BKWSU leadership accessibility

for measuring opinion on matters relating to their BKWSU experiences
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The top BKWSU leadership are extremely accessible to those at lower levels of the hierarchy?

Strongly agree
8
24%
Agree
1
3%
No opinion either way
0
No votes
Disagree
14
42%
Strongly disagree
10
30%
 
Total votes : 33

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ex-l

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BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post31 May 2008

From, Tao of the Traveller topic. In a recent academic paper published in the International Institute for Asian Studies Spring 2008 issue (click to download) it was stated;
IIAS wrote:... a key feature is that the top leadership are extremely accessible to those at lower levels of the hierarchy and indeed to ordinary members ... In that sense, they show all the characteristics of Servant Leadership ... a refusal to be treated as gurus or objects of reverence ...

On the basis of your experience with the BKWSU,

    do you agree with the statement that the top leadership are "extremely accessible to those at lower levels of the hierarchy"
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mbbhat

BK

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility and reverence

Post28 Jun 2008

BK top leaders are very humble and approachable. There is no guru types, nothing. We can meet anybody on request by giving right reason.
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chai bhai

BK

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility and reverence

Post28 Jun 2008

Hello. Yes, I have had the same experience. It is different when there are 20,000 people. Then, of course, it is not quite so easy. But still I have seen that if people really need to see Dadi, she will make the time to see him or her. I have had that experience myself. I have always been able to meet her. I just ask.
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bansy

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility and reverence

Post28 Jun 2008

The PBKs have given an email which is the email of their (PBK) Chariot of ShivBaba (Virendra Dev Dixit). So I suppose this means this email can accept messages from any language and the response could be longer if it is not English or Hindi ? Please correct if this supposition is incorrect.

    How about BKs (mbbhat or others ?) ...
    Do you have the email of BapDada ?
    Do you have an email of Dadi Janki ? Do you have an email of Dadi Ratanmohini ? etc
Well the latter two questions are not necessary, the first will suffice.

I think BapDada has sometimes talked about receiving emails during his BapDada meetings, how is this done ? If I send an email which is then resent to another, then how would that be in remembrance of Baba if I am in remembrance of the assistant instead ? OK, if my email does go to BapDada "direct inbox", will BapDada reply to me in his own writing ?
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hope1

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility and reverence

Post18 Jul 2008

There is an underlying problem in the question ... while I totally agree that the results must be skewed by poll problems, I also feel it is not sufficient to say "are they accessible?" The real question here is, "are they open to change and considering realities different to their own?". To which the answer is, a big NO.

The other question is, "will their attitude to you remain the same after you have raised critical issues?". To which the answer is, a massive NO. They will blacklist you and subtly undermine you.

You can talk until you are blue in the face, but it will make no difference, and only affect your standing. Honesty is not an acceptable policy ...
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admin

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post07 Aug 2008

Poll reset due to voting irregularities. Previous poll allowed multiple votes from same users.
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hope1

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post07 Aug 2008

Thanks for that! truth will now out ...
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ex-l

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post11 Aug 2008

If I write a letter in March, some of which contains very serious ethical or even legal matters and I have still not received a response by August ... AND they pay a lawyer to suggest that by ignoring its contents they have answered my enquiry ... then that suggest to me that what accessibility there exists is limited and conditional.

I agree with hope's comments. "Accessibility" is not the complete issue here. Its one thing to be available to play therapist, to listen to some follower's real or imagined problems and pronounce Shrimat ... but what about when their responsibility or accountability comes into question?

What would happen if the boot was on the other foot? If, say, I was a center-in-charge who had taken $10,000s of Dollars given to the Yagya and put it in my own name, and then I had employed a lawyer and expected them to speak to me through him? Would that be acceptable to them?

So, something like "are they open to change and considering realities different to their own?" would make a good next question.
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arjun

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post11 Aug 2008

"Here nobody’s lies or truth can remain hidden."

(Revised Sakar Murli dated 10.11.07, pg 3&4 published by BKs in Hindi, translated by a PBK)
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john morgan

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post11 Aug 2008

At the end of the day the only person accountable for anything I say or do is ? I am not a believer in bringing coals to the pit.
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ex-l

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post15 Aug 2008

Anyone who believes the leadership is accessible should read the ongoing topic legal matters. "Accessibility" would seem to me to be conditional to one's willingness to play a pre-subscribed role of a willing,needy and subservient follower to their beneficent yet unaccountable omnipotent power.

Please explain to us why;

    the BKWSU (UK) have employed a lawyer to justify the ignorance of perfectly reasonable correspondence on the basis that chief administrator of the BKWSU (UK), Janki Kripalani, cannot reply to letter if it was sent to her in India when she also acts as Global Chief; and why after 5 months, despite numerous chasing emails to both India and the UK, she has not replied yet.

    Or why the BKWSU refuses to provide copies of their constitution and by-laws; and why these are not freely available at all centers and on the internet.

    Or why the BKWSU refuses to provide copies of the channelled messages it teaches is God speaking to humanity (despite numerous reasonable requests from followers or the same God's regular assurance that "the Murlis" are not owned by anyone and can be made available to all to study at home); and why these are not freely available at all centers and on the internet.
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john morgan

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post15 Aug 2008

Matters become legal when the parties involved cannot deal with them by normal means. I suspect that the BK may be a little afraid of interaction with BK.info parties hence the running to legality. It may be that the legal route is not the best one for the BK as despite their pure and virtuous attainment some students get very screwed up.

It would be good if the BK were to interact a little here as donors paying for legal fees is probably not what donors intend. Whilst the poll seems to be about accessibility for current students I am sure past students are registering their experience. Kindest wishes to all.
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ex-l

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post15 Aug 2008

Are you suggesting that there is nothing screwed up within the system and leadership?

That there is no "karma", or like attracting like, on the leadership side (as we all used to teach)?

John, are there any logical reasons why neither Global and UK chief Janki Kripalani or her flunkies cannot answer the letter just because it was sent to her in India where she resides? By the way, did you actually read the initial letter and would you like to comment on it?

Occam's razor suggests there is a more simple answer ... they are giving their answer, they simply don't want their answer recorded in writing and especially in their own hand.
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john morgan

ex-BK

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post15 Aug 2008

Hi ex-I,

Long time no see.

I thought I was saying that Raja Yoga does screw certain individuals up and sometimes very badly.

In my experience it is better for a screwed up person to take personal responsibility than to blame anyone else even if they were treated badly or inaccurately.

If one is expecting fairness impartiality or infallibility from the BK disappointment is possible, if one studies The Knowledge as a person who does not belong to any organisation, it may work and work very well. In my experience, The Knowledge goes very very deep. If one gets into any difficulty, the BK cannot or will not help. It is in this way that one experiences the blessing of self reliance. Guess we all have to grow up sometime and see that these women give classes and do not listen to any other organisation. What they want is to spread their word and to introduce Baba to the masses through their classes. They see their spiritual power as proof of that and expect others to think the same. There can be no virtue except through the BK ????

Where on earth you got the idea that I was portraying the BK as a bunch of innocents I cannot see. That they have good qualities is evident to me but thinking back over many years (they may have improved), they can be as hard as nails and more interested in furthering the Yagya than actually serving. Don't forget that, from a BK point of view, all suffering is due to impurity. So if they cannot or will not help a person in difficulty who has bought into the whole thing, that person could find themselves in hell of the lowest order and do the BK care about that?

When dealing with deep knowledge and high energies a sense of perspective is essential. In my experience, perspective is rare enough outside the BK, perhaps to expect find it inside the BK is naive. As I have said before, you can be a lot kinder than the BK, I wish this were some kind of reference :D.

Time is limited. I have to go but can clarify further, if you wish, in a few days time.
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ex-l

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Re: BKWSU leadership accessibility

Post16 Aug 2008

My bad. My misunderstanding. My apologies. No need for you to say any more. Thanks.

I agree with you. I can see how one can argue that it is not even wrong. But I tend to think the BKs compromise themselves, and set themselves up for trouble, by not making all that you wrote clear "on the label" when "the product" is sold.

"The product", the spiritual is sold as "easy", all "love and light" ... until you get it home and open the wrapper and then various types of hell let loose, family and relationship fall apart, career goes ... sometimes sanity. I just feel strongly that it is a little dangerous when it comes to the "diffusion range" of Inner Space and other such 'BK Lite' (TM) products that are marketed without the ingredients being made clear. Then, much else of what has been re-written here comes into play.

In my opinion, how much support you get (a la ex-Bee Gee Robin Gibb being counseled over the death of his Brother by 'Mother of Love' Janki Kripalani etc) depends on how useful you are to their agenda, how much money or status you have, how good or conscienceless you are as seeking attention rather than absolute intrinsic spiritual worth. But that is business as usual, surely?

Funnily enough, I do not think what you write is wrong regarding self-reliance and the toughness of "the spiritual path". I accept and expect that to be correct. I just think it should be made clear to all comers. As you state, some individuals have literally lost their mind and been dumped.
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