep. After the film’s release, he pointed out it is extremely easy to manipulate the crystalline structure of water. He wrote that in Dr. Emoto’s experiments the supercooling was neither controlled nor measured, a necessary requirement to be fulfilled if one wanted to prove that it was the new factor of specific human intention that was causative. His experimental protocols were so lacking as to be unrepeatable. Even the most basic attempts at scientific controls were absent. He would not reveal his procedures and the choices of images he chose were done so entirely subjectively.

Not that there's anything wrong with selling books of pretty pictures, poetic ideas (hado, meaning 'rhymes with shadow'). and promoting world peace ... unless, for example, it's exploiting people who believe it might cure cancer etc ... but it ain't science and does not prove a thing.

He was there to sell books and promote himself. What the BKs were doing were attempting to exploit pseudoscience to re-affirm their "woo".
"In my lectures, I talk about how water and water crystals are 10 percent goodness, 10 percent evil, and the rest — 80 percent — is opportunist. When the 10 percent that is goodness and the 10 percent that is badness in water crystals fight, then the 10 percent that is goodness wins and overpowers evilness. So, if the 10 percent of goodness would carry past that fight to the 80 percent that is opportunist, than the 80 percent will follow the goodness, not the badness. Likewise, 10 percent of people are positive and believe in this, 10 percent are skeptical, and the other 80 percent are looking to see who wins!"

To do science, you start with an observation, and then form a hypothesis, then test it trying to break it; and if the testing bears up under scrutiny, and the experiments are reproducible, then we reach the point of having an official scientific theory.

"10% Good, 10% evil and 80% opportunistic water" is by no means a scientific claim or statement. It's mad. It's mental illness.

We need to learn to read such signs and not be sucked in by them and those who exploit them.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

sukshmbindu wrote:I feel both during Sakar Murli and Avyakt Murli brahmababa receives messages from ShivBaba and he speaks based on his interpretation ..

That's also just what the BKs tell you.

It's a patch they stick on top when the "balloon" in more clever followers' minds starts to leak air.

It goes, "If someone notices an error or contradiction, then just blame Lekhraj Kirpalani".

Before they developed that excuse, they used to say everything Lekhraj Kirpalani says is Shrimat. Even if it is wrong it does not matter, if you believe it/follow it, there will be no karma etc (which was borrowed directly from Bhakti).

This is how they work ... they pump people's balloons up and then when they start to leak (doubts, critical thinking, accurate observations) they patch, patch, patch to stop the balloons from leaking until their subjects/followers stop and submit. Then they share the patches with other BK teachers, so they can stop others balloons from leaking and control their followers.

They call them yuktis ... tricks in an other word.

You are also inventing new patches too, or borrowing them from other place, like these other spirit mediums. The BKs will consider them and may adopt some. That is the way it works.

I see Pink Panther's point.

What you are saying is that you or your understanding is superior to Lekhraj Kirpalani's. You are making excuses for their god spirit's failings.
sukshmbindu wrote:No one wants to misguide others ... just that their truth is based on their experiences, perceptions, perspectives, insights and attitudes.

From experience, I disagree. Believe me, it is some's sanskars to misguide others and many make an art and living out of it. Some even misguide others through others, e.g. the person misguiding you - like the BK Sister - was misguided themselves.

They may have believe they were being sincere ... but "sincerely" misguided. Actually deliberately misguided and conditioned to misguide others, like a robot.

Part of the BK Operating System to to misguide others to believe what is not true.

When or how often have you ever heard Lekhraj Kirpalani, their god spirit or even leaders voice doubt about their perceptions or state that their perceptions are limited or wrong? Wouldn't a truly wise or enlightened being either be right, or humble enough to admit their limitations, or to encourage caution?

You're obviously thinking outside of the BK box. Taking experiment steps outside of it and "testing other waters". Congratulations on that ... but please be brave and keep going further.

I think I see you like a chick, tapping away and breaking the hard eggshell that the BKs wrapped you up in so that you can free yourself and walk on your own, stretch your own wings and spiritually evolve.

BKism was just a dream you had inside the egg.

Do you know the story of the cuckoo bird and the nest? The BKs don't just steal other families' nests (homes), they steal other families' "eggs" too. Their children. They do it because they cannot have their own and it save them time, money and energy.

I know because I was one, like you.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

BKs don't give birth to Golden Age souls, non-bks, i.e. the 'Advance Party' souls like Mama, Dadi prakashmani do, i.e. BKs who have died and are born to non-bks give birth to Golden Age souls and it is a viceless birth. In Golden Age neither bkism nor any other religion is practised only 'soul consciousness' exists. No worship no meditation only merry.

Just because our intellectual mind doesn't agree, we cannot call others' beliefs as superstition ... why not attempt to understand the underlying mechanism?

I almost came to a conclusion that different entities (angels, dieties, gods, goddesses, even evil spirits) are not necessarily living souls but thought forms emitted by souls (not necessarily by a single soul but sometimes even a single soul) that vibrate at a particular level, i.e. in a way they are windows/doors connecting to different astral layers and invoking them through pictures/mantras/thoughts channels their energy into the surroundings and souls vibrating in similar frequency resonate with that energy and an amplified/magnified effect is seen (can be both constructive or destructive). ... In golden and silver ages, no one vibrates with lower frequencies so no negative events are manifested.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post28 Dec 2016

sukshmbindu wrote:BKs don't give birth to Golden Age souls, non-bks, i.e. the 'Advance Party' souls like Mama, Dadi prakashmani do ...

So have there been 1,800,000 BK to become dead and re-born BKs. If Mama died in 1965, she must be more than 50 now. Can she still give birth at 50 odd?

You see how it all keeps falling apart.

I suppose you could say even if they just took one lesson they could be BK/Advance Party souls ... there's always a patch to fix a failure of logic. Another extension of the story ... like, they did not expect Mama or Lekhraj Kirpalani to die. In fact, it said he/she would be there until the end ... but they died so they had to make up another story to fix that.

Please remember though, the remaining Sakar Murlis are supposed to be Lekhraj Kirpalani at "near perfection". Not just his perfection but the most perfect of all human beings. And the Avyakt Murlis are suppose to be him having reached perfection.

They may be sweet and loving for those who like that ... but they are not very deep and they were still full of unanswered questions, rambling, repetition, insensitive bigotry etc.
Just because our intellectual mind doesn't agree, we cannot call others' beliefs as superstition

We can if they are.

With Mr Emoto, for example, there is no underlying theory but there are underlying social and economical contexts.

Why would a "scientist" lie about his qualifications and call himself "Doctor" when he wasn't? The simple answer, to fool those too naive to check out his qualifications. Someone who fill fake and exaggerate their qualifications, are likely to fake and exaggerate their findings.

I am Sir Shri Shri Jagat Guru Raj Imam Ameer Doctor Professor ex-l MA, ICS, PLC therefore you can believe everything I tell you ... would you?

There's are established principles in science. One is "if there is no theory, there are no results", the other is reproducibility. If it cannot be reproduced, it does not count.

I would not say his work is superstitious, I'd say it was more poetic ... it's art rather than science.
I almost came to a conclusion that different entities (angels, dieties, gods, goddesses, even evil spirits) are not necessarily living souls but thought forms emitted by souls ...

That seems reasonable to me.

Some could be, others less likely to be so. I would accept there are still mysteries in this world.

If Lekhraj Kirpalani is to be crown Narayan aged around 35 years old, then he must have been born around 2001 and be alive today, aged 15 ... so who or what is entering Gulzar?

Ditto, classical spiritualist (and it comes up in some Buddhisms and Hinduism) have the theory that there many different realms at different "vibrational" levels, both higher and lower, and although it is possible for mediums from this world to speak to the world above and below ... it become increasingly difficult as the worlds become higher and higher.

The same is true of science and philosophy.

GuptaRati 6666

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post29 Dec 2016

Pink, thank you for your clarification.

I would add that if the blind yogi was more advanced on his path he would have been able to pick up the dangers of the flood. In setting up camp, if he were very in tuned with nature, his highly developed senses would have have forewarned him of the dangers or risks associated with having a camp set up in a gully.

Being able to anticipate danger and avoiding it is a skill martial artists master called haragi. I recalled about 30 years or less attending a black belt examination conducted by Master Teriuki Okazaki, 10 Dan. At the time he was 8 th Dan. At the end of the examination, he gathered us together and shared with use some of his wisdom of budo. He told us that the best martial artist is the one who never gets into a combat situation because of being skilled in haragi.

The power of haragi was given center stage in Eric Van LosBader's fictional series on Nicholas Lanier, a westerner who became a ninja master. Several months ago, Errol, on his face book page, recounted his experience of avoiding the bombing that occurred in the Chelsea area of New York City. His was not luck. Was it due to his years of meditation or his years of practicing budo? The question may best be answered by a randomized controlled experiment.

I must apologize for one error on my post of the sub-branches of raj Yoga. The Yoga of equanimity is samatvam Yoga. We should also never forget that one of the most ancient texts on Yoga is the Bhagvad Gita.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post29 Dec 2016

I think I would include a "way", like good martial arts, in the same category as a Yoga.

I wonder though if we are making too much of all these yogas and if they have not also been changed and categorised or formalised far more strictly than they originally were.

For example, we know that Hatha Yoga as we know it now is a relatively modern system and originally wasn't to systematised.

Sukhshi rolled off the usual BK version of all the yogas that BK Raja Yoga is suppose to surplant. I'd guess that only goes back as far as Jagdish Chandler who was their great systematiser of information giving form to something that had very little.

But it's just marketing speel. The BKs knew/know jack all about other yogas.

All they had was the audacity to claim theirs was what it wasn't (Raja Yoga being entirely different) because it was the best name ... and to turn a lie of selling Raja Yoga into a business.

I am sorry if I am harsh sukh but that's really the way it is. Lekhraj Kirpalani and the BKs knew nothing of Raja Yoga. It just fitted in nicely with his obsession with royalty and being the best. It appeals to the ego which wants to fell the most important.

It's taken years of us banging on the side of their ship to get them to even start steering it towards calling it "BK Raja Yoga".
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human being

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post29 Dec 2016

OK sukshm, I will be honest with you, and this is my final post at least on this thread if not on this forum.

I think you have a few psychological issues and I would advice you to befriend a good counselor (you know how it works in India;)). Discuss with him or her your opinions honestly, your worldview etc and try to listen without using too much Gyan "that he is a new soul and his time hasn't come etc". You are good at listening others, I think. Please follow my advice. I would request you again, as your BK knowledge is quite weak and what you have is a hotch-potch of your own ideas, and no matter how sweet it is at the end of the day, it is delusion and can harm your child or other living beings around you; emotionally or psychologically.

From Pink, Gupta rati and to some extent ex-l, I have a question. What exactly is the purpose of this website?

To discuss what exactly is wrong with BKs and how to help people save them from harmful ideologies like that, or to basically cry and throw insults on Hinduism as a religion, and somehow link it to the problems of this cult, and thereby malign the entire Indian race, and talk continuously how silly things like Yoga, Bhakti etc are, and therefore feel good like a bunch of teenagers trying to show each other off? Even if it sounds like I am taking an extreme view of your views, I have observed a general lack of understanding of pretty much all Indian religions/spiritual practices and, in most cases, your understanding is bordering on the verge of malicious propaganda/utter delusion.

If the purpose of this website is to only prove that the contribution of philosophies like Yoga, tantra, Bhakti etc is zero in the progress of this world, and then say how silly the Indians have been, I wish you luck that. You remain happy for the path you have chosen, and would say good bye to you and this forum.

I had thought about writing a series of articles to help people cope with the after effects of this organisation but I can do that else where as you guys seem to be more interested in telling even about things of which you have no knowledge and, more importantly, no experience ... with a cock-sure and condescending tone.

PS: Both martial arts as well as Buddhism originated in India only, and so did the concepts of meditation which is an improper word to even describe the process, as it is a part of a language which is of very recent origin and culture which never had this practice in the first place, which is fine for me.

The words like Zen masters and yogis and the different images they make in the minds of people from the West which have had a very organised pyramidical/line structure and is actually the birth place of organised religion (which is more politics in the name of fear of GOD than spiritual upliftment of the masses) owes more to Hollywood and the stereotyping which your media has done over the years.

When Britishers colonized this part of land, i.e the Orient, they lunched a PR blitzkrieg giving entirely wrong picture about society, culture and so called religions like Budhhism, Jainism, Sikhism, Taoism etc and tried to discredit and distort the original Hinduism ... which is not a religion at all ... and all these boundaries between above mentioned practices are of very recent origin and among practising 'Hindus', which is less than 5% of so called registered Hindus, these boundaries are still pretty vague and often non-existent.

The point is, all this talk like whether Judo is better than Taekwondo (or Yogis vs martial artists vs Zen masters ;)) is done by amateurs on Youtube videos who have very little practise of both the games and are merely theorising like sukshmabindu here. Real fighters/'masters' have real respect for different styles as they have the wisdom to see the underlying similarities between both the sports.

We can make a discussion about spiritual practises/religion, or for any topic in general in a similar way. You can be an atheist, Christian etc and yet we cannot just co-exist but contribute to this forum making life easier for a lot of misguided people, or we can indulge in trolling and passing generalised comments about things which we haven't practiced in our lives and have read a few books on them at max, written by people who also never had an iota of personal experience; and, in some cases, were working with an agenda and can bash anything and everything like a bunch of old mother-in-laws.

You decide and please let me know.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post29 Dec 2016

Dear Brother humanbeing,

Firstly, I would explain to you my journey ...

ex-l has talked about 'Stockholm Syndrome'. Actually, I suffered emotional abuse at my workplace through some Seniors. Initially we were on very polite terms - then friendship - then utter chaos ... In 2009, I became schizophrenic but did not realise it ... actually, first one of our team mates got it and, after her, I got it. There was mistrust, back-stabbing, blame game ... it was a time of extreme emotional upheaval for the team ... each of us had a different emotional threshold level, so some were able to carry on with will power, while the vulnerable collapsed.

I was already a BK student by then ... what I observed was the day I read Murli I was able to handle the situation very smoothly but when I couldn't, I would feel vulnerable (this is not some imaginary stuff, it is what I experienced practically). My intellect was crippled and Baba's Murli was my saviour ...

During the same time, I lived with that BK Sister and her companionship worsened my state of mind ... I tried to follow one rule "obediance/haji" and it dumbed down my intellect (but I developed survival instincts) ... our team was dispersed due to operative reasons but even later my personality was the same. I attended an MBA interview but couldn't do well ... I had no hopes .. but the interviewer called my dad and said, "she has written a very good essay but was not at all assertive in interview ... she needs rest, take good care of her".

My dad got worried and called my reporting boss and explained my situation so he granted me 10 days leave. At home, my parents enquired about what all happened and attributed my personality change to BKs, and shifted me from the BK Sister's quarter to a ladies hostel, strictly prohibited me from going to BK classes and told me to eat outside food. My visits to the retreat centre and local centre decreased.

After ~ 2 months my boss and reporting boss called me to the meeting hall and said my performance was deteriorating and must improve. I contemplated and discussed with my parents and finally quit the job and returned to my hometown. My relatives advised my parents to consult a psychiatrist and we went. The doctor diagnosed my ailment as schizophrenia but I refused to take medication ... even after I quit the job, the ghosts of the incidents that took place there haunted me.

I recovered due to the change of place but it resurfaced in 2013. It was diagnosed as schizophrenia and I was hospitalised for ~12 days but I discontinued medication after being discharged from the psychiatric hospital ...

Again at the end of 2014, my parents noticed changes in my behaviour and I used to attend counselling once in a month.

I later got married in 2015 May, in 2016 April I had some strange visions (of Lord Ganesha speaking through a leaf of a money plant and a little Ganesha inside that Ganesha. I still remember that vision ... the next day I heard voices talk to me ... third day I became schizophrenic again. I used to call my husband and tell him not to drive on road since someone may kill him ... he became concerned, and he and my patents took me to psychiatrist ... but I said it was just some thought, I am OK, and I refused to take appointment so we returned home ...

Two days later, I became delusional that my parents would kill me ... I had panic attacks ... I became hysterical .. I called my husband he came from office so he and my parents admitted me in maternity hospital. It was the 8th month of my baby, there was a visiting psychiatrist there who diagnosed hysteria & schizophrenia .. I was under a strong dosage of medication. I stayed for ~15 days and went home with the baby. Later, the doctor reduced the dosage, we then took a second opinion and the second doctor further reduced the dosage. I am still on medication ... my family is very concerned about me and doesn't let me read any BK stuff online ... but I personally felt Murli helps me recover.

This site helped me a lot during my crisis, more than Murli and more than medication, and more than the counselling from the psychiatrist.

Thank you all for the posts.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post29 Dec 2016

About 'Stockholm Syndrome' mentioned by ex-l. I entirely relate to it since I never felt any hatred against the perpetuators of emotional violence. On the contrary, I felt & still feel a very deep bond with each of them ... strange but true (maybe this is because of the deep friendship that existed between us before the chaotic times, or maybe purely 'Stockholm Syndrome').

I came here to learn more about bkism ...

I did not, and still do not feel bkism was responsible for my illness, so never discussed it on this forum.

Brother humanbeing, how did you figure out about my illness, please explain.
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ex-l

ex-BK

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post30 Dec 2016

human being wrote:From Pink, Gupta rati and to some extent ex-l, I have a question. What exactly is the purpose of this website?

Well, humanbeing, congratulate yourself for hitting the nail on the head with regards sukshmbindu; and, sukshmbindu, congratulate yourself for surviving, remaining open minded, and being able to talk about your issues.

What are we here for? To do "chemistry" like this, to help individuals such as sukshmbindu and her family.

Human, you are, of course, very welcome to post your own corrections of critiques of "Westerners", "Westerners view of Hinduism", "Western interaction with India" or even any single individual on this forum ... but please start a new topic to do so. I'd like you to.

Ditto, your self-help survival tactics for ex- and exiting BKs. Please do so, that's also what we are here to do ... to document and store BK related insights.

You never know whose life it may save.

I try and frame my views within the context of Hinduism/Oriential religion as portrayed by the BKs (who, IMHO, know little to nothing about it).

Recently an ex-BK started a related conversion about Africa ... so I am looking forward to an "Africa versus India" fight over claims to have started martial arts, and "meditation".

Despite me being an Aryan White Supremacist (joke) ... and remember, "we" kicked Dravidan ass fair and square 3,000 years ago, and then again in the 1800s (second bad joke) ... I'll actually put my money on it all starting in Africa first (no joke at all).

How does the "out of Africa" evolution theory stick with Indians?

It may sound grandiose ... and I am not talking about sukshmbindu here ... but people have come back years afterwards and told us that this site saved their or someone's lives. Not everyone posts here, many just read. Fanning the flames of their minds to start thinking and questioning and getting back up to face life, shaking people up, making them laugh or even wind them up is part of what we do to try and shake them awake again ... even if every statement made is not always 100% correct for all time.

And sometimes we are gentle and understanding.

Secondly, please also realising that we are not selling anything, we are not promoting any religion, we are not pretending to be experts, we are all just finding our own way. But I think you'll find rajgupta has practised martial arts for a long time, Pink - even if you don't agree with his views (and I don't either, but that does not mean he wrong) - has actually studied and practised Buddhism and therapeutic related stuff to a professional level; and others that come and go also have their own specialities.

Personally, before BKism - which turned out to be a big mistake - I actually *started* out by studying spiritualism and even training to become a medium/healer (did not complete) and then Westernised hatha and Bhakti Yoga, and have lived in "The Orient" with Asians for years.

However, just to get back to sukshmbindu's far more important situation for one minute, having written "BKism turned out to be a big mistake" ... which I maintain it is and hence my caution for her ... I do recognise that for many adopting a cult persona, joining a cultic religion, and engaging in a relatively safe or calming environment that BKism on the outside can be ... can also be a life saver.

This is well recognised not in cultic studies. People adopt the "cultic mask" as a ready made personality, with ready made friends, in a ready made family at times of crisis often to escape from that which is making them most unhappy, or killing them mentally. Then behind the mask, they are able to work on themselves and make the changes that are necessary, after which they leave.

The only problem being, that cults often make it difficult to leave. If only the BKs offered a true ashram service without filling people's minds full of nonsense and encouraging dependency in their in order to exploit them.

From my point of view, in my tradition's language, I'd question whether sukshmbindu is actually what the doctor's diagnose ... or just a little too "psychically open", and not fully in control of that.

I'd like to split our conversation into stuff relating to her, and the other more theoretical or cultural stuff.

--

With regards to your sensitivity towards criticisms/idiocies about India, human being.

On a fairly regular basis over the years we have had individuals come forward who find it hard to accept such criticism ... in the same way, perhaps, that the Shiv Sena have a problem with "progressive" Indian movies and written works (joke ... I appreciate that you are not going to riot, and try and burn the server farm down like they might!).

All I can say on that is ... welcome to the fist fight. Stand up for your own views and put them to the test. Try and draw some conclusion or relate some connections to BKism. If someone's being an idiot, throw a few metaphorical punches.

You are aware about how critical BKism is/was about Hinduism, aren't you? I'd say that is a lot of Western BKs first introduction to it.

It's difficult for a goldfish to have an objective opinion about the water he or she is swimming in ... unless they've had the opportunity to taste other waters, or another fishbowl, for some of the time.

I am sorry but I don't even really know what you are specifically referring to here ... answer in new topic, please.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post30 Dec 2016

I think Stanford_prison_experiment is one way of describing what has gone wrong with our team in 2008 ... All of us were accopmlished engineers but somehow it out out into a 'control game' and ruined everything and everyone. I was trying to find a solution to such a situation to help someone else deal with it and also to help myself (Baba says, "be part of a solution not part of a problem" {'samasys swaroop nahi samadham swaroop bano'} & to find a preventive measure {'kaaran nahi nivaran bano'}). The holy grail I found as of now is solution: "ho'oponopono', preventive measure:'ho'oponopono".

When I was going through this, one BK Sister at BK retreat center advised me to consult some london visting BK psychiatrist and counsellor. I think his name was Dr. Girish (not sure) but I refused ...


But, to admit honestly, the support I received at the BK retreat centre and from other collegues at my office also helped me to a great extent to deal with my situation then.
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