Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

Probably in exactly the same way as reading a fairy story does to a child.

Have you had children yet? They find comfort and enjoy hearing their parents read the same, familiar fairy story to them over and over again ... or reading it themselves once they can. It's just the comfort of the familiar and escapism from things which cause distress, or stressful challenges.

In fact, most adults are just the same. Humans have a tendency to like the familiar. Someone who likes smoking ganga or looking pornography would say the same thing.

Scientifically, does that prove anything?

But the real question is, so what if it does ... where does it lead to?

Does it make India a better place ... does it feed the 3,000 children who die of hunger every day ... does it educate the 25% of women (or 38% of female Dalits) or 287 million or illiterate adults ... does it stop de-forestation ... etc etc etc.

You get the idea ...

Really honestly, how important are you and your feelings in the bigger picture? Is the most important thing in your life sitting on your butt doing nothing, as the BKs do, "feeling content"?

These groups, these spirits, exploit that self-centredness.

It works for the BKs because they are taught to believe that the whole world is going to go to hell and burn in the Nuclear War, and all suffering is the victims own fault.

It's not so admirable or importance for the rest of us. Perhaps you should be reading things that develop your mind, understanding and skills.

BKism is just an opiate.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

I did lot of churning about those ideas and wrote them, neither of you gave your opinion/critique about them ... just generic feedback ... still this forum has turned out to be a more or less blogsite to my ideas ..

Thank you all for that.

Many BKs, and many ”New Age” types and others with (let us call it) "strong self-belief" have the quality of narcissism. Narcissus was a mythological youth who was very beautiful and his greatest admirer was himself. Echo was a nymph who fell in love with Narcissus but could only repeat his own words back to him so she could only watch helplessly as he wasted away admiring his own reflection in a pool.

Others are not so much narcisistic but indulge in solipsism, in its secondary sense.

Reiki and many modalities do have a long tradition but in the modern world, most self-proclaimed reiki masters and other healers have little awareness of that tradition, but lots of awareness of marketing what little they have, as ex-l has pointed out. Not all, but most. The BKs are the same. They call their practice Raj Yoga, stealing the name shamelessly from Patanjali’s work, and saying they were first! They steal names, terms and images from everywhere, putting their own packaging on it but not taking the trouble to learn or provide the substance, yet congratulate themselves as the originators!

When we are young and not as educated as we should be, we hear of things marvellous, spiritual, idealistic then we believe the first ones who come along who use those words and blow their own trumpet.

I do not wish to be judgemental, I am merely signalling a warning, Sukhshumbindu. Most of us here have been through stages you are going through - we were all fooled to different extents and for different lengths of time. It's not all a waste, no lie succeeds unless it has some truth to build from.

All I suggest is that instead of big ambitions and high ideals, first achieve a series of smaller, basic ambitions with practical, visible results, ones that connect you and validate you to your family and community.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

To ex-l:

You speak very practically, but you almost always underestimate the power of thoughts ... thoughts are energy capsules and they create reality ... if we think positively our life becomes positive ... one more important aspect is consciousness, I think consciousness is the state of mind that creates & attracts different thought processes, if we develop an elevated level of consciousness we create and attract high quality of thoughts thereby creating high quality of life not just for ourselves but to our friends, family & relatives and also to the world in general ... we all are energy beings and BK Murli gives a parcel of elevated thoughts thereby increasing our consciousness level and elevating our vibrations. I beleive those promises of Golden Age, health wealth and happiness throughout The Cycle are not empty promises but will become reality to the beleivers.

To pink panther:

Whether you endorse bkism or not, it has indirectly contributed to this online forum and helped me understand bkism in light of many perceptions and perspectives ... we all have our freewill whether to practise it or not & I chose to believe in it. I would be very happy if you all beleive in it but its your freewill.

What's your story, how did you get introduced to it, were you a BK teacher after that, how many years did you practise and when, did you run a center or live in a center & why did you leave it ... you can be brief if you wish to but please explain your BK journey.

GuptaRati 6666

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

Hello sukshmbindu,

The ideas communicated to you by Pink and Ex-I are practical and helpful. I would add that there is an spiritual awakening that happens with BK Raj Yoga. However, the awakening is at an elementary level and many BKs, after the awakening, can spend decades trapped in the BK dogma and not advance much spiritually. The BKs do not have a monopoly on God, The Cycle, including Sat Yug and Treta, nor do they have a monopoly on The Knowledge of the soul.

It took me about 20-30 years to attain that which you seek. However, it did not all happen while I was a BK. In fact, Baap Dada had predicted that I would have left the court of Indra and become a leader of a similar organization. That has happened and though I am in the lime-light, I do not seek it out.

Humility an underestimated virtue is a power unto itself. I helps to keep the seeker grounded as the seeker climbs the highest peaks of spirituality and fords the most turbulent streams in life. I would add, absolute honesty is also required to maintain spiritual gifts and talents.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

sukshmbindu wrote:You speak very practically, but you almost always underestimate the power of thoughts ... thoughts are energy capsules and they create reality ... if we think positively our life becomes positive.

You say you believe in BKism and you repeat parts of it that you have heard and like, that are designed to seduce and hook you, but many of your beliefs and ambitions are actually entirely contrary to and against the advice of, or oppose BKism.

Therefore you really don't "believe in BKism" ... and, more importantly, cannot due to your living circumstances.

I think you should start by living within your life. Would I suggest throwing away your life and becoming a BK?

Well, firstly, they probably won't want you and even if they did, they'd just want to use you as a unpaid cook and cleaner. They'd prefer if you remain outside of the cult and bring money in, so they feed you "toli" both literally and metaphorically (sweet ideas, nice pictures) to keep you hanging on.

That is not a criticism, it's just an observation. I am trying to balance you with some realism, realism based on studies and experiences *within* the boxes you are looking at it.

Tell me, both have been studied scientifically by a number of different scientific traditions, which are more "powerful" ... the "power of thought", and the "power of teaching illiterate young women to read" or the "power of providing clean water and sanitation on infant mortality". And which is "more spiritual", sitting on your butt doing nothing but dreaming and feeling wonderful ... or uplifting the poor and weak, and saving human lives?

You are being seduced by pretty ideas, fantasies ... by the pretty wrapping on the box, the marketing ... into handing over your money, wasting your life, and doing nothing for the world around you.

Should not you learn from individuals who have opened the boxed and tried what is within? Who have watched generations come and go from the experiences?

I am not better than you or wiser, I am just older and have earned more experiences. There are few advantages to being older but one of them is having watching more of the cycles within society repeat.

It seems like the Indian middle classes are going through what the American middle classes were sold by the New Agey industry in the 1980s. Same class, same books, same ideas, same DVDs ... I predict the same results. Certainly, it's how the BKs are re-marketing themselves based on their experiences. They are borrowing styles and ideas the Western BKs have picked up from the Western New Age industry, and re-marketing them to individuals such as yourself.

To Pink Panther's suggestions, I'd like to add the archetypes of 'the Puer and the Senex'.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

Thank you both ex-l and guptarati6666. I definitely feel you are more wiser, hence hanging on here for your advices and versions of life in general and BK life in particular. In a way, I don't find anything wrong in Baba's Murli or the BK organisation and its policies. What's wrong in dedicating one's life to a goal of better tomorrow, a world of righteous and responsible self disciplined people? What is wrong in teaching positive thinking in the name if god? Poverty, poor sanitation, low infant mortality are effects and causes are negative thoughts and actions. bkism treats the roots of problem.

Also I agreed bkism doesn't preach physical service like in Christianity but I ask are you just preaching it or practising like mother theresa? If you are just preaching then you & the BKs are on same page and you are no more noble than them.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

sukshmbindu wrote:what's wrong in dedicating one's life to a goal of better tomorrow, a world of righteous and responsible self disciplined people ...

Do you not mean,
    "What's wrong in dedicating one's life to a goal of annihilating of 7 billion human beings via nuclear war; and the institution of a rigid, non-democratic caste bound theocracy for 2,500 years"?
You're only reading and repeating the advertising on the outside of the box. We've been on the inside of the box teaching it, even writing the advertisements for it and planning the advertising campaigns.

What you are repeating are just the hooks and bait they use to catch people like us. (Remember, we were hooked too and tasted what the hooks feels like when it goes in and when it comes out).

Do you really wish a terrible death to 7 billion human beings?

If you need reminding what BKism really means, have a look at pictures of hiroshima bomb survivors. I can quote you BK leaders like Jayanti Kirpalani saying, This is what I want".

Please remind me, I cannot remember you saying ... but you've never actually been a "full BK", have you? You've never actually really been inside the BK machine?

The other thing to do is look for the extent of the evidence to see if the BKs are actually achieving what they claim. You use words like "powerful", "positive" ... but what do they really mean ... quantify how powerful.

And, as the causes of poverty etc, ... you'll need to be more fundamental and specific than "negative thoughts".

"Thinking positive thoughts" might make people who write the books and audio tapes a little money, but it is not going to alleviate real world problems.

The BKs solutions are
    a) "drop the bomb on them" ... or
    b) "stand back and do nothing, and wait until they all murder each other" (civil war).

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

I must admit your posts are sublime and funny ... why do you repeat just one misunderstanding and be judgemental about BK philosophy? You always repeat it is end of world cult rather it is a cult that preaches transformation of 5 elements and souls through love and service.
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post02 Apr 2017

Because you are wrong about it, and I am right about it.

And I am right about it.

It seems like you are in denial about the most intrinsinc element of BKism ... which is why I asked you whether you had ever been *inside* the BKWSU, or were ever a proper BK? I am not discriminating against you, I am just trying to understand how you could be so confused about this issue.

If you are not just making fun, it is not unusual for individuals like you to be misled. It is what they teach their teachers to do. It is typical of the BKs that they allow outsiders, serviceable contacts souls, donors etc, to continue on believing what they want projecting, deliberately misleading victims and allowing them to cherry pick ideas they like and ignore what they don't ... until victims are hooked and commit when they are then forced to accept the real beliefs.

More to the point, I even remember when and why the BKs in the West started the deliberate re-marketing exercise of changing their *advertising campaign* ... not their real beliefs ... from using "Destruction" to "Transformation".

"Destruction" was bad for business in the West where people were more educated and the peace movement was anti-nuclear war and an embarassment to BKs, so the word - not the idea - was changed to "Transformation". It is a lie.

BKism is, and has always been, a cult that preaches the death of 7 billion human beings through a non-optional Nuclear War, civil wars and natural disasters culminating in the sinking of all other continents except for India (... and a few magical islands where overseas BK centres used to be). It was OK for ignorant, uneducated nationalistic Indians because India was 'magically' going to be OK (they were ignorant of the scale of effects a nuclear war would have on the world). Western "Yadavas" were just going to conveniently kill themselves off ... followed by the BKs taking over the Indian government and all non-BK Indians slaughtering each other off in civil war.

Otherwise, how to you explain the shrinkage of population to just 900,000?

BKism has no explaination for the "transformation of 5 elements", nevermind the periodic table of 118 elements, and has virtual zero effect on them. Its best explanation for how they would get rid of the 1,000,000,000 corpses left lying across India before the Golden Age in 2036 was that it would rain heavily and they would be washed away!

You are mistaking the advertising on the 'outside of the box', for the contents on the 'inside of the box'.

"Service" to the BKs means self-promotion.

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

to guptrati6666: please tell ur BK journey and later journey.. i am interested to know ur path to enlightenment..

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

to guptrati6666:

Please tell your BK journey and later journey ... I am interested to know your path to enlightenment.

to ex-l:

I feel that the world Destruction Brahma Baba saw in visions in ~1932/1936 was about World War II. In my opinion, World War III will never happen ... neither would Destruction happen ... those visions had a great role for Brahma Baba inspiring feelings of renunciation ... but not just that he also had visions of souls coming from Soul World and taking birth as dieties - why do you never mention it? You conveniently forget all good in bkism and project the only misunderstanding about how Golden Age will start and how iron age would end. It would be a gradual transition ranging over a span of 100 years of Confluence Age with 50 years in iron age and 50 years in Golden Age, so numberswise we are in Golden Age already. Don't you feel the world is becoming more friendly and loving day by day? That is an indication of advent of Golden Age.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

Don't you feel the world is becoming more friendly and loving day by day? That is an indication of advent of Golden Age.

Can the world be in a Golden Age that you envisage with the population of 7 billion as we are today, and growing?

If you think so, then you are saying that God (the BK god) is either a liar or seriously mistaken - so what kind of God is that?

As ex-l has repeatedly pointed out, the foundation of BKism, BK so-called "Gyan", is that this world and all the 7 billion human lives and all the countless animals in this kali yuga must finish before Golden Age can exist, for they (we) are body conscious and vicious (full of vices), and such body conscious people cannot be there in Sat Yuga.

So, firstly, if that is the actual truth, and you do not believe that, then you do not believe in the BK god, and you are merely going along for the ‘feelgood’ ride.

Secondly, if that is the actual truth, that all must die so the ”deities” can live in their hermetically sealed ”pure” world, then this god is teaching a practice to bring about the death of billions of people and trillions of animals & plants.

What kind of god is this you’ve chosen to tolerate?
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

Suksh, please consider what Pink Panther is saying to you and answer the questions. They were involved in BKism from the 1970s and had many one to one, personal, question and answer meetings with BapDada in a way that is unthinkable now.

What you are also saying, in essence, in you are right and the BK god is wrong.

That's not "bad". You may well be more right. So why invest your time and energy in a god that is wrong?

An honest, kindly question ... is there no one in your life who speaks sweetly to you, e.g. your mother and Father, your husband and so on? Is that the appeal?

How are you getting on at home and with your husband (I think I remember you said you live with your "in-laws")?

sukshmbindu

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

u all speak sweetly to me so i like u all, but BK BapDada is the sweetest and wise so i like his Murlis..he is like a mentor to me.. i like BapDada this doesn't mean i cannot like friends & family..
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ex-l

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Re: Other modalities of meditations/philosophies you like

Post03 Apr 2017

Well then, I am afraid you are just like one of the 100,000s of women who fell in love with a Hitler, or a Stalin, before they reached power ... and wreaked their terror on the world. (I am invoking Godwin's Law at this point *).

Unfortunately, I am not sure if Indians fully understand the impact of WWII and characters such as those two, as it did not effect them and it has been a long time since they experience the "total war" and "scorched earth" that Lekhraj Kirpalani wrote about demanding the Viceroy and Military Marshalls of the world to brought about.

What are your answers to Pink Panther's questions?

* It's always bad form to make Hitler analogies. As per "Godwin's Law", it generally signifies an end of sensible conversation. The reason I am posting this picture, and it could the picture of any genocidal despot, it just to show the disconnection that goes in our minds between "feelings" and ultimate realities.

The gentleman in the right looks as sweet, shy and bashful as teenager meeting the young attractive women, and the young attractive women are clearly enamoured by him and thrilled at the meeting. And yet we know who he was and what he went on to conspire to.

For whatever reason, from the very beginning of the Brahma Kumari movement, Lekhraj Kirpalani expressed his feelings towards an impure despised humanity (who rejected him as being a God) as a desire to see it wiped off the face of the earth so he and his circle of young attractive women could enjoy heavenly delights, presumably uncriticised.

And yet those young attractive women loved him as their Father too. I am sure if I tried to argue with or warn them, they'd respond with exactly the same denial as Suksh here. It just goes to prove ...

"Every good girl loves a despotic sweetheart!"


I think, perhaps, it's a denial that is rooted in a deeply primitive and tribal place within us, such as our attraction and acceptance of the "strong man" or a strong leader in *our* tribe because he protects and defends us (never mind that he might just a killer to someone else's tribe).

Can any one else explain it?

Hitler_Blushing.jpg
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