I really want to help you - please read ...

for ex-BKs to discuss matters related to experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
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TruthExposed

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I really want to help you - please read ...

Post01 May 2019

I am writing this post to express my experiences and what I have found out about the BKs over the years I was involved with the group. It's taken me a lot of courage to write this, and I have come to understand that there is still a lot of BK conditioning that is steeped in fear held within my subconscious that has consequently prevented me from sharing sooner.

I now feel that I want to share my thoughts because I feel it is my duty to do so as it may potentially help people who may be considering joining the BK organisation, or who are already a part of the group and wanting to escape, or maybe even remain but understand how they can better cope and remain empowered if they do come across any challenges or hypocrisy.

I want to start by saying that I did not really have any bad experiences personally in the organisation - I was treated with the utmost respect and met some lovely people, apart from a few instances when senior BK Sisters lost their temper with me, which I ignored because we can all have a **** day.

I also want to express that I am not here to debate the teachings, I was always uncomfortable with a lot of what I heard and just took what felt right to me which was less than 10% and, also, now believe that what the general public is told is edited and revised. The teachings or the image that is portrayed about the core teachings of the organisation are not consistent nor accurate - so be mindful about what you are being fed and don't blindly believe anything.

I do want to say that I overall perceived the organisation with 'rose tinted glasses' and that's what kept me attending the centre but after having observed the hypocrisy and hidden agendas of some members, particularly at the main London Centre, I need to speak out so that the truth can be exposed; and I am hoping that this post is read by the BKs there, especially by those "surrendered Sisters" who seem to somehow be able to justify their hypocritical ways.

So, the truth - and I am not referring to every single person (there are BKs who are lovely and seem to be progressing on their chosen path), but the few who think that their behaviours are justified, and they can abuse and mistreat people and still believe that "they will be the chosen ones in the Golden Age" - you are highly mistaken and I hope your conscience catches up with you!

So here goes:

There are senior surrendered BK Sisters who seem to think that they can sit on their thrones and give impressive talks about themes like 'living authentically' and 'following your truth' and giving advice about living a surrendered life as a "nun" but still be in relationships - primarily sexual relationships behind closed doors and leading a double life. How the hell does that work? Anyone who comes out and justifies this behaviour in any way is quite frankly a deluded idiot!

Advice for those "nuns" - make a decision! leave and get married/date or whatever or fulfil your vowes as a surrendered Sister - there is no bloody excuse for what you are doing and the truth always comes out! Stop being so selfish and misleading people! I thought you believed in karma? If you've had bad experiences in the organisation yourselves, or were yourselves misled/treated badly, then do something about it!! You cannot just carry on and keep on using and abusing vulnerable people to fulfil your unmet needs and desires, and lead double lives!

Advice for people visiting the centre/prospective BKs - don't risk funding these hypocrites by donating money. They're living off your hard-earned money and living like queens and doing what they want anyway, and truths like this will be brushed under the carpet so that the organisation can maintain its reputation. Also, don't put anyone on a pedestal in this organisation or think that they are more special or in any way more spiritually advanced than you - nobody is perfect and they're all working on their demons - maybe even bigger ones than you!

Think twice before swearing allegiance to any group or cult. Do your research first and make an informed choice from a place of analysis, rather than emotions or because you are in a bad place in life - if that's the case, turn to your friends or family - they will be the ones who will stand by you no matter what - keep them close.

Most people join groups because they had a 'spiritual experience' during, eg meditation (I believe such experiences come from within you because you had the inner capacity to create them, they're not from some external agency or a group) or were mesmerised by the group leader, or got a lot of attention or love - always ask yourself honestly what is motivating you, and then decide.

That's all for now ...
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oldbk

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Post01 May 2019

Awesome post ! No nonsense, no sugar coating, no grey areas ! Hats off to you for sharing your experience while bringing out the reality of the situation.

In my experience, when I realized that the money was not being used for "Service" but otherwise, I switched to non-monetary contribution. So, not taking anything for free, but making sure that the "free loaders" are not living off your "charity".

Likewise, if we use the Power of Discernment, aka Spin the Discuss of Self-Realization ... we can definitely see through the falsehood and hypocrisy that is pervasive in the BK environment. But also be able to get around it, and not get sucked into it.

No need to be a parrot and repeat all the propaganda that is woven around us like a magic web, and still find a positive solution, if we REALLY want to continue with the BKs.
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ex-l

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Re: I really want to help you - please read ...

Post01 May 2019

TruthExposed wrote:There are senior surrendered BK Sisters who seem to think that they can sit on their thrones and give impressive talks about themes like 'living authentically' ... " but still be in relationships - primarily sexual relationships behind closed doors and leading a double life.

Wow ... Is she hot?

I suppose they could always pack her off to India where there are, Brahma Kumari males are seeking "wives". Funnily enough, that's actually what a Murli quote said, "it is better to get married than burn with lust" (approx) ... however, that was in 1960s India rather than today so I don't know if it still matters.

BKs bonking in a Brahma Kumari centres ... Boy, Dharamraj is looking like it is going to be really entertaining. I can look really forward to Destruction now! </joke>
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Pink Panther

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Post02 May 2019

TruthExposed,

Thank you for a well composed post which tells us a lot in a concise way. It sounds like you are ready to move on to more fulfilling things in your life. All the best with that.

I just wish the whole bullsh** about celibacy = purity = superior would disappear. With that would go hierarchy.

We all know from real experiences and history it is a false equivalency.

It is a manipulation and exploitation of people's religious and social conditionings; that have grown out of centuries of ignorant patriarchy and dualistic thinking used to justify power elites.

it is a legitimised excuse for abuse and for reinforcing power imbalances based on imaginary values.
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Post03 May 2019

Pink Panther wrote:I just wish the whole bullsh** about celibacy = purity = superior would disappear. With that would go hierarchy.

Not having sex is no big thing, especially when no one would be willing to have sex with you, you hate your husband, or you're just too damned old to care any more. All of which together would apply to a huge proportion of Brahma Kumaris followers.

Add to that those with hidden lesbian tendencies for whom joining the BKs was escape from marriage to a man.

Of course, in the early days, it is clear from the original documents that the BKs wanted to hide, that Lekhraj Kirpalani - and others - had intimate and affectionate relationships with the young women. In the case of Lekhraj Kirpalani, Om Radhe is on record not denying them, but just claiming - borrowed from Krishna worshipping sects - that whatever they did with their god or Divine Father was "pure"; semi-naked bathing, sleeping together, "pulling of breasts", feeding mouth to mouth like lovers, and so on. It hints at more intimate activities, all playing out Krisha and Gopi stories, ie groups of the most attractive young women in his bedroom with him.

Hence the BKs' definition of "purity" has changed over time.

In my opinion, the BKs only then later adopted the strict sanyasis version (even worldly Brahmins get married) as a response to society's outrage at his behaviour, and to play up to expected norms for a religious group that could be financially supported by society.

And have since increasingly cut into the sanyasis' donor-based business model and market.

Is there any evidence simply not having sex makes anyone more intelligent, more honest, more compassionate, or increases their integrity?

If not, what precisely does it do?

I think a universal, blanket approach - no sex, no affection, no loving relationships - is very bad for the young (children especially in the latter two cases), and very wrong for those who have been emotionally damaged ... for whom having sex, experiencing affection and positive relationships could be part of their recovery.

In this case, I kind of agree with Osho's (Rajneesh), and others position that one should not really give it up until you've had good loving and know it for what it is. The BKs have been dominated by those who have only experienced bad sex and relationships (forced and loveless marriages to elderly men for the sake of business and social standing, such as Dadi Janki) or virgins infatuated with and dominated by Lekhraj Kirpalani (Gulzar and others).

And, as the author above writes, leaders who have secret relationships themselves (Hansa Raval in the USA, and others).

Hansa in the USA is a notable case as she divorced her first husband, leaving behind an infant child, and then re-married a male BK in order to defraud the US immigration Department, and had a secretive relationship with him.

If you consider BK USA was dominated by her and Big Mohini it makes you wonder what they are really about.

Yes, thanks for your post, Truth. Please document it all so the world can see it and come up with their own conclusions.

No more "keep facing" for the Kirpalani Klan.
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Post04 May 2019

I’m not sure what goes on in the main centre but this behaviour is certainly common amongst the supposed surrendered Sisters and Brothers living in the surrounding bhavans!

I’m so tempted to name people but there is actually no point because those in the top positions are aware of what goes on, the culprits get a mere slap on the wrist, and the behaviour is repeated again and again and then the ultimate excuse/reason the BKs use for justifying their questionable actions is ‘it’s all drama’, or maybe we had ‘karmas to settle’.

Why I have issues with his is because innocent and naive members are getting used and abused, and then chucked away when they’re no longer of any use.

People need to know what really goes on - don’t be fooled by the white attire, ironically symbolic of “purity”, don’t be fooled by the soft speech. Most BKs are depressed themselves, especially those who have been surrendered for years, they’re going through an identity crisis and need new students, ie new energy, to feel normal, help inflate their fragile ego. I’m sure there are genuine BKs, but there are also those who have made a complete mockery of themselves and those they have abused without consequence.

I can’t believe I wasted more than 25 years with these people, the whole thing is a farce and the sooner people realise that, the better!
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vlakshmi

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Post04 May 2019

Baba has clearly stated that “those who indulge in any vice is called shudras” (Murli June 24, 2018). Interestingly, His often repeated warning is that, "if a BK commits a mistake, he/she will be punished 100 times heavier than non-BKs and any status he would have received will be forfeited.”

In spite of such certitude of receiving punishment and under the threat of losing all status, if one engages himself/herself in vices, it means such one is choosing punishment which has nothing to do with organization. A forest is not made up of one or two fallen trees. If you want to enjoy the forest, you have to look at the forest as a whole.
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TruthExposed

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Post04 May 2019

Please share in which Murli BK’s will be punished to a greater degree... what’s the punishment for those higher up allowing such things to happen under the their noses and turning a blind eye to it? Aren’t they the ones who have a duty to protect the organisation from deeds that go against the core teachings?

What you are calling “vice” is how you were born into this world by the way...
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vlakshmi

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Post04 May 2019

First of all see how Baba defines true Brahmakumari:
Who are the true Brahma Kumars and Kumaris? Those who never indulge in vice—Murli 7.9.2015

Souls who have the power of Yoga cannot be defeated by Maya EVEN IN THEIR DREAMS. They cannot have any weaknesses EVEN IN THEIR DREAMS—Murli 11.03.2019

If wrong actions are performed at this time, THE STATUS IS DESTROYED FOR EVERY CYCLE—Murli 1.3.2016

“Whatever you sow, so shall you reap. This is a law of this world. The Father says: Even I cannot break this law. Although I am the World Almighty Authority—Murli 24.06.2015

“There cannot be forgiveness. There is an accurate karmic account for every act”—Murli 18.07.2015

Those who don’t study well and who make others unhappy will also die unhappy; their status will be destroyed as well—Murli 13.03.2015 (if so what would be the case of those who commit vice?)

“There will be very severe punishment for A MISTAKE.”—Murli 12.09.2016

This drama is created on the basis of karma. Whatever deeds each one performs, he accordingly receives the fruit of that. Father says: Children, after becoming My helpers in service, don't perform wrong actions. When you do disservice, innocent ones face obstacles. The Father's right hand is Dharamraj—12.09.2016

“Severe punishment for those who belong to the Father and then do disservice, the Father's right hand is Dharamraj—Murli 12.9.2016

The Father would not sit and punish you. This is the automatic, predestined drama which continues. –29.01.2019

Baba has said many times about 100 times punishment for BKs. Next time when I hear, I will post it here.
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Post04 May 2019

vlakshmi wrote:A forest is not made up of one or two fallen trees. If you want to enjoy the forest, you have to look at the forest as a whole.

I found a picture of the whole of the BK forest.

What vlakshmi appears to be agreeing is that there is no punishment within the system for BKs "sinning" (never mind breaking the law), the magical Law of Karma will take care of it all.

My position on that would be it is simply a matter of practicalities ... if the BK leadership were to have punishments for sinning and breaking the law, there'd be no followers left.

In my time, the only "punishment" I can remember for sexual misconduct was the individual being disallowed to go to Madhuban for 6 months or a year (Indians were treated more strictly than Westerners) and having to be pukka (attend class etc) during that time.

But recently we've read of BKs getting married, living together, "having holidays" (together - meaning having a sexual-emotional relationship), married ex-BKs having privileged access to retreat centres for the sake of their shared business interests and so on.

Perhaps you can explain to us what the current rules and/or (double) standards are?

BK_Forest.jpg
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Post04 May 2019

vlakshmi wrote:Baba has said many times about 100 times punishment for BKs. Next time when I hear, I will post it here.

I am sorry but I am going to have to invoke a rule we have used before here ...

No Murli quotes unless they are linked to the full and originally dated Murli.

The problem is ... you have already proven yourself not to be trustworthy (you have made up translations, and novel definitions (manmat), to suit yourself and your own arguments).

Therefore, unless we can see and read the original and unedited document to decide for ourselves, no more Murli quotes.
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Pink Panther

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Post05 May 2019

vlakshmi wrote:Baba has clearly stated that “those who indulge in any vice is called shudras” (Murli June 24, 2018).

A sentence full of loaded subjective meanings with no basis in reality.

Baba - a mutating beast. Once it just meant a biological Father, then a term of endearment for an elder male, then a term for a spiritual teacher, so there’s many Babas, some of whom say they are God, some who say they are vehicles of God. Which leads to the infinitely indeterminable nature of ”God” - God is a word which can mean anything you want it mean. Even within a religion, even within BKs, there will be different views of the nature of God.

”Indulge” meaning ”allow oneself to enjoy”.

Enjoyment is now a crime. This gives psychological power to the person who decides what is and is not a crime, what is and is not a proper form of enjoyment, over those who accede to their authority, who decide they will accept their authority, because somewhere they too believe enjoyment is somehow an indulgence.

”Vice” - wickedness, crime.

We know that BKs equate sex, even human attachment as found between parent and child, siblings, lovers (who often become parents) as the number one vice. Is there anything more enjoyable, more human, than the loving bond between people? Then this self-defined Baba-God comes along and like the needy narcissist he is, inserts himself into every loving relationship of those who’ve acceded some authority over their lives to this needy Baba /god. And what better way for this Baba-god to leverage power over others, to get them to do what you want them to, than to dominate them emotionally and psychologically, making their basic humanity prone to your determination of what is valid love and affection, valid or wicked enjoyment. And to even question those determinations is to fall out of favour and risk a fate worse than death.

”Shudras” - do I even have to explain why this is so obnoxious?

Here is this Baba-God talking about the majority of "his children” behind their backs in this derogatory way to butter up and manipulate his ”favourites", ie those who will do what ‘he’ wants, to keep them doing what he wants. This Baba-god projects and infects his favourites with his own pathology so that they too see their siblings as "shudras”. Makes me puke. (Hey, maybe it's these emetic reactions that show one is cured fo the infection! They say a smoker is not really over the addiction until they find the smell nauseating rather than attractive.)

Any trained psychiatrist or psychologist could surely unpack these dynamics and see them for what they are, unless they too had been draw into this mass delusion. Many a cult have managed to draw in psychiatrists, psychologists, doctors, nurses to act for them. No amoun of study or credentials stops them being human, just as needy as anyone else.
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vlakshmi

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Post05 May 2019

Hi Pink Panther,

Baba has clearly stated that “those who indulge in any vice is called shudras” (Murli June 24, 2018)

Baba = Father
Vice, vikarma, means any act that gives pleasure in the beginning but sorrow in the end.
Such people will become sorrowful in the end, hence the word shudras (from shok = sorrow).
Shudra = the sorrowful.
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TruthExposed

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Post05 May 2019

Which Murli is this from:
“if a BK commits a mistake, he/she will be punished 100 times heavier than non-BKs and any status he would have received will be forfeited”

The BK forest doesn’t just have one or two fallen trees.

VLakshmi, please answer the following questions, put gyaan and Murli aside for one moment, I want to know your views, unfiltered and not influenced by anything, just your opinions as an upstanding citizen.
    1) If an organisation like the BKs, which survives on people’s donations, has a hierarchical structure - with those high up supposedly having the responsibility for the smooth running of the organisation - do you not think that they have a duty and moral responsibility to clean up the forest?
People who enter a centre have an expectation about what the organisation is like - the image given is of a group of “pure people” who have dedicated their lives in service to God, who are sought to inspire, to be role models and a living reflection of the teachings, taking on positions as teachers, giving courses and are mentors.
    2) Do you think they should be allowed to carry on doing as they please, eg breaking all the rules and then put on a fake identity to the general public when it’s convenient and mislead?
Is that what your BK God would want?
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Pink Panther

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Post05 May 2019

vlakshmi wrote:Hi Pink Panther,
Baba has clearly stated that “those who indulge in any vice is called shudras” (Murli June 24, 2018)

Baba = Father
Vice, vikarma, means any act that gives pleasure in the beginning but sorrow in the end
Such people will become sorrowful in the end, hence the word shudras (from shok = sorrow)
Shudra = the sorrowful

Exactly.
Baba = Father

You have arbitrarilty decided that someone other than your biological Father is now your Father. You may have chosen to become Roman Catholic and call your local priest ”Father”, but instead you chose BKs and call both their nominated god ”Shiva” as ”Baba” along with their founder Lekhraj as ”Baba”, so just arbitrary, a choice.
Vice, vikarma, means any act that gives pleasure in the beginning but sorrow in the end

Another arbitrary definition. Many people have had sex that was pleasurable and did not bring sorrow. Sure it can be abused or be innapropriate but so can eating, sleeping or almost anything.

You also exclude anything that gives no pleasure in the beginning regardless of ending.
Shudra = the sorrowful

You might begin to alleviate the sorrow of others by not labelling them or yourself. But this is your redefining of the term. BKs are very specific, you should not put words into gods mouth! If that was all Shudra meant, why won't BKs eat food cooked by non-BKs? Why do they consider their ”vibrations” as ”impure”?

I’ll tell you why. becuase it makes BKs seem better (to no-one but themselves, but that's all a cult mind needs) .

Vlakshmi,

if I had to describe you to someone, I'd say this - mind you, only based on what I have read here, its only my distant opinion, no divine pronouncements here!: - You seem to have the mind of a sophist rather than of a philosopher. This vlakshmi character has received an education, is of slightly above-average intelligence, knows how to adopt the persona and jargon of that which s/he wants to be, but is lacking in the genuine inquisitiveness, curiosity, circumspection or imagination to realise that is what s/he is doing.

For now, I wish you well and hope that one day you'll find your own peace of mind, beyond the artefacts of enculturation, with the wisdom to distinguish (as the Confucians say) between 'what is primary and what is secondary'.
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