Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

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arjun

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post08 Oct 2008

shivsena wrote:Things are getting more complicated. It is not yet proved by PBKs that the three murtis in the beginning of the Yagya are the same three souls who are going to be revealed as Trimurti in the end, and now you further add, that original mata gave birth to all four seeds in the beginning itself (and who were the four souls, besides the original three murtis - please clarify). This is something I have not heard before.

Dear Brother,
Omshanti. You have misunderstood my statement. You had asked as to who the Brahma could be whose sons are the four Sanat Kumars. For this I replied that the first mother (who was in the beginning of the Yagya and who narrated the matter of visions of Dada Lekhraj to his partner) could be the Brahma who gives birth to the four Sanat Kumars. I did not mean to say that the seed-souls of other religions were also present when the clarification of the visions of Dada Lekhraj was being given by Shiv through Dada Lekhraj's partner.

new knowledge wrote:But, first of all, Lekhraj Kirpalani narrated his own visions to that mother & then that mother narrated the same to Sevakram; thus, the first narrator of that visions is Lekhraj Kirpalani & not that mother. If that mother becomes Brahma by just narrating those visions, Lekhraj Kirpalani should be regarded as the first Brahma who narrates his own visions to that mother & that mother as the secondary Brahma who depicts that story to sevakram.

But it is believed that it was Shiv who entered in that mother to hear about the visions of Dada Lekhraj and then narrate it 'as it is' to Dada Lekhraj's partner. Just because Dada Lekhraj's partner happened to be the first person to hear the words of Shiva through the mouth of that mother he happens to be the first Brahmin and that mother the first Brahma. Dada Lekhraj comes into the picture later on. Shiva enters into the partner to understand and explain the meaning of the visions to the first mother. Later on that mother narrates the clarification to Dada Lekhraj. So, Dada Lekhraj is just a titleholder Brahma and not the first Brahma. Dada Lekhraj's partner happens to be the original Prajapita Brahma. Well, all this is a theory which many may not believe.
OGS,
Arjun
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shivsena

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post08 Oct 2008

arjun wrote: Omshanti. You have misunderstood my statement. You had asked as to who the Brahma could be whose sons are the four Sanat Kumars. For this I replied that the first mother (who was in the beginning of the Yagya and who narrated the matter of visions of Dada Lekhraj to his partner) could be the Brahma who gives birth to the four Sanat Kumars. I did not mean to say that the seed-souls of other religions were also present when the clarification of the visions of Dada Lekhraj was being given by Shiv through Dada Lekhraj's partner.

Dear arjun Bhai.

It means that you are just giving your views and not what is officially taught in Advanced Knowledge ... and your views are based on the hypothesis of Advanced Knowledge, which teaches that there was a mother adi-brahma, (other than Mama Saraswati) who was given the gyan-kalash first to make sevakram (Ram's soul), the first choti ka Brahmin ... and when the seed-souls of other religions were made sons of Brahma is still a mystery. Is this what you are trying to say !?!

shivsena
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ex-l

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

Why cant someone just write down a singular list, A to Z, of all the different names and characters used in Murlis so we can see it and attempt to match them up or discount them?

Why are BK followers so allergic to a simple, forthright and logical approach?
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shivsena

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

arjun wrote: "Do you know the reminder of Kumars remaining ever pure and highly virtuous (satoguni)? Sanat Kumars. What is shown as their specialty? They are always shown as small boys. It is said that they are always aged five years. This is famous about purity. Just as a five year old child is completely pure, isn’t it? He remains detached from the attraction of relations. However big the worldly family may be, but the stage should be just as a small child is pure. Similarly, this is a reminder of purity. Kumar means pure stage. In that also, not just a single person is shown but a fraternity (sangathan) has been shown. A few are shown as an example. So your fraternity is a reminder of purity. The purity is such that there should not be any thought or experience of impurity." [Avyakt Vani dated 11/3/71 Pg-4 published by BKs in Hindi and translated by a PBK]

Dear arjun Bhai.
In the above Vani, is avaykt Brahma talking about Ram's soul as sanatkumar or is he talking, in general, about all Kumars who are being given the title of sanatkumar.
Please give your views.
shivsena.
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arjun

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

Omshanti. I am producing below the extracts from the Advanced course on the picture of Ladder which also contains a reference to the Sanat Kumars, whose subject has been raised by Shivsena Bhai in this thread:

"Here, in the picture of ladder, the Confluence Age has been shown in two parts----one is the lower portion, shown at the right corner and the other is the upper portion shown at the left corner of the picture of The Ladder. In the old picture of ladder it has been clearly written in the lower portion shown at the end of the Iron Age, “Confluence Age of 40 years” whereas Baba has mentioned the period of Confluence Age to be of maximum 100 years in the Murlis (mu.3.10.69, pg.1). This proves that the period from 1936 to 1976 has been depicted here and the period of the Confluence Age after 1976 has been shown on the top portion of the picture. In The Ladder '40 years’ has been written below (i.e. in the portion of Confluence Age in the lower part of the picture).

So from 1936 to 1976, the task of establishment of shooting (rehearsal) of Golden Aged souls by Brahma, which was supposed to have taken place within 40 years, was completed in those 40 years. The task of shooting of the Golden Aged souls, which was supposed to take place, took place in four stages---Satopradhan (completely pure), Satosamanya (ordinarily pure), Rajo (partially pure) and Tamo (Impure). The shooting of Rajopradhan and Tamopradhan which has taken place has been depicted here in the picture of ladder below in the form of Ravan Rajya (Kingdom of Ravan) where the 40 years of the ordinary Confluence Age got completed. The 60 years of the elevated (purushottam) Confluence Age from 1976 to 2036 has been shown above in The Ladder.

Until 1976, when the task of shooting of Golden Aged souls of deity class is completed through Brahma, then after that those demoniac souls who are vipreet buddhi (i.e. those whose intellect works in the opposite direction when compared to that of the Supreme Father Supreme Soul) at the time of destruction, get destroyed and those who are preet buddhi (i.e. those whose intellect loves God and works according to Godly direction) at the time of destruction have been shown in the upper portion of ladder and depicted as victorious souls.

That’s why Baba has said, “In the picture of ladder write clearly in the lower portion that those who were vipreet buddhi at the time of destruction got destroyed and it should be written above that those who were preet buddhi at the time of destruction were victorious.” After 1976 the souls which gain victory have been shown here above in The Ladder, among which Ram and Ram’s three Brothers have been depicted here. On the one side is a group of Brothers and on the other side is a group of Sisters. On the one side is the group of Rudra mala (rosary of Rudra) and on the other side is the group of vijay mala (rosary of victory). Four souls have been shown as the heads of Rudramala, who are the seeds of four religions.

In the scriptures these souls have been mentioned as the four elder most maanasi sons (born through the thoughts) of Brahma-----Sanat, Sanathan, Sanandan & Sanath Kumar. These four souls are the seed-like souls of the four main religions---Deity religion, Islam, Buddhism & Christianity. Among them, the seed of deity religion is the soul of Ram, the seed of Islam is Bharat, seed of Buddhism is Lakshman & the seed of Christianity is Shatrughna.
(Bharat, Lakshman & Shatrughna were the Brothers of Rama of the Ramayana epic). These four seed-like souls of the four religions belong to the Rudramala and four souls are their cooperative shaktis (the female deities shown in the picture) who have been shown on the other side."


From the underlined lines above it does not appear as if the last one among the Sanat Kumars is the seed of the deity religion. It appears as if the first to fourth Sanat Kumars are seeds of deity, Islam, Buddhism and Christianity respectively.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun
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suryavanshi

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

From the underlined lines above it does not appear as if the last one among the Sanat Kumars is the seed of the deity religion. It appears as if the first to fourth Sanat Kumars are seeds of deity, Islam, Buddhism and Christianity respectively.


As per the Advanced Knowledge, there are are four sons of Brahma - Sanat ,Sanatan, Sanandhan and Sanat Kumar. In this hierarchy, Sanat is the eldest son and Sanat Kumar is the youngest son of Brahma. The eldest and youngest is according to the number wise birth as a Brahmin through the mouth of Brahma. Sanat was born as a Brahmin first and Sanat Kumar was born as a Brahmin last. So, Sanat is the eldest and Sanat Kumar is the youngest Brahmin child born through the mouth of Brahma. But out of these four sons, the youngest Brahmin child i.e. Sanat Kumar (soul of Ram here) captures and understands The Knowledge first that was given through Brahma and the other sons(Sanat ,Sanatan and Sanandhan) are numberwaar in their grasp of Godly knowledge after Sanat Kumar. That is why although, Sanat Kumar was born last(i.e. although He is the youngest child), since He has understood The Knowledge first or since He is ahead in knowledge compared to His other Brothers(Sanat , Sanatan and Sanandhan), He is in fact considered to be the eldest(according to understanding of knowledge) and therefore, He is the head of the Highest Religion i.e. the Deity Religion and His other Brothers are head of the respective religions after the deity religion.
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shivsena

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

Dear arjun Bhai and suryavanshi Bhai.

Again two contra-dictory views about who is Ram??.. eldest sanat or youngest sanatkumar !!!
Suryavanshi Bhai, Ramayan says that Ram is the eldest of the four sons (Ram-bharat-laxman-shatrugan) so how does Ram become the youngest when he is considered as one of 4 sons of Brahma. Can you give your views on this ambiguity.

My confusion is why shivbaba-supreme teacher has to explain the bhakti-marg pictures of basic knowledge with reference to the worldly scriptures, which mention about the 4 sons of Brahma and why ShivBaba has not mentioned even a word of the 4 sons of Brahma in any of Sakar Murlis between 1965-1969. Is HE explaining the Murlis or is HE explaining the worldly scriptures????? and more important why Father ShivBaba has to explain giving points from avaykt Vanis of child Brahma(Krishna) and not from his own Sakar Murlis.
Does any PBK have any logical explanation for this.

shivsena.
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arjun

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

shivsena wrote:and more important why Father ShivBaba has to explain giving points from avaykt Vanis of child Brahma(Krishna) and not from his own Sakar Murlis.

Where did that child Krishna (Brahma) get The Knowledge from in the first place? Is it not from the Father Himself? So, indirectly Baba is quoting Himself and not child Krishna.
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suryavanshi

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post09 Oct 2008

Suryavanshi Bhai, Ramayan says that Ram is the eldest of the four sons (Ram-Bharat-laxman-shatrugan) so how does Ram become the youngest when he is considered as one of 4 sons of Brahma. Can you give your views on this ambiguity.


Why are you taking the limited sense( equal to birth through the mouth of Brahma) about the birth of Ram and his Brothers?

In the unlimited sense(i.e. according to understanding of Knowledge), Ram is considered to be the eldest son amongst the four because jo Gyan mein badaa wahi badaa thahraa (the one who understands and incorporates The Knowledge first is elder compared to others).
So, soul of Ram is the eldest and other Brothers are number wise which is in accordance with Ramayan since in Ramayan, Ram is shown to be more Gyani and virtues comapred to his other Brothers.Other Brothers could not defeat Ram on any topic related to Gyan in their entire life, although all the Brothers were Gyani and virtues but were numberwise.
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shivsena

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Re: Murli points for untraceable questions/threads

Post13 Oct 2008

Dear arjun Bhai, indiana, suryavanshi and PBK Brothers.

Just read a very stunning Murli point which should serve as a eye-opener to many PBKs, who think that ShivBaba is giving them Advanced Knowledge.

In Murli 31-3-01, Shiva says "Bap kahete hain ki tumko grahasta vyavar mein rahena hai. Baba kabhi kissi ko kah nahin sakte ki tum ghar-bar chodo. NAHIN. Grahasta vyavar mein rahete sirf antim janam pavitra banana hai. Baba ne kabhi kaha ki tum ghar-bar chodo?? bahut bacche ghar-grahasta mein rahete bhi ishwariya service karte hain, ghar chudya nahin jaata. Baba kissi ko bhi chudate nahin hain."

Translation: "Father says you have to remain in the house-hold (and not surrender physically). Baba can never say to anybody that you leave the house-hold (and surrender) NEVER. You remain in the household and remain pure. Has Baba said to anybody anytime that you leave your house?? Many children do Godly service while remaining in the house, not by leaving the house. Baba never lets anyone leave the house-hold."

It is very clear from the above Murli that ShivBaba would never perform any action that would contradict his own words, which He has spoken in Sakar Murlis. So now there should be no doubt in the minds of PBKs, that it is not ShivBaba who is in charge of Advance Party and surrendering the souls, but it is manushya guru deh-dhari Brahma(in the night of Brahma) who is surrendering kanyas and matas on his own manmat.

The above Murli point should be circulated and read several times by all PBKs and surrendered PBKs and let each of them decide as to whether Advanced Knowledge is jhooti Krishna ki Gita which is establishing jhoot khand or it is ShivBaba's sacchi Gita which is establishing sachkhand.

shivsena.

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