20 Feb 2010
Hmmm ... firstly, thanks everyone for posting.
Secondly, ex-I posted something specific to back his view. I have no dispute with that. I accept it happened exactly as he writes in terms of 1976 Destruction prediction and Dadi Janki buying land.
My point about dirty laundry was only to avoid having a thread with long lists of facts about wrong things when the people aren't here to defend themselves in case they would dispute that picture. So I only want a few choice examples.
Sorry, I don't have much hard fact to give you myself. I tell you what, I'll post a few small stories about what I've found since coming into contact with BKs again. I feel confident that those souls here in Australia wouldn't mind me using their names. That way, you can see my own small personal experience. My own stories won't change the other stuff that you guys and gals have written.
Thirdly, I can understand the criticism about Destruction teaching and how it can go so, so wrong. I accept that Seniors are responsible for their actions and so are partly accountable for the negative outcome for teaching that. I have resolved to post my understanding on Destruction teaching. It fits inside my own head in a way that is actually constructive.
But I find myself lost for words reading the criticism about 1976 because I see a lot of validity in your criticisms. So I am not going to argue against what you've posted.
I feel a great hurt in my heart when I see how BKRJ can go wrong sometimes and the first thought that comes to me is: how do I make it better. Yes, I am an idealist, so very much. I want everyone who touches BK to come away with a beautiful experience. I want senior BKs to wake up and be far more sensitive and careful with their words. I want BK leadership to ease up and engage with souls who question and criticise instead of squashing debate from a religious following of the spiritual path.
Fourthly, thanks for wading through my long posts, Searcher. I am finding out what a passionate soul I am underneath and it spills out into long internet posts. You are well entitled to ask me to back up my views with facts. I will actually do that a bit and hopefully that will suit.
Fifthly, the points about BK teaching mentioning souls who question and leave are "weak bricks". It's true. So I will *not* sit here and deny it.
Is there a problem with it? Yeah, I suppose there is. It's not empathetic to those in that situation. This happens at other times too in BK: some very strong words are said. What I find is, if you're self-esteem is strong then it doesn't upset one. If you are that person the point is referring, it can make you quite upset, it is an attack on your fragile self.
This goes against my instinct, my heart, because I am a 'softie'. There is a segment of the actual teaching (Murli) that has material like this. It bothered me again when I started reading Murli again two years ago.
Because I love the other content so much, I stuck with it. I consciously try to not take such sayings hard, I deliberately counter it with the masses of other content in the Murli. This way, I am achieving some of balance in my response to everything. Being a soul weak in self esteem through this life, criticism and "harden up" type comments get to me. Yet in my hard won adult intellect, I do see that very rarely in life you have to "harden up, sunshine". So I take such comments in that spirit but against the backdrop of oceans of positive and gentler spiritual thoughts in the Murli teachings.
Anyway, I can understand how it comes across. "You weak brick". Not exactly New Age, kind and lovely, is it? Anyway, I've explained how I deal with that kind of thing.
Sixthly, on reading the recent posts, it's become clear to me that some of the people posting on this forum were actually very dedicated and faithful BKs who did follow everything firmly, and sincerely studied the Murli. Like you Ex-I, from what you wrote. I find myself just accepting your view and why you left in that you lost respect for the Seniors and how it is run. I see you had strong reasons for that.
Seventhly (!), @bktipit You know, when I was hanging out in Surry Hills Centre in 1989-1990, I read a batch of what was said to be Sakar Murlis from the 1950s. They were a bit different. More Hindu references, they dealt mainly with sex and staying celibate. They had lots of strong language.
If anyone wants, I'll post in a separate thread about the path of celibacy as it's a big topic. But I don't think this is the right forum for BK teachings. You guys probably aint interested and like I said, I've come to accept you strong and valid reasons for your views.
In essence, many of the motivating points in Murli are strongly worded and very religious. It's not the sum total as there is so much that is gentle and loveful too. I believe those strongly worded points are meant to help us to do those difficult things like remain celibate, but also one has to so careful to not take them in negative manner. It is pitfall and easy one to fall into. Those 1950s Murlis were very "raw" lots of Hindu stuff I can hardly relate to. Has anyone ever read some of the material from the very start of the Yagya? I think some of it is available through this website.
Much of BK path is actually very religious. I, personally, don't like religion but I am coming to accept the presence of that massive religious element in BK. It leads one to those beautiful spiritual truths that I like, but it does have many, many, many pitfalls. I aim to dance my way around those while sticking faithfully to the genuine spiritual content.
And moving on, @bktipit Strong words, mate. Fair enough, I'll try to back up whatever I say.
You say one must follow every point of Shrimat and not "cherry pick" what you like. True ... yet at the same time, one of those directions of Shrimat says "have a broad intellect" which means: think on it and use your intellect to become stable, considered, mature, calm and wise. If you don't believe what I am saying is right, that I am actually breaching BK code of conduct and breaking Shrimat with that statement, we will have to agree to disagree.
Destruction teaching in every Murli. Yeah, it's in most. It's part of a body of teachings around that concept. I'll right now put up a thread to explain the full BK teaching on Destruction. There is nothing to hide, in my view. If written in that clumsy way you propose in a newspaper, it comes across in a narrow way so does the teaching no justice at all. People will read it in the wrong way as there is much more to the teachings on Destruction than just 6 billion souls are going to die.
Everyone here is also clear that three of the world's great religions: Christianity, Islam and Hinduism, teach the same thing? The world will end in their teaching. Does that bother you in the same way that it does with BKRJ? Maybe not; and that's interesting. Then what is bothersome is how BKs handle this area of teaching rather than the actual teaching itself, as people have gotten in a panic and sold their own houses due to this teaching on Destruction. That's the issue, is not it?
Again, you have to understand the teaching in its entirety. And if any senior has expressed it in a shallow way that encourages blind panic, they are responsible for wrong karma then.
My final thought is that I can see BK often goes quite wrong. I also see that there are problems in the practical running of it as an organisation. I also think this forum fulfills some good functions as follows: it allows souls who have had issues to express themselves; for those who are struggling and suppressed to find support and way to speak out and be heard; it challenges BK beliefs, methods, and so I hope that helps to awaken the intellect of practising BKs and through that to become more real in their practice of spirituality.
I accept many genuine critcisms of BK. I cannot, as a thinking and aware person, close my eyes and sweep some things under the carpet. The administration is too cold sometimes in how it deals with souls who question the path or have problems. I believe those souls need some level of help. I think there is too much trying to support BK path at any cost, so some topics are not discussed freely enough and some things get covered over. I don't like that actually. It does more harm than good in my view.
I also think the way it is written in this forum sometimes becomes very negative. Yet, I am pleasantly surprised at how mature and well reasoned many posts here from BKs who hate the BK path are.
I have seen with my own eyes so much level of religious worship in BK, including the worship in effect of the senior people in it, the Dadis. Yep, BKs are mostly like puppy dogs to Dadi Janki, they sometimes worship her in my opinion. They would not be far off from showering her in flowers and smearing sandalwood paste on her.
Is she worth doing that to? She is not God and never will be! Neither is the founder. No human being should be worshipped like that. However, I also look in her eyes and I see some genuine stuff there. I respect that for more than fifty years she has been getting up for meditation and has gained something solid from that. I also think her personality is sometimes judgemental. I see that as a flaw and my hope for her is that she removes that flaw.
Even given how much I accept as well founded criticism of BKRJ, I don't see that BK has a vile, black, malignant heart pulsing at its core, with those senior people deliberately trying to hurt or manipulate the whole world. I believe the many critcisms on this forum are well founded and based in fact, but I believe these problems in the Yagya, the BK organisation as it is in the practical, spring from very human flaws common in humanity. I also believe those senior people overall mean well.
Looking in their eyes, meeting them, talking to them, standing in their bedrooms, I believe they genuinely believe in what they're doing, even though they get it horribly wrong sometimes as already clarified on this forum. They don't go out the back and smoke drugs, wear bling, have wild sex parties, own twenty limousines, and live material lives while spewing out teachings they do not follow. No, they genuinely try to follow the teachings they speak on: they get up at 4 am and meditate, they think on Murli teachings, they genuinely believe they are doing God's bidding, they give up all their wealth and own nothing personally except for a hair brush and few small trinkets.
Apart from posting on Destruction, I won't be posting BK teaching anymore or arguing against posts by ex BKs on here. I can live peacefully with others who criticise BK. I aim to get something positive out of the BK path with its many flaws and I am happy to share my progress in that in a micro way for what it's worth, if you want (as Ex-I asked me to in a post some time ago).
I will endeavour to the best of my capacity remain a good and decent person no matter what I see or am told while mixing with BKs again. I swear to everyone on this forum that I will never allow myself to be manipulated or brain washed. You haven't met me, but that's just not who I am. I so far beyond that gullible puppy dog I once was twenty years ago. If I find BK has a pulsing black heart that does not serve God's beautiful universal spiritual truths that I love (you know, those commoon nice things that most religions have), I will leave BK forever more and never return. I sincerely don't see any such black malignant heart but I will keep my eyes very much open in case it hides behind closed doors.
My very best wishes and genuine respect to everyone on this forum, including ex-BKs with views of criticism. Wish me luck as a reformist BK!
Cheers,
Sword
P.S. My God, another massive post from me. I swear I am a frustrated author.