Pseudonyms

for ex-BKs to discuss matters related to experiences in BKWSU & after leaving.
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Misty

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Pseudonyms

Post03 May 2015

In the last thread 'Unwanted Dissidents' http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum//viewtopic.php?p=42305#p42305 I have written about the fact that certain individuals are unwanted by the BKWSO. Or rather, I think it is a kind of mentality that the BKWSO abhors. And that is a critical, questioning mind. I think it is the presence or absence of this mentality that determines in the long run your position within the BKWSO, as long as you are there, with them.

During one of the last sessions I spoke with them about this issue. Mainly as the issue of cooperation was under discussion. I then learned that certain individuals left the BK, as described before.

The certer in charge, Trudy, told me that some individuals left a relativey long time ago. I asked her what happend to these individuals. The teacher replied that they resumed living an ordinary, everyday life like any other citizens. Later on, they sort of regrouped and discussed matters amongst each other.

But then there were yet other individuals and their behaviour was different. Whereas the individuals from the first group were satisfied by their own departure and nothing more than that, the individuals that left later on kept actively fighting against the BKWSO.

But there was yet another thing, they told me, as I was interested in meeting some of the people of the latter group mentioned. Although they were almost all inside the BK, incorporated, so to say, they opposed the Destruction paradigm. They hampered the organisations effectiveness and advancement, which made me wonder why it was so.

I raised that question and asked why the organisation disliked these people as they probably had a good reason for their point of view. (I also told them I had the same opinion that Destruction was wrong). I wondered if it was not more profitable that the BKWSO could learn from them and tried to listen to their grievances. Also I asked if it had to do with the PBK-group I had only very briefly heard about. But they told me it had nothing to do with the PBK-group.

I offered to talk to them and see what the reason for their position could be. But also I was interested. Both Mr. Whaling and the teacher were quite averse to the idea of me talking to them. They told me that these people would not understand me at that time (it was 1992 by then). I asked them why. They then told me that their mentality was dwelling deep within them and that they themselves were not aware of it at that moment. In fact it was dwelling so deep inside of them that no one was aware of it at that moment. And they themselves woud be the last to recognize.

However, I did ask more questions. I asked them that if they themselves were not aware of their position and if no one could detect their position, how could it be known then. This gave them (Mr. Whaling and the teacher Trudy) a grunting. They replied that they all would return to the BK again and their position was only temporarily (which I don't believe by the way, but that's my point of view).

As I insisted more, Mr. Whaling then sort of lost his calm, or his prudency, or both. He told me in an authoritarian way that they were vey well aware of who those individuals were. In fact, he knew exactly who those individuals were.

I then asked them if there were many. Mr. Whaling told me there were quite a few but that not all of them were very active. In fact, the group of people being actually active (i.e. openly opposing the BKWSO after having resigned) was very small. Most of them (i.e. this active group) but not all, were incorporated inside the BK at that moment and they were of course a real nuisance to the organisation. But because they were not actively acting against the BKWSO, nothing could be done. Some of them on the other hand had a position outside of the BKWSO but nevertheless by heart and mind were agains the BK. They were bystanders so to say.

About those individuals inside of the BK they were very plain. They were all completely incorporated and had totally surrendered to Baba. Completely encirceled they were and totally ineffective. They lived isolated from their families, and even their friends and closest friends were BK's. And they would stay there (i.e incorporated in the BK) for years.

As I was more interested I continued asking about the people that were oppposing the Destruction-paradigm, so to say. Mr. Whaling was the first to answer. He told me that the BKWSO was way too far advanced and could not be stopped, even if people tried.

He then told me that there was some opposition for a while, though. And as I waited for more information he told me more about it. He explained to me there was a website made by them, but only many years after they left and that people discussed matters on this site.

Although I had not heard yet about the worldwide web, I had read a book in which an american writer, writing about psychological matters, was discussing online with others. In those preliminary days the internet was not well developped yet and linked to universities and military regions, strictly divided though and later fused to become as it is. (At least that is as far as I know about the history of the web, and I am not that well informed in these matters).

However, as I had read this book, I had come across this paragraph in which this interaction was described, so that's why I could understand where they were talking about. The word "website" I did not know but I refraised it as an open forum where people could discuss matters which seemed to be correct. And they were very surprised that I had this knowledge, so that's why I explained them how I came to know.

So I asked if these critical people would start an open forum, which was the case. Then I asked what kind of forum it was. The teacher then intervened and told me that there were, roughly speaking two forums. One was the official forum run by the BKWSO intself, the other was the forum run by the critical people.

I responded by saying that I did not find it a severe matter if people would discuss matters concerning the BKWSO on an open forum. They told me this latter forum was a forum open to BK-adherents, BK-criticals and people related to the BKWSO in another way, for instance by being family or friends. Whereas the official BKWSO forum would be mostly for BK-adherents.

This, however, did not impress me at all, although, from their reactions it got the idea that they had expected it would do. So I continued saying that I still would find it a good idea that people were discussing about matters concerning the BKWSO.

The teacher intervened again saying that prior to the critical people's forum there was yet another forum. This other forum was shut down however. And they concentrated on a more philosophical aproach. But nevertheless it was shut down by the BKWSO because they considered it to be a threat.

I asked them why it was considered a threat. I think the main reason was because it lead to a much more severe forum.

Then Mr.Whaling said that he strongly regretted the BKWSO had closed that first preliminary critical forum because it was less agressive. People were discussing matters in a friendly way. He at least was against the action and blamed the first action to close down that preliminary forum. However the people high in the BK hierarchy decided to do so.

Then there was a discussion whether ot not the preliminary forum of the "criticals" would lead to the more agressive/ severe forum or not. Mr. Whaling grossly blamed the Seniors for their decision to close the preliminary forum down. Others, at the center argued that the preliminary forum would have evolved into a more agressive forum anyway.

I asked them why an agressive/ severe forum was such a huge problem to the BKWSO. I told them that sometimes you have to tell people things in a intense manner to get to the point.

Then other things started happening. A young student women, highly informed as well, said that the people from the critical forum tried to lure adherents away from the BK. "Do you think this is a good idea ?"

I responded that if people would leave, they did. I doubted whether a forum could cause things like this. "Yes but they reunited people with their families " she cried. I replied that I did not think this is a bad idea. After all they are family and will always stay so.

Then the teacher intervened and explained that for BK's it is important to loose all the family-ties as they are impure and distract people to worldly matters. I doubted that also.

I asked them again why this forum was such a problem to the BKWSO. Mr. Whaling threw a tantrum. "We have closed that forum once before and we will close it (being the second more severe forum) again ", he said. I asked him why. He replied : "Because they were reporting about all kind of scandals that occured within the BKWSO. They were only reporting about the bad things"

I asked him why it was such a problem to report about things that went wrong within an organisation. After all, I argued, people can learn about it. It keeps an organisation vital.

The teacher told me that scarsely there were adherents surveying the critical site but merely to learn from it and to make the organsation more effective, even though they did not believe what was being told over there. These were special indicated figures within the BKWSO and sometimes, for instance, they could prevent a targeted adherent by the "criticals" from leaving the BK nevertheless.

Mr. Whaling then told me it was not only the kind of subjects "the criticals" wrote about but also the way they did it that caused a problem. So I asked him in what kind of way they were writing. He hesitated a bit, grew confident and a bit angry and then told me the articles were written in a boulevard-tabloid kind of style, in a condescending kind of way.

The student woman said : "Don't you care about the damage that is being done by these people to the BKWSO". I replied again that I thought it wasn't a bad idea to bring matters into the open and discuss about them. Even if that would damage the BKWSO.

So I asked about what kind of matters they were concerned, 'cause that's the kind of words Mr.Whaling used as descibing the critical forum. And about that kind of matters I will tell in the next post of this thread.

Suffice to tell that Mr, Whaling told me that the writing of the "criticals" would eventualy completely tear the BKWSO apart. He told me that the "criticals" would tear at the BKWSO from all sides and that this would eventually lead to it's collapse, as well as internal factors (mainly, but not solely being corruption) that caused trouble.

But the discussion wasn't over.

Mr Whaling grew angry again, as the issue of the scandels was discussed. He told me in an angry voice : "We have shut down the forum once again and we will shut it down again. I know we can do it alltogether. You can join us too in that action".

I reminded him friendly of the fact that it hadn't worked before and that "the criticals" had only radicalised. I reminded him of the fact that he himself had said that it had been a bad act to close down the preliminary forum. "But we will do that alltogether", he replied. "We will shut it down again".

It told him to stop. "Let people have a forum to discuss matters", I said.

The BK-woman did not agree. She argued that it wasn't right what "the criticals" did. I asked her to specify that. She then told me that "the criticals" placed Murli's upon their forum, so that anyone could read it. She asked me in an upset voice whether I thought that that was a good thing to do.

I told her that I did not mind to much about that. I said it was a good thing that these Murli's would be accessable to all. But the BK-woman repelled that she and others had made a lot of efforts to retrieve all these murl's and that now others would get them effortless. I, on the other, had told them that I never understood why the Murli's weren't accessable to all. And that was it.

But all the adherents at the center disagreed and thought it was a bad idea. So then I asked who in fact were these people upon the critical second forum.

Mr. Whaling explained to me the people upon the critcal forum mainly were those who had left the BK (but not for good as he told me, and which I doubt , as said before. I think I cannot stress that enough).

Then the student-woman started to giggle. "Pink Panther" she said. She said she couldn't help herself for liking the name so much. And at least she showed to be a bit relaxed. It made her remind of the movie. She told me she liked it a lot.

I tried to follow the discussion but failed a little. I asked them why the people on the forum were talking about a movie. And I told I liked the movie of the Pink Panther as well.

"No", they told me, "Pink Panther is a name". I still did not get it. Then they explained to me that a person posting upon the critical forum called himself Pink Panter. And he has an avatar glued to his name of a small pink panther about which the student-woman was also quite amazed. "So cute, she called it".

Again I did not understood them. I asked them whether Pink Panther was an avatar, as I had learned that only Mr. Lekhray was an avatar, as far as the cult looks upon him.

"No has has got an avatar".

I did not understood so I asked them whether they regarded the individual named "Pink Panther" as an advanced person. "No", the teacher said, "he is an ordinary student, not an advanced person but the little image people glue to their name will be called an avatar."

So that's how I understood.

"Yes", Mr Whaling said. "And there is ex-l ". It is a individual living near London and running a center near London. In fact it is in the name. 'ex-l' means 'near London'. The "l" stands for London and "ex" means the person has left the BK.

"But why is the name of that person 'ex-l' where "ex" means the person has left the BKWSO even though that person is still running a center ? ", I asked.

Mr. Whaling told me that 'ex-l' even though that person was still within the BK, in the nearby future would leave the BKWSO. But he was very interested who ex-l in fact was. He told me he had some ideas about who ex-l was. What worried him was the enormous number of articles ex-l produced. He also told me that he thought that ex-l had a massive amount of BK-knowledge but 'did nothing with it' at that time, still being within the organisation.

I asked what he meant by that. Mr Whaling told me that ex-l, although having all The Knowledge, did not use that to transform. ex-l was working very hard, and the centre was always very tidy, everthing in order, but somewhere there was something missing. He also thought that ex-l on the inside felt very lonely and he said that he thought that it made ex-l work very hard while being a BK.

So then I asked whether I could not meet ex-l. "ex-l", they asked. Would you like to meet ex-l?" "Why not?", I said. The person is in a center near London. I can go there. There probably are not to many centers over there."

They wanted to know why I wanted to talk to ex-l. I replied that it was to find out why ex-l was doing the thing ex-l did; working hard although not being very satitisfied inside.

Mr. Whaling then said that it would not work. You cannot reach ex-l even if you talk to ex-l. In fact, ex-l won't even recognize the name. Mr. Whaling himself thought about going to ex-l and then in a subtly way trying to influence the person. But you, Misty, cannot he said.

"But what if you go there", I asked, "and call that person repeatedly ex-l".

"Then that person will simply tell you that is not the real surname. After a while that person will get bored, tell you there is still a lot work to do and go back to work", Mr. Whaling replied.

"You have got to let people grow in their own time, Misty", he told me.

So then I asked about Pink Panther. Mr. Whaling told me that they were pretty sure of who Pink Panther in fact really was. It was an individual from Australia and they explained where the name came from.

Mr. Whaling then explained to me that there were many others. One individual of the critical, severe forum was writing in Hindi, which caused a lot of hilarity because hardly no one could read it. But Mr. Whaling explained to me that the things that person wrote about were very severe, big scandals. He was not a BK-member but his articles touched the BK a lot. In fact Mr. Whaling was wondering why that writer wasn't touched by The Knowledge of the BKWSO instead.

Then Mr. Whaling told me details about a few others. He told me that in fact there were hunderds of them. He told me they even produced a list and would send that to the headquaters of Madhuban twice. But they stopped with that as it caused no effect.

This list of names would be about concerned people that wanted things to change. I asked the teacher if such a list would do any good at all. She replied that it was nevertheless a good thing to do, which made me wonder why because they were so adverse to "critcals". The teacher then explained that in the history of the BK, at the beginning, there were also petitions held, which at the time had a huge effect upon the Bhaibund society.

But then she showed her sinister traits again, proclaiming that by doing so, the BKWSO would immediately know who all those criticals were and anticipate on it. And they had been told in advance by Baba, so even though the shock was there, they were prepared. The second time that list was send, they were even more comfortable. And they made adherents write letters to Baba and the central management and the Seniors to tell them how happy they were to be Baba's child as a counterbalance.

So then I asked them whether the forum had no effect at all. Mr. Whaling denied that. It would have a huge effect and would reach many people. But it wouldn't stop the organisation from progressing forward. And yet it would totally rip the BK apart. But that was to be also, they said.

One thing Mr. Whaling was particually afraid of was that eventually people would place articles from that critical, evolved, more severe forum upon their facebook site's.

So that's when I asked what in fact a facebook was. They explained twice to me that it was nearly the same as a forum but that people could also place photo's upon it. And anyone could react to it, just like in any other forum. That people would talk there about everyday life.

To me that was hard to understand though right now it is common place.However they were very concerned because a forum could be closed, but articles from a facebooksite could never be removed.

But on the other hand their BK propaganda would spread as well in this way and could never be blocked nor be removed either and that was the good thing of it, to them.

Then Mr. Whaling explained to me that in fact there were a huge number of people that visited the critical 'second' site. Some things concerning the critical site were discussed as well and I will mention them shortly. I guess by now you may have discovered that it was a discussion about this current site.

Still the conversation went forwards. They discussed matters concerning the coming of Krishna and Radha.
I asked them where and when they would meet.

"Yes that's what everyone is anxious to know Misty ", Mr. Whaling said.

"They will meet in India", the student-woman said.

"Misty", I said is not my name. Why do you repetedly call me that way.

"Well maybe you like that name better. Maybe you already use the name sometimes", Mr. Whaling resumed.

I said I had no reference to that name and wondered why he called me so. And I said that I did not use it. That I had no reference to the name at all.

"Just try wearing that name for a while and maybe you will start to like it", he adviced me. Maybe you already use the name for yourself sometimes ", he suggested.

I told him it was an odd idea. Shrugged it off.

Then he told me this. "Look. What do you want to do now ? You are all alone. They are all in here, these others that you want to get to. No one supports your case. All the others that you want to see are within the BK. You cannot get to them but through us. You can meet them if you want so. We can bring you in contact with them. But they are all completely surrendered. They will only tell that you have to surrender too and study harder so you will better understand everything. Why don't you surrender completely ? Then you can stay with them if you do feel comfortable. But if you leave us and go out there, you are all alone. How will you make it out there on your own ? It will take years before they leave the BK. Will you be able to sustain youself that long ? I can tell you some more about them if you just stay a bit longer.

When I told him I was feeling inconfortable and thinking of leaving he sighed.

After that we went into meditation which was conducted by no one. And while I was meditating I was wondering. Who is Misty. Where are ex-l and Pink Panther. All they others are completely surrendered. Any critism is objected. No one inside the BK is opposing the destruction-paradigm. Even the most critical persons take that for granted... And hunderds of other thoughts passed. At that moment I did not know what to do. I felt very lonely.
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Misty

  • Posts: 88
  • Joined: 23 Jan 2013

Re: Pseudonyms

Post03 May 2015

So my pseudonym is Misty. Why did I choose that name. Well partly because some of the dynamics and what was really going on inside the BKWSO are still unclear to me, even though I think I have tried very well to get across to things. At least as well as I could. I see those dynamics as looking though a vague curtain of clouds.

Another is that I like to remain anonymous. Not a public renounced figure. If someone comes near, I pull back. Hide in the shreds of clouds. And look at you from a distance, at your heart.

I once met a preacherman who gave a lecture on postmortal communication. He told that the deceased beloved family members and other spiritual beings surround us to guide us through life. If they look at us, they see us as trough clouds. Unclear. But the one thing they see very clear is our heart. And they rejoice every time our heart is more filled with love, as it shines brighter then, yet shriver when we hate each other as the heart withers then. The quest is to make your heart shine as much and as bright as you can, he told me.

So where did the pseudonym come from ? I don't know. Mr. Whaling that told me it first, and had no doubt heard it at Madhuban. He pulled that card. At Madhuban the godspirit had channeled it. No doubt about that. I think the spirit can look quite well into the nearby future, sometimes.

Is it a post hypnotic sanskar ? Maybe. A preprogrammed self fullfilling thing ? I can live with that as well. Was I aware of this ? Maybe at unconsiuos level. Probably at consious level as well, though a little. Partly. But I cared not too much then. My mind was more observed by how the forum actually worked. And to quickly get a across to things.

But ex-l . Pink Panther and the others ? I took no part in that. They took their pseudonyms themselves. There is no self fullfilling prophecy in there. I had no influence upon their names they choose themselves
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Misty

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post03 May 2015

Sofar all I have written in this post, is about pseudonyms. But I told before I would make a connection to the Orsan Attack-thread, which I wil do, later in this post.

It all happened when I started asking questions about the forum itself and its contents. They told me it would be placed upon the second forum. (And I saw the first preliminary forum come and go while I was waiting for it to grow. And it withered as I wanted to join it)

But Mr. Whaling explained to me that on that second, more severe forum a lot of scandals were being exposed.

So I asked him what kind of scandals. Well any kind, he told me. Like kidnapping, suicide and homocide.

It was quite a shock to me. I asked about the homocide.The case explained to me was happening in a center where two people fell in love with each other. It would cause enormous problems which, at centain moment, the murderer could not handle anymore. So he killed his loved one, burned her.


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http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum//viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3213

Brahmakumari Sister Bharti was murdered and burned by another BK Haribhai and BK Rajbahan in Agra Brahmakumari Ashram.

According to police investigations, people living in the Trans Yamuna colony of Agra saw a fire in the second story of Brahmakumari Ashram so they called the police. Police investigated and found that BK Bharti had been murdered and burned in the room, then her body removed from there. Police filed murder charges on BK Haribhai, BK Rajbahan and advocate Rajesh and tried to find them for arrest but they could not find all of them, so they arrested BK Anita who was also living in that centre.

After few days, with the help of some clues, they arrested a driver named Prem Singh. The vehicle of Prem Singh was used to dispose the dead body. With his help the dead body of BK Bharti was found in poly bag near Govardhan Nala, Mathura after 20 days.

Driver Prem Singh disclosed that BK Haribhai was involved in adultery and he used BK Sisters for his immoral activities. He had a sexual relationship with BK Bharti and all the other person living in that Ashram knew this. When BK Bharti asked BK Haribhai to marry her, he refused to do so therefore BK Bharti felt cheated and had started a great quarrel with BK haribhai.

BK Haribhai then planned to get rid of BK Bharti.

Prem Singh then reported that on incident night, he was called by BK Rajbahan to bring his vehicle. When he reached there, BK Bharti was already dead and her body was wrapped in a poly bag. There were two more BK Bhais of Cuttack Ashram present there. The idea of moving the body from the Ashram, it was suggested by Advocate Rajesh, was to escape from Police because they thought if dead body could not be found by Police then it will be hard to prove murder.

The room where BK Bharti was murdered was the room where BK Bharti and BK Haribhai slept together.

Postmortem report showed that BK Bharti was burned first then murdered by hitting on the head with a heavy object.


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And it was posted before on this site :

http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum//viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1636



First reported December 31, 2003. Event happening two days before.
BRAHMKUMARI STILL UNTRACED - January 3, 2004 AGRA

A young woman from Orissa was burnt alive in the ashram for Gyan and shanti (knowledge and peace) belonging to Brahm Kumari Samaj a week ago, but the police and the intelligence agencies are still groping in the dark for the body and other relevant clues which have deliberately been cleared or concealed.

Senior police officials say they are still looking for the kingpins of the ashram who have disappeared after the crime, but a case of murder has been registered at the Etmauddaula thana. The ashram has been sealed.

Residents of the Trans Yamuna colony were shocked to hear shrieking cries, and see leaping flames that almost burnt the ashram at the dead of night. A few vehicles later arrived and carried away what looked like dead bodies, according to eye witnesses. A woman named Bharti from Orissa has since been missing. Police suspect she was burnt alive in the back yard. The police found birth control pills from her room. This has naturally given a sexual twist to the crime.

Some people at the centre believe Bharti had self-immolated herself. The Centre-in-Charges Satya Behan and Anita Behan admit Bharti is no more but they too have no idea about the dead body and who tried to clean up the whole place of vital clues. When the police reached the Ashram around 9 am after the locals informed the thana, the centre in charge told the cops that there was a fire from the stove which was put out promptly.

The headquarters of the Brahmakumari Ashram at Mount Abu have been sounded and efforts are on to sort out the murky mystery, which one ashramite said was part of the conspiracy to malign the movement.

Meanwhile, the police has recovered the white Qualis which was used for transporting the dead body to some unknown place. The driver Prem Singh and two others are still missing. The Ashram-in-charge said there was no information available about the background of the deceased. The police is either under pressure from some high quarters or is just not interested in the case. No vital breakthrough appears likely as the investigating agencies are seen dragging their feet.

Only ten days ago the big wigs of the Brahma Kumari Ashram were in Agra for the inauguration of a new centre near the Taj Mahal by UP governor Acharya Vishnu Kant Shastri.

A senior police official said on Saturday that a person called Hari was having an affair with Bharti and the two were planning to get married soon.

Since the Ashram management generally frowns on such relationship, the deceased Bharti was under mental strain for quite some time. At one stage the couple had decided to run away.

The Bharti murder case has become a challenge for the police which has so far failed to work out the case nor nab the three accued in the FIR including Hari, who have all gone underground.


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The story told at the center (in 1992) completely shocked me. I asked why the corpse was burned. Mr. Whaling told me it was to avoid identification. Then the body was dumped in the woods in a plastic bag.

It shook me again. I said that it would be found beyond doubt. Mr. Whaling told me this would indeed cause serious problems because the corpse would be identified nevertheless, despite the inflicted burning.

I told him we were talking about a murdercase, a serious crime. I asked him whether it would not shake the position of the BKWSO as a whole. He told me indeed it would. For weeks people would be out of their normal behaviour. Shockwaves would pulse though the BKWSO as a whole. Only on the outside people could maintain the facade of tranquility but inside their nerves were shaking.

I asked what would happen then, because once the corpse would be discovered it would lead those who found it, back to the BK.

Mr. Whaling told me the corpse was a problem but not much so because in India there are a lot of corrupt policeagents. People were always trying to earn a bit more money and wages were not high.

So, if I remember well, the plan was that one of the Seniors or centers in charge would go to a policeman, bribe him and then felt safe enough to lead that person to the corpse. In this manner it could be disposed off, legally, easily without a fuss.

I told them this was a murdercase and it cannot be dealed with like that. Mr. Whaling said they would nevertheless act like that anyway. He was involved in advising them to do it so, he vaguely admitted.

Then I said they must have paid an enourmous amount of money to get this done.

I think he told me they paid 150 rupees.

Then I was really bluffing and I took a risky, wild guess and told them this was an enourmous amount of money. In fact a small fortune.

They stayed silent for a while. Then the student-woman said. 150 rupees, that's the price of a bread or rather a few breads.

The teacher asked me if I knew the currencyrate between our currency and the rupee. I had to admit then that I did not. I felt embarrassed.

Mr. Whaling said it was a rather sad thing as it damaged the center where it happened. I asked if the Seniors would know about it, which was the case. They knew about it. As I asked Mr. Whaling why he was sure about this, he explained to me the Seniors at Madhuban had to know about this event because the impact was far too big for it to be ignored.

Then I asked whether the Seniors had ordered the murder, which was not so, because of the two people having a relation. That was definitevely not so. The Seniors did not even care to much as long as it was kept a secret and only hoped those two people would leave the BK in time. And the two people were about to leave and marry in secret and still the horor happened. Mr. Whaling told me it was because the 'would be bridegroom' paniced and could not controll the situation anymore as he feared things would come out to the open even though, or as they ran away. It would be a big drama -- But they did not know exactly who were involved, only that it would happen.

After a pause Mr. Whaling told me the senior in charge of that particular center would be told. They were the ones that ordered that the case would be closed by all possible means and as soon as possible. I guess that included the bribing of the policeman as well...

I asked why there were not taken any preventive measurements. Or why they did not go on beforehand to the police. Mr. Whaling told me they did not. The teacher told me there was no case cause it hadn't happened yet. I then asked why they did not put someone else in charge of the center, or shut it down as a precaution. They told me it was karma and could not be avoided and if that specific center was shut down, it would happen elsewhere.

Still I was shocked. I said that I could report it to the police if no one would or dared to do so. The student-woman then reproached me that I was accusing people of a murder that had not even happened.

And the teacher gently added that there is no law for crimes yet to be committed. Besides, she told me, Indian police-officers are so corrupt, they wouldn't even care to listen. To them bribing was comonplace.


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I did not speak for a while.

--------------------

Lateron I asked if there were even more serious crimes that would happen or if this was the ultimate horrorshow (though I did not asked them in this manner)

Mr. Whaling told me that there were even more serious things that would happen to the BKWSO. More serious regarding the fact that they would damage the BKWSO even more. He told me that this was the main concern in all these cases, that this was predominant.

I asked what he meant by that. He told me that it was of major concern that the BKWSO would pass trough these phases as swiftly and as smouthly as possible. And with the least possible damage.

He then told me that other cases were even more seriously as far as concerning the upkeeping of the good reputation of the BKWSO. One particular case was of main concern and it was circulating upon the critical second (i.e the current) site for some time. Mr. Whaling reproached the people behind the forum for that grossly. He also told me it was very damaging to the BKWSO as a whole because it took place in a develloped, Western country. Over there it is harder to bribe policemen and they would take cases more seriously. He said it would circulate for quite a while.

So I asked him what the situation was. Mr. Whaling then told me that there was set fire to a center in England. The doormat was soacked with fuel and set fire. And there was graffiti sprayed on the walls. The damage was considerable.

What made it the more bizarre was that the man who acted was partly dressed in white cloathing.

The problem was that it had happened before at another center (i.e : orson) and that they management wondered if the cases were connected. And also that they could do nothing to prevent it from happenening, nor knew who was involved.

Then there was a discussion what it meant --- i.e this second orson attack. I noticed that it was not yet clear at the time why it was done. Some thought it would be just a burglar trying to cover up his traces as he was spotted running away. Others, amongst Mr. Whaling, thought it would be more of a kind of revenge thing. He faired the meaning of the graffiti-text.

I asked why there was no surveillance done. The same answer emerged. The problem would not vanish but reappear at another center. It could not be prevented ; it was karma.

And yet now I come to answer your question, ex-l

On 29-1 in the post Orson attack ex-l wrote :

Where is there any God in that equation ?


http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum//viewtopic.php?f=19&t=3596&p=41679#p41679

I continue the story.

Then I asked how they could know about these events. Mr. Whaling told me the godspirit told about these events that were to happen, in predictions given. The godspirit told them exactly what would happen and where but not who caused it or who were involved.

Then I asked why the Godspirit told about these predictions if no measurements were taken, if they believed that those events could not be prevented. If in fact nothing was done to prevent those events.

Mr. Whaling told me that all that was done, was that people were preparing to those events, to stay calm, no matter what happenend. Damage controll.

The answer of the teacher was astonishing as well. The teacher told me that those events were narrated by the Godspirit to tell them in advance about it, so that people would not be shaking too much when they actually took place. It was done merely so that people could retain their calmness, their "royal" behaviour. And so that they would know how to handle in these cases. That was the explanation given.

She thought it was a deleightful service done by Baba to the children. It showed how much he cared for them !!

The people at the particular centers concerned would know years in advance, train day by day to be calm so that they could be utterly calm when it actually happened. She declared that Baba even gave a sort of specific manual what to do in case of that specific emergency and that it would work very well together : the manual and the specific prediction. I asked if it was a general manual but they told me it was a specific manual for each specific case.

The teacher then told me of another shocking case in which a person died in a center. The center in charge praticed for years and years in advance to maintain calm during teaching so that when it actually happened she would stand the test to perfection.

(She continued giving class after she had discovered the corpse in a spare-room and only undertook action after the class was finished. The teacher told me the godspirit wanted the center in charge to act in that way. The reason was, according to them, that the godspirit wanted her to learn that death is a natural thing. The godspirit wanted her to overcome this trauma as she had experienced it in her previous life as well and was dramatically shocked by it -- sufice it to say that I considered it utterly nonsense)

Even this event was proclaimed by the godspirit. When the center in charge where it actually would happen, consulted the godspirit-medium after some time, the godspirit told her she had prepared well. She was ready for the reallife event. The ultimate test.

So in all those cases they had years to prepare. Alas, that's the story behind it and behind (probably) many of these cases.

One last remark to finish it. Please keep in mind that all this was narrated to me in april 1992. Probaly then it starts making sense.
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Misty

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post03 May 2015

So yes I have a great deja-vu experience with some of the worst cases described here. Don't get me wrong. I feel very, very sad about them all. And I do feel very sorry for the victims involved.

At the time the situation was that I could do nothing to prevent them. There was no internet. I could reach no one. I felt completely helpless.

I argued that the cases of suicide might be prevented if professional therapy was offered or at least adviced in advance, or during the time people got depressed. They spoke against that. It was not even considered. They said the events would happen anyway and they were only concerned about the reputation of the BKWSO.

That was it. And on they went with class.

But I sat there and I realised that I wasn't doing Yoga anymore. It felt as if I was invited to take part of a corrupt and criminal organisation. A spiritual maffia-kind of organisation. An organisation that was only interested to keep business running at all coasts. No matter what.

At that meeting, I stood up and said that I could no longer tolerate all the malice that was being done and would be done. I said that I would start a campaign against the BK or at east join it. I asked who wanted to join me. There was only one woman that openly told that she was discontent but she did not wanted or dared to join me. She did not even dared to leave the BK.

Both the teacher and Mr. Whaling were very triumphantly that I stood there, all alone. They told me I would get nowhere and I had to drop it. But still I did not. I told them, time will tell. And that numbers of discontented people would grow.
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Pink Panther

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post04 May 2015

Misty,

Your posts are fascinating. You must spend a lot of time typing them, they are well written, but way toooooo long. It is quite demanding to get through them and to give the attention they deserve.

I for one would appreciate it if you kept posts brief, getting to the point quickly without need to describe every thought you had or every sentence spoken.

I asked them whether they regarded the individual named "Pink Panther" as an advanced person. "No", the teacher said, "he is an ordinary student, not an advanced person
They obviously haven’t met me otherwise they’d know about my wit, charm and good looks :-)

They are clever to work out I am from Australia, given that I have mentioned it and issues to do with Australia many times in posts!

Seriously though, I have never pretended to be ”advanced” (whatever that means) . But note how those in BK management positions do like to think of themselves and others in terms of superiority and inferiority, advanced or ordinary, more spiritual or less spiritual etc.

Is any organisation that ranks people on a 2-dimensional graph actually spiritual?

Misty, please explain your time line. You mention in extreme, almost painful, detail things that happened in 1992 with Whaling etc, then you talk about this forum and even my participation here as concurrent with those 1990s years.

The objective reality does not tally. What’s happening in your life these days? Are you OK and living a full life or are you lost in nostalgia or in melancholy for days past?
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Free Speech

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post04 May 2015

Misty, I am a little bit confused. May e you can help.

You said that
Please keep in mind that all this was narrated to me in april 1992. Probaly then it starts making sense.

And you were narrating a murder case that happened in 2004 or 28 Dec, 2003. Am I right here?
So do you mean that Mr. Whaling, in 1992, was telling you about the future events???
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ex-l

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post04 May 2015

I am too busy to read and reply to all this today, but I just wanted to say that I made many efforts, over a few years, to contact communicate with Frank Whaling via his publishers prior to him publishing his book and was brickwalled and BS-ed to. He apparently did not want to know.

Some of the above sounds a little like the events that happened at the time xBKChat forum was shut down and we started up ... but it's a little confused, eg I was already out of the BKWSU a long time.

I am wondering though if you are confusing Frank Whaling with, say, Neville Hodgkinson who is far more involved in the PR spin.

Offer to buy me a coffee and I'll speak to anyone about the BKs and our work ...
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Re: Pseudonyms

Post04 May 2015

Misty wrote:Please keep in mind that all this was narrated to me in april 1992. Probably then it starts making sense.

Misty,

This indeed would raise many questions and doubts about BK God-spirit and I am afraid may be about you too Misty.

If they knew it in advance, and to that much accuracy, how come other predictions failed? Or were they never actually made as the BKs claim? Are there different channeling energies making right and wrong predictions?
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ex-l

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post04 May 2015

Yes, this site first registered in 2006 when the xBKChat site was closed down. You are saying 1992!?!

xBKChat.com was first registered in 2003. It's administration, and the cause of its closure, was secret ... but what we heard tallies with your "group against Destruction paradigm" story.

In addition, there was an Australian discussion forum run by BKs for BKs but it was also shut down by BKs around the same time.

We were never so "anti-" BK until they allowed the spiritual whore, child neglecter, bigamist and immigration defrauder BK Hansa Raval to sue us.

That prove to us how corrupt the BK was. And I know much more about her that has not been publisher yet.

If the BKWSU had any integrity, they would have chucked her out ... but she has money and properties, so they accept her.

BK Neville Hodgkinson is on the left, BK contact soul Prof Frank Whaling is on the right. And, of course, it could have been someone else ... Whaling *was* so close to the BKs the Edinburgh BKs thought he was aBK soul, but I don't know how involved he was. Whaling book on the BK is an appalling puff piece and shamefully erroneous in its claims. BK Neville Hodgkinson is a polisher of such puff pieces.

hodgkinson-whaling.jpg
hodgkinson-whaling.jpg (8.55 KiB) Viewed 8137 times
Misty wrote:Mr. Whaling told me that 'ex-l' even though that person was still within the BK

I left in the mid-1980s and I never ran a center near London.

You may be confusing me with parts of Mr Green's story ... but, again, the times don't match.
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Re: Pseudonyms

Post05 May 2015

Both the teacher and Mr. Whaling were very triumphantly that I stood there, all alone. They told me I would get nowhere and I had to drop it. But still I did not.

Misty,

It could be that I missed some part of your long mails but I don´t understand why did they tell you all these details. Was it a part of their big "future" plot that someday you will disclose it to all of us (according to their hidden agenda or plan, perhaps coming from God spirit)? Why would they let some one, who they knew will not surrender to BKs, get all this information. That they mention ex-l and Pink Panther and the symbol of latter some 15 years before it came to existence makes this whole story at least quite thrilling. What about the 2000 Destruction prediction that Suryabhai was declaring in his talk? Was it from God spirit?

There is a lot that remains mysterious here.
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Free Speech

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post05 May 2015

kmanaveen wrote: It could be that I missed some part of your long mails but I don´t understand why did they tell you all these details.

Rightly asked. Why would any BK teacher give her details of sealed facts which are generally kept hidden from followers? Or, are you not a follower but a teacher, Misty? Or some VIP with lot to donate to BKWSU?

It appears completely misleading.

If even a bit of detail about Misty's conversation with Mr.Whaling is true, then I suspect few possibilities.

The event was narrated to Misty in advance & then it happened after a decade. It indicates that crimes are done in a very well planned manner in BKWSO. The plan was chalked out in advance & then instruction were given to execute it.

Or it could be a fake description (which actually never happened) to mislead BKs on the pretext of saving image of BKWSO by showing that everything is already decided in drama including heinous crimes as the one at Agra's center. So, there is no fault of any BK or the organisation as whole. Once this belief gets instilled in BKs' minds, they would start seeing all crimes happening/that happened within BKs centers through this theory.

A lot of mist. It's not working Misty. Kindly clarify the doubts.
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ex-l

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post05 May 2015

I don't mind long post, as long as they are clear and accurate.

Pink Panther did not join this forum until Feb 2013 ... 21 years after Misty claims to have been told about them. It's a equally a wonder that Misty could remember such a detail 21 years later as the BKs predict it.

Therefore it suggests they are sill involved with the BKs, or confused and making things up. It seems to me, they are mixing things they have read here recently with things of the long past.

An honest mistake is acceptable ... but I'd be concerned if they were deliberately confusing or distracting us, eg setting us up for criticism or discrediting.

As Pink asks ... how are you feeling now Misty and how involved are you with the BKs?
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Misty

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Post08 May 2015

Thanks for all the reactions. I will try to answer them short. Thanks for the remark Pink Panther.

First of all. I am not within the BK right now and I have no contact with them as well. I am not a VIP within that organisation. Like I told, I have even never even been to Madhuban. As I have written before, I was there in the 1990 - 1992 period. I have left them since then and have no more contact with them ever since.

Sorry that there is confusion. I tried to tell things as clear as I could. I don't feel the need to correct the above story, in that respect.

The timeline, as I see it, is that in 1992 I have heard about crimes that would take place in the times described in the articles. Predictions so to say.

At the time, I was doubting whether they would take place at all. But the discussion was there with Mr. Whaling and the teacher over there and others. They did nothing to prevent that crimes, as described.

I have heard about the first forum closing (but in 1992) as described, as well as names from people who are posting right now. Like I said I wanted to join ex-BK Chat when it was around but was too late. I saw it disappearing from the net.

Mr. Whaling was obvious trying very hard to find out "who was who". The fact that he got details wrong about ex-l was that I guess he was bluffing that he actually knew who ex-l was. But I described them as he told me.

The fact that I can relate to thise crimes is that they are decribed here in so much detail and that is thanks to the hard work that people have done.

The thing that I try to say here is that they, the BKWSO, are far more corrupt then I could imagine. That's why I am here, to tell about that. Would anyone involved in that organisation tell about it for itself?

Mr. Whaling is the man I met. I know that for sure because I first got his name wrong and named him Mr. Whale which irritated him largely. This apart from all the other things I have written elsewhere.

How I am I feeling about the time I spend there ? Well, like I told and I have exactly the same feelings as most of the people here. There is no nostalgia of the good old days, they were never there. And I lead a normal every day life. I work, have friends, travel etc.

I was also very astonished that they told all this information to me. I was a relative starter. I only attented 50 meditation sessions. I guess it was a lot of machismo from Mr. Whaling and a lot of carelessness as well.
Kmanaveen wrote:What about the 2000 Destruction prediction that Suryabhai was declaring in his talk? Was it from God spirit?

I am sorry but I have not seen that one. Can you please tell me more about that.
Free Speech wrote:The event was narrated to Misty in advance & then it happened after a decade. It indicates that crimes are done in a very well planned manner in BKWSO. The plan was chalked out in advance & then instruction were given to execute it.

They told me that the BK was not involved with the committing of the crimes but with the cover up. Mr. Whaling told me he was actally advising about the Agra center situation to make it work out better for the BKWSO. That is to give it a better outcome for them as far as covering up etc.

Oh, and about my pseudonym. That's just a name. I did not change that to show the BKWSO that no matter what label they give me I will tell about their crimes as I did. The stick to the rest I have written about it as well.

I will read about the link of ex-BK Chat
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kmanaveen

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post08 May 2015

Misty wrote:I have heard about the first forum closing (but in 1992) as described, as well as names from people who are posting right now. Like I said I wanted to join ex-BK Chat when it was around but was to late. I saw it disappearing from the net.

It's a big claim, Misty, and that too coming from an ex-BK. I wonder why BKs never revealed even a single accurate prediction (please correct me if I am wrong) in order to get better credibility to their concept, cult and god? If all what you said is true ... there must be many more "correct" predictions lying with them. I had seen some senior BKs getting embarrassed for the wrong predictions and while discussing Destruction etc, so they must be dying for a single accurate prediction which I think they never got.

Do you remember where these were coming from? Gulzar or any other medium. I am sure BKs will jump upon your revelations.

I think there is a Youtube link for an audio of Suryabahi talk where he was telling about Destruction coming in Year 2000. May be someone has the link (the talk is in Hindi I think).
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Misty

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Re: Pseudonyms

Post08 May 2015

Thank you for your reply, Kmanaveen.

You asked me if I know where the predictions came from. That unfortunately I cannot answer precisely. Mr. Whaling only told me that there were predictions being made. My guess is that the only one who can actually do this well is the Bapdada-medium. So my guess is that they come from the spirit that calls itself Shiv Baba. But look what this spirit does with that knowledge ... I think the organisation is corrupted to the bone.

As described before, my teacher Mrs. Trudy told me that people that were actually confronted heard about the situation. To be precise, she explained about the Sister going to class and who was confronted with a deceased person,
as is described above.

Please keep in mind that I don't write this all to support the BKWSO. It is written to warn against their wrongdoings. I have no intention at all to support them in any way.

For the time being right now, I will take a pause before posting again. I would like people to be able to react to this post if they choose to do so. Anyone fell free to do so.

I think it a kind of big scandal we are talking about, to my opinion.

And thank you very much kmanaveen for posting your articles. You wre a massive help with writing this one.
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